BATFE - Project Gunrunner [Archive] - Page 2

Paslode

01-20-2012, 07:34

Federal official in Arizona to plead the fifth and not answer questions on 'furious'

By William La Jeunesse

Published January 20, 2012 | FoxNews.com

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The chief of the Criminal Division of the U.S. Attorney’s Office in Arizona is refusing to testify before Congress regarding Operation Fast and Furious, the federal gun-running scandal that sent U.S. weapons to Mexico.

Patrick J. Cunningham informed the House Oversight Committee late Thursday through his attorney that he will use the Fifth Amendment protection.

Cunningham was ordered Wednesday to appear before Chairman Darrell Issa and the House Oversight Committee regarding his role in the operation that sent more than 2,000 guns to the Sinaloa Cartel. Guns from the failed operation were found at the murder scene of Border Agent Brian Terry.

The letter from Cunningham’s Washington DC attorney stunned congressional staff. Last week, Cunningham, the second highest ranking U.S. Attorney in Arizona, was scheduled to appear before Issa‘s committee voluntarily. Then, he declined and Issa issued a subpoena.

Cunningham is represented by Tobin Romero of Williams and Connolly who is a specialist in white collar crime. In the letter, he suggests witnesses from the Department of Justice in Washington, who have spoken in support of Attorney General Eric Holder, are wrong or lying.

“Department of Justice officials have reported to the Committee that my client relayed inaccurate information to the Department upon which it relied in preparing its initial response to Congress. If, as you claim, Department officials have blamed my client, they have blamed him unfairly,” the letter to Issa says.

Romero claims Cunningham did nothing wrong and acted in good faith, but the Department of Justice in Washington is making him the fall guy, claiming he failed to accurately provide the Oversight Committee with information on the execution of Fast and Furious.

"To avoid needless preparation by the Committee and its staff for a deposition next week, I am writing to advise you that my client is going to assert his constitutional privilege not to be compelled to be a witness against himself." Romero told Issa.

This schism is the first big break in what has been a unified front in the government’s defense of itself in the gun-running scandal. Cunningham claims he is a victim of a conflict between two branches of government and will not be compelled to be a witnesses against himself, and make a statement that could be later used by a grand jury or special prosecutor to indict him on criminal charges.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/01/20/federal-official-in-arizona-to-plead-fifth-and-not-answer-questions-on-furious/print#ixzz1k0NuPwlR
.

And Sipsey's take on this:

http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2012/01/finally-fifth-amendment-time-in.html

Badger52

01-20-2012, 11:03

Correspondence is one thing. I'd like to see Atty Romero make that rationale on behalf of his client on camera addressing the congress critters on the dais. Consider it the cartoon short in prelude to the next feature film to follow in Feb.
:munchin

Paslode

01-23-2012, 07:46

January 23, 2012
Boehner, Cantor press secretaries balk at calls for Holder’s resignation
By Matthew Boyle - The Daily Caller Published: 4:50 PM 01/22/2012 | Updated: 12:01 AM 01/23/2012

BALTIMORE, Md. — During a House GOP retreat in Baltimore on Friday, press secretaries for Speaker of the House John Boehner and House Majority Leader Eric Cantor balked when asked if their bosses believe Attorney General Eric Holder should resign over Operation Fast and Furious.

Sixty-three congressmen, two senators, two sitting governors and every major Republican presidential candidate have demanded Holder’s ouster over the resulting scandal. And 89 congressmen have signed a House resolution of “no confidence” in Holder as the nation’s top law enforcement officer. Between the two lists, which don’t perfectly overlap, 101 members of the House have “no confidence” in Holder, believe he should resign or both.

Though that number — 101 Congressmen — is nearly half of the 242-member Republican caucus in the House, and the surge continues to grow, the press secretaries for Boehner and Cantor refused to answer the question.

Boehner spokesman Michael Steel has ignored emails on the subject for months, but when TheDC caught up with him at the retreat and again asked if his boss thinks Holder should resign for the gunrunning operation that killed U.S. Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry and at least 300 Mexican civilians, Steel replied, “I don’t think he has said anything on that.”

TheDC followed up with Steel in the lobby of the Waterfront Marriott and asked him if he’d just ask Boehner the question. “Yeah, maybe,” Steel replied.

As of 5 p.m. on Sunday, Steel still hasn’t answered whether Boehner agrees with the 101 members in the House GOP caucus about Holder. Instead, Steel said, “The speaker appreciates the hard work that Chairman Issa and many others have done to expose this scandal. President Obama’s Department of Justice needs to be accountable.”

Cantor’s press secretary, Laena Fallon, deflected questions in a similar way, telling TheDC that Cantor “doesn’t sign onto legislation, as a rule, as majority leader”

Fallon was referencing House Resolution 490, the bill that expresses “no confidence” in Holder because of Fast and Furious. When asked if Cantor agreed “with the concept,” Fallon replied, “I don’t know.”

TheDC: Can you ask him for me?
FALLON: I’ll see, he’s in meetings.
TheDC: I can take an answer whenever. It’s just a “yes” or “no.”
FALLON: I’ll ask and see if I can get you something, but I don’t know what he’ll say.”

By Sunday at 5 p.m., Fallon has still not responded.

Fast and Furious was a program of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, overseen by Holder’s DOJ. It sent thousands of weapons to Mexican drug cartels via straw purchasers — people who legally purchased guns in the United States with the known intention of illegally trafficking them somewhere else.

At least 300 people in Mexico were killed with Fast and Furious weapons, as was Border Patrol agent Brian Terry. The identities of the Mexican victims are unknown. Allegations have surfaced that U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agent Jaime Zapata was also killed with Fast and Furious weapons.

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/01/22/boehner-cantor-press-secretaries-balk-at-calls-for-holder%e2%80%99s-resignation/#ixzz1kHxrla9I

http://dailycaller.com/2012/01/22/boehner-cantor-press-secretaries-balk-at-calls-for-holder%E2%80%99s-resignation/

Badger52

02-01-2012, 10:31

Issa threatens contempt charge against Holder if Justice fails to comply with Fast and Furious subpoenas
By William Lajeunesse

Published January 31, 2012
The head of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee is threatening to hold Attorney General Eric Holder in contempt of Congress if he fails to comply with congressional subpoenas for documents.

Holder has until Feb. 9 to comply.

In a four-page letter to Holder, Committee Chairman Darrell Issa, R-Calif., claims the Department of Justice has "misrepresented facts and misled Congress," which began its investigation of Operation Fast and Furious one year ago.

Issa claims Holder's "actions lead us to conclude that the department is actively engaged in a cover-up" because it refuses to comply with previous subpoenas.

Rest of the FoxNews story here. (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/01/31/issa-threatens-contempt-charge-against-holder-if-justice-fails-to-comply-with/)

Badger52

02-02-2012, 11:00

afchic

02-02-2012, 12:16

some can say he's simply incompetent to hold such an office. Fine.

I just think he's a pathological liar of the first order on top of that; no surprise at THIS (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/02/02/holder-says-no-one-punished-yet-during-testimony-on-controversial-fast-and/).

If you think that is true, then you will love this!!!
http://dailycaller.com/2012/02/01/bribery-compromised-officials-leave-indicted-financial-crime-suspects-free-from-prosecution-under-holders-doj/

Badger52

02-03-2012, 07:09

If you think that is true, then you will love this!!!
http://dailycaller.com/2012/02/01/bribery-compromised-officials-leave-indicted-financial-crime-suspects-free-from-prosecution-under-holders-doj/Thanks for the additional hit-parade.
;)

Given the AG sign-off on those operations why would anyone think that he had no SA about gunwalking opns?

If I were to play armchair pshrink I'd say that, in another time & place, their whole crew would still like to go around in the middle of the night with their pangas, putting "the chop" to the evil landed gentry (who by their color and Holder's definition can't be victims of a hate-crime).

November 2012, get it done.

Paslode

02-08-2012, 09:02

More remarkable words from Holder during his F&F appearance last week before the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee

This administration has consistently favored the reinstitution of the assault weapons ban. It is something that we think was useful in the past with regard to the reduction that we’ve seen in crime, and certainly would have a positive impact on our relationship and the crime situation in Mexico.

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2012/02/08/holder-tells-congress-the-obama-administration-wants-to-ban-guns/#ixzz1lnpTMZlo

Badger52

02-08-2012, 09:18

More remarkable words from Holder...

Yost, Pete (November 19, 2008 Associated Press, archived article unavailable):

"Holder has expressed some regret over his handling of the Rich pardon, stating "I wish I had done some things differently with regard to the Marc Rich matter. Specifically, I wish that I had ensured that the Department of Justice was more fully informed and involved in this pardon process", and called his own actions a "mistake"."

Yep. Professionally, intentionally, and conveniently ignorant. He will always have a chair when the music stops because it's epoxied to his ass.

Streck-Fu

02-08-2012, 20:56

Gunrunner or Fast & Furious fall guy?

Is this the latest: LINK (http://www.fbi.gov/elpaso/press-releases/2010/ep082410.htm)

United States Attorney John E. Murphy announced that in El Paso this morning, former Federal Bureau of Investigation Special Agent John Shipley was sentenced to two years in federal prison for violating federal firearms laws.

Senior United States District Judge David Briones also ordered that Shipley be placed under supervised release for a period of three years and complete 250 hours of community service after completing his prison term. Judge Briones also ordered that Shipley forfeit 17 firearms including two .50 caliber Barrett rifles; ammunition in various calibers including over 2,800 rounds of .50 caliber ammunition; one silencer; and, $7,340 in cash seized during the execution of a federal search warrant at Shipley’s residence on May 6, 2008.

“Federal agents are not exempt from the laws which they swore to uphold,” stated United States Attorney John E. Murphy. “Mr. Shipley is being held accountable for his own criminal actions. They are in no way a reflection of the outstanding work being accomplished by dedicated federal, state and local law enforcement across this District and this country.”

This investigation—conducted by agents from the U.S. Department of Justice Office of the Inspector General together with agents from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives—commenced with a firearms trace of a .50 caliber sniper rifle sold by Shipley. That rifle was recovered by Mexican authorities following a gunbattle between suspected narcotraffickers and the Mexican military near Chihuahua, Mexico, on March 8, 2008.

“By illegally dealing in firearms, Shipley violated the trust that the public placed in him as a law enforcement official,” said Wayne D. Beaman, Special Agent in Charge, Dallas Field Office, Department of Justice Office of the Inspector General. “The Office of the Inspector General is committed to vigorously investigating and referring for prosecution any Department of Justice law enforcement official who engages in this type of illegal conduct.”

“This investigation shows ATF's commitment into stopping the illegal trafficking of firearms that are fueling the cartel violence south of the border. Along with our associates on both sides of the border, ATF will leave no stone unturned in achieving this goal,” stated ATF Special Agent in Charge Robert Champion, Dallas Field Division.

On April 14, 2010, a federal jury convicted Shipley of one count of dealing firearms without a license, four counts of causing a firearms dealer to maintain false records and one count of making a false statement to federal authorities. Jurors found that Shipley engaged in the business of dealing in firearms from January 2005 until May 2008, while not being licensed as a federal firearms dealer. Evidence presented during trial revealed that Shipley posted firearms for sale using an Internet website more than 200 times, including multiple postings for many firearms. During that three-and-a-half-year time period, Shipley also purchased at least 54 firearms, then sold at least 51 of those firearms for more than $118,000.

Jurors also found that on four occasions between July 2007 and May 2008, Shipley provided false information on ATF forms 4473 when purchasing firearms at local gun shops stating that he was the actual buyer, when in fact, he was not.

Finally, jurors found that on March 21, 2008, Shipley provided to federal authorities a document—a Dealers’ Firearms Record Book—which Shipley claimed was his only complete and accurate listing of the firearms he bought and sold, knowing that he had another Dealers’ Firearms Record Book which contained a more extensive descriptive and accurate list of firearms he bought and sold.

Assistant United States Attorney Greg McDonald and Juanita Fielden prosecuted this case on behalf of the government.

Badger52

02-09-2012, 07:35

Gunrunner or Fast & Furious fall guy?

Is this the latest:Older case finalized in 2010; this one shook out as someone simply looking, feeling & acting like a dealer who wasn't, going for his own pocketbook (online auctions, et al). He kept two different "bound books" as they're known by. Naturally prosecutors love it when it when stupid criminals keep records.

The primary issues, in my view, that separate the current debacle with previous well-documented efforts to interdict straw buyers headed south of the border, remain:

ATF senior leadership assertively calling well-meaning ATF field agents OFF of the continuous surveillance of straw guns and consciously letting them walk. ATF field operatives have said it's ingrained that if 24/7 surveillance was ever in jeopardy they'd arrest rather than let the gun walk. ATF leadership made decisions to terminate that surveillance even when it was already in progress following a sale.

ATF senior leadership acknowledging in documents that walking guns found in Mexico would support their efforts to push forward more draconian gun-control laws, not coincidentally on the heels of the assertion by new SECSTATE Hillary in Meh-Hee-Ko with the Mexican president that the majority of guns used in Mexican crime were coming from US.

DoJ at the most senior levels displaying either indifference or explicit approval to the F&F practice (CYA time), and/or being completely ignorant of hugely important ongoing multi-national operations that have big diplomatic ramifications.

It's time to re-jet the burner for maximum blue flame. Timing is politically important as well. Nixon proved that you can have the shingles coming off the cardhouse and still get re-elected.

Paslode

03-19-2012, 12:56

This debacle gets stupider with each and every story.

latimes.com
Gun-tracking operation caught top suspect, then let him go
Federal agents stopped the main target of the ill-fated Operation Fast and Furious in May 2010. After they questioned him, he disappeared back into Mexico, and the program went on to spiral out of control.

By Richard A. Serrano, Washington Bureau

March 19, 2012

Reporting from Washington
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Seven months after federal agents began the ill-fated Fast and Furious gun-tracking operation, they stumbled upon their main suspect in a remote Arizona outpost on the Mexican border, driving an old BMW with 74 rounds of ammunition and nine cellphones hidden inside.

Detained for questioning that day in May 2010, Manuel Fabian Celis-Acosta described to agents from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives his close association with a top Mexican drug cartel member, according to documents obtained this weekend by the Times/Tribune Washington Bureau.

The top Fast and Furious investigator, Special Agent Hope MacAllister, scribbled her phone number on a $10 bill after he pledged to cooperate and keep in touch with investigators.

Then Celis-Acosta disappeared into Mexico. He never called.

Had they arrested him red-handed trying to smuggle ammunition into Mexico, Fast and Furious might have ended quickly. Instead, the program dragged on for another eight months, spiraling out of control.

Celis-Acosta continued slipping back and forth across the border, authorities say, illegally purchasing more U.S. weapons and financing others. He was not arrested until February 2011, a month after Fast and Furious closed down.

The operation, run by the ATF's Phoenix field office, allowed illegal gun purchases in Arizona in hopes of tracking the weapons to Mexican drug cartel leaders. Instead, about 1,700 guns vanished, and scores turned up at crime scenes in Mexico. Two were found south of Tucson where U.S. Border Patrol agent Brian Terry was shot to death in December 2010.

Why ATF agents did not arrest Celis-Acosta immediately is not clear. He was their prime suspect and the subject of secret wiretaps approved by the Justice Department.

"Due to the fact that the criminal case is still ongoing in the courts, and the inspector general's office is still investigating, we cannot comment about this," ATF chief spokesman Drew Wade said.

Other law enforcement officials, speaking anonymously because of ongoing investigations, acknowledged it was a crucial blunder in a deeply flawed program. "I don't know why they didn't arrest him," one said. "They certainly could have."

But, another argued, agents may have viewed Celis-Acosta as a possible conduit to the cartels. "He was cooperating and talking a lot and giving up a lot," he said. "From an investigative standpoint, that's pretty good information you're getting. Maybe he can hook you into even bigger fish."

Fast and Furious, which is under investigation by the Justice Department's inspector general, Rep. Darrell Issa (R-Vista) and Sen. Charles E. Grassley (R-Iowa), began Oct. 31, 2009. From the start, Celis-Acosta, 24, was the main target, according to internal ATF documents that have not been publicly released. An ATF flow chart listed him at the top of more than two dozen individuals involved in the gun-smuggling ring.

The documents state that Celis-Acosta led the smuggling ring and that he was paid from drug proceeds to illegally acquire firearms for cartels. He carried a permanent U.S. resident card, a Social Security number and an Arizona driver's license. He moved easily between homes in Mexico and Phoenix. Eventually arrested by U.S. marshals at a relative's home in El Paso, he pleaded not guilty to gun-smuggling charges as one of 19 Fast and Furious defendants. None of the 19 has gone to trial.

According to an ATF "Report of Investigation," prepared by MacAllister, authorized by her supervisor, David J. Voth, and reviewed by William D. Newell, then the ATF special agent in charge in Arizona, U.S. authorities stopped Celis-Acosta as he headed south through the border town of Lukeville, Ariz.

The document said an ammunition magazine containing 74 rounds was hidden in a spare tire, and the phones in the dash. In the trunk of the 2002 BMW 754i was a ledger referring to money given to "Killer" and a list of firearms.

Celis-Acosta first said he did not know the ammunition was inside. He said a friend's mother bought the BMW "with a credit card."

MacAllister was called to the scene, and Celis-Acosta began to open up. He admitted he knew "a lot about firearms." He conceded he was en route to a birthday party for "Chendi," a close associate who he said was a Mexican cartel member and "right-hand man" to Joaquin "Chapo" Guzman, head of the Sinaloa cartel.

Celis-Acosta said Chendi moved 6,000 pounds of marijuana a week into the U.S., terrorized Mexican police, wore a $15,000 wristwatch and lived in a home with "a lot of gold" inside and a landing strip outside.

MacAllister checked with the Drug Enforcement Administration and learned Chendi — real name Claudio Jamie Badilla — was a "large-scale marijuana and multi-kilogram cocaine trafficker."

MacAllister asked Celis-Acosta whether he "would be willing to cooperate." When he said yes, they confiscated the ammunition and let him go.

richard.serrano@latimes.com

Copyright © 2012, Los Angeles Times

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-fast-furious-20120319,0,3662110.story

Badger52

04-27-2012, 13:47

LINK (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/04/27/issa-chaffetz-confirm-contempt-plans-for-holder-over-fast-and-furious/as-oblivious-to-crying-son-after-foul-ball/)

Issa, Chaffetz confirm contempt plans for Holder over Fast and Furious

Published April 27, 2012
FoxNews.com

House GOP leaders said Friday they are pursuing a plan to hold Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. and the Justice Department in contempt for “stonewalling” them over information regarding the administration’s failed Fast and Furious gun-tracking program.

GOP Rep. Darrell Issa confirmed to Fox News that House Speaker John Boehner gave him and others on his House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform the authority to drafted a contempt of Congress resolution.

“We have a few other options (but) to a great extent we’ve been stonewalled by the Justice Department,” said Issa, R-Calif.

The news of the document and the extended meeting in Boehner’s office was reported first by The Los Angeles Times.

“We have issued a subpoena,” Utah GOP Rep. Jason Chaffetz, a member of the oversight committee, said earlier on Fox News. “We have bent over backwards to be patient and take time. (Holder) is leading us down a path where we have no other choice.”

The resolution, if approved by the GOP-led House, could force Holder to release thousands of pages of documents* related to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives’ program.

* What if he says no...? Play that tape to the end.

Dusty

04-27-2012, 14:20

BOfH

05-03-2012, 15:00

Yeah, don't pay any attention to that. That's a Fox News article. :rolleyes:

And they're off...

http://dailycaller.com/2012/05/03/house-gop-releases-draft-of-contempt-of-congress-citation-for-eric-holder-over-fast-and-furious/

House oversight committee chairman Rep. Darrell Issa has taken the first formal step in holding Attorney General Eric Holder in contempt of Congress over Operation Fast and Furious.

On Thursday, Issa distributed a both briefing paper laying out the case for holding the Attorney General in contempt and a lengthy draft of the contempt citation to Democrats and Republicans on his House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform.

snip

Stargazer

05-18-2012, 12:49

Another chance for the Executive Branch to be forthcoming.... what a tangled web they weave...

http://www.speaker.gov/sites/speaker.house.gov/files/documents/12-05-18_dojletter.pdf

Dusty

06-11-2012, 08:40

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-57450110-503544/house-committee-schedules-contempt-vote-against-holder/?tag=cbsnewsMainColumnArea

(CBS News) CBS News has learned the House Oversight Committee will vote next week on whether to hold Attorney General Eric Holder in contempt of Congress. It's the fourth time in 30 years that Congress has launched a contempt action against an executive branch member.

This time, the dispute stems from Holder failing to turn over documents subpoenaed on October 12, 2011 in the Fast and Furious "gunwalking" investigation.

The Justice Department has maintained it has cooperated fully with the congressional investigation, turning over tens of thousands of documents and having Holder testify to Congress on the topic at least eight times.

However, Rep. Darrell Issa, R-Calif., says the Justice Department has refused to turn over tens of thousands of pages of documents. Those include materials created after Feb. 4, 2011, when the Justice Department wrote a letter to Congress saying no gunwalking had occurred. The Justice Department later retracted the denial.

"The Obama Administration has not asserted Executive Privilege or any other valid privilege over these materials and it is unacceptable that the Department of Justice refuses to produce them. These documents pertain to Operation Fast and Furious, the claims of whistleblowers, and why it took the Department nearly a year to retract false denials of reckless tactics," Issa wrote in an announcement of the vote to be released shortly. It will reveal the vote is scheduled for Wednesday, June 20.

Issa says the Justice Department can still put a stop to the contempt process at any time by turning over the subpoenaed documents.

If the House Oversight Committee approves the contempt citation, the matter would likely be scheduled for a full House vote.

For several weeks, there has been closed-door discussions and debate among House Republicans as to whether to move forward with contempt. Some have expressed concern that it could distract from the Republican's focus on the economy in this election year.

Led by Republicans Senator Charles Grassley, R-Iowa, and Issa, Congress' investigation into Fast and Furious is now in its second year. In the ATF operation, agents allowed thousands of weapons to "walk" into the hands of Mexican drug cartels in the hope it would somehow help ATF take down a major cartel. Some of the weapons were used in the murder of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry at the hands of illegal immigrants crossing into Arizona. Mexican press reports say hundreds of Mexicans have died at the hands of the trafficked weapons. The story was exposed nationally for the first time by CBS News in February 2011.

Democrats on the House Oversight Committee have called the Republicans' move to find Holder in contempt a politically-motivated "witch hunt."

In 1983, Congress found EPA administrator Anne Gorsuch Burford in contempt for failing to produce subpoenaed documents.

In 1998, the GOP-controlled House Oversight committee found Attorney General Janet Reno in contempt for failing to comply with a subpoena on campaign finance law violations.

In 2008, the Democratic-led House Oversight Committee found former White House counsel Harriet Miers and Chief of Staff John Bolton in contempt for failing to cooperate with an inquiry into whether a purge of federal prosecutors by the Bush administration was politically motivated.

Congress went to federal court to seek enforcement of that contempt action, but a compromise was reached with the Executive Branch before any court decision was final.

Snip

greenberetTFS

06-11-2012, 09:01

What's the problem here guys,sounds like you don't trust Eric to do the right thing..........:rolleyes::(

Big Teddy :munchin

Badger52

06-11-2012, 12:55

What's the problem here guys,sounds like you don't trust Eric to do the right thing..........:rolleyes::(

Big Teddy :munchinI'm shocked you'd suggest such a thing! :D

By November it's either academic, or he'll be expendable and allowed to depart gracefully when his boss gets the 2nd term, for personal reasons and with thanks for his tireless service. We'll see shortly who's got the huevos and who doesn't. Issa's got the watch but Holder has the time.

Sarski

06-11-2012, 13:25

Contempt today, destruction of evidence tomorrow.

Badger52

06-13-2012, 13:14

Contempt today, destruction of evidence tomorrow.I thought I gave you everything, Senator (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/13/grassley-open-to-negotiating-with-holder-over-contempt-push-but-sets-high-bar/)

The report linked above contains more potential pukin' smileys than a post would allow anyway. Suffice to say it's replete with... aw, hell, the Stasi chief will worm away, nothing to see here, etc.
"I am prepared to make compromises with regard to the documents that can be made available," Holder said. You mean the documents you said you already furnished, Erich?
:rolleyes:

Dusty

06-14-2012, 13:38

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/14/house-dems-mount-holder-defense-as-republicans-pursue-contempt-vote/

Paslode

06-14-2012, 13:51

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/14/house-dems-mount-holder-defense-as-republicans-pursue-contempt-vote/

Probably a stall tactic.

glebo

06-14-2012, 13:52

Probably a stall tactic.

they're oiling up the shredders as we speak...

Paslode

06-14-2012, 14:31

they're oiling up the shredders as we speak...

And probably buying extra cases of wide tipped felt markers.

JimP

06-14-2012, 14:33

Richard

06-14-2012, 14:50

Contempt today, destruction of evidence tomorrow.

Shades of 1972 - such shenanigans over serious misbehavior brought down one administration, maybe we'll see another in our lifetime...;)

And so it goes...

Richard :munchin

Dusty

06-14-2012, 15:29

they're oiling up the shredders as we speak...

As a former Master Shredder, I guarantee the good stuff was gone before the offer was made.

MR2

06-14-2012, 16:14

Probably a stall tactic.

Sorry officer, I didn't see the stop sign (again) and I promise that after 12 months of warnings I'll actually stop this time.

Shades of 1972 - such shenanigans over serious misbehavior brought down one administration, maybe we'll see another in our lifetime.

This administration will be nothing but a putrid nightmare on this country's history come November; which will be well before this lame congress will actually do something.

Toaster

06-14-2012, 17:02

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/14/house-dems-mount-holder-defense-as-republicans-pursue-contempt-vote/

I'm noticing the word "negotiate" thrown around a lot... There should be no "negotiating", if you are the manager or officer for something, and you are called to give account, you simply show your books and affairs. You don't try to negotiate. People attempt to negotiate when they're pretty much cooked.

Besides why should the federal government be trying to negotiate between the branches?

On a brighter note, I'd love to see Dave Chapelle do an Eric Holder skit before the House,
"Well what had happened was..."

Paslode

06-14-2012, 17:53

Don't forget this is the piece of filth that represented Muj PRO BONO at his law firm before he was appointed AG. He's a disgusting, worm-ridden syphletic pus-nodule. I'd say what I really think but that would be impolite.

Holder has his hands in many other controversial cases besides the matter of the Muj....my short list KSM, Eliyan Gonzales, Mark Rich, WACO, Ruby Ridge, OKC...and those guys that were hanging out at the polls a few years ago.

As a former Master Shredder, I guarantee the good stuff was gone before the offer was made.

Likely including Obama's personal records.

Besides why should the federal government be trying to negotiate between the branches?

It's the I'll show you mine, if you show me yours and I won't tell game.......None of them are clean, they all have shit on on there noses and they have all taken it up the ass for the team and/or personal gain.

But moving the rock pile from here to there over and over (i.e. Looking Busy and Productive) plays well to the sheeple watching the MSM.

Badger52

06-14-2012, 18:31

Holder didn't start budging at all until enough folks were calling "No Stones" Boehner to task. Once the Speaker decided to dig his tread-worn sneakers into the sand, perhaps Erich realized that:

a. as was said above sufficient stuff has been flushed (and where's Fawn Hall when you need a CSPAN change of pace?).
b. It's now time to move to stalling action 3 (of 186).

Sarski

06-14-2012, 22:41

Shades of 1972 - such shenanigans over serious misbehavior brought down one administration, maybe we'll see another in our lifetime...;)

And so it goes...

Richard :munchin

And as the media reports and the continued focus is on ATTY GEN Holder, there seems to be little focus on Border Patrol Agent Terry; as though that has already been sweapt under the rug. RIP Agent Terry. :mad:

Pericles

06-15-2012, 15:06

Michelle

06-15-2012, 15:55

Now it gets really interesting:

http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2012/06/sipsey-street-exclusive-investigators.html

Holder does not have to worry about anything - sure to have a Presidential pardon already lined up.

That opens up a huge new can of worms if true.

Napolitano has some difficult days ahead of her if that proves to be accurate. All of a sudden the concept of the ambush of ICE agent Zapata being "random" becomes questionable.

m1

BigJimCalhoun

06-15-2012, 18:14

Makes one wonder if the cartel received "a tip".

Badger52

06-20-2012, 05:48

LINK (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/20/holder-issa-set-for-critical-meeting-on-fast-and-furious-documents-contempt/) and leading extract:

GOP Rep. Darrell Issa said his face-to-face meeting Tuesday with Attorney General Eric Holder failed to produce the documents requested for the congressional investigation into the Justice Department’s botched Fast and Furious gun walking operation and suggested he needs them by Wednesday morning to stop a scheduled vote to put Holder in contempt of Congress.

Issa told reporters after the roughly 20-minute meeting that Holder instead briefed them on the documents in lieu of delivering them. And he suggested he might delay the contempt vote, called for because Holder and the department have not responded to two subpoenas requesting additional information.

“The deadline will always move to the last minute,” said Issa, chairman of the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform. “We're not looking to hold people responsible. We're looking for document production.”
WTF, over.

Paslode

06-20-2012, 06:20

WTF, over.

HINT:

Like the sands through the hour glass, so are the days of our lives.

:munchin

Dusty

06-20-2012, 08:10

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/attorney-general-asks-white-house-to-exert-executive-privilege-over-fast-and-furious-documents/2012/06/20/gJQABd4EqV_story.html

PedOncoDoc

06-20-2012, 08:19

Where's a no-knock warrant when you need one? :mad:

Streck-Fu

06-20-2012, 08:33

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/attorney-general-asks-white-house-to-exert-executive-privilege-over-fast-and-furious-documents/2012/06/20/gJQABd4EqV_story.html

Granted: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/20/house-republicans-tee-up-imminent-contempt-vote-against-holder/

Since this was a local opperation, as asserted by Holder, and Obama knew nothing about it, as Obama asserted, how does Executive Privlege apply....if it doesn't involve The Executive?

Oldrotorhead

06-20-2012, 08:54

Dickey Nixon and Jimmy Carter must have been this President's role models.

Dusty

06-20-2012, 09:09

This is gonna make Watergate look like a traffic report. :lifter

MR2

06-20-2012, 09:24

FLASHBACK 2007: Obama Attacked Trying "To Hide Behind Executive Privilege (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpwYh9TD6Nc&feature=youtu.be)"

Obama in 2007 told CNN that Executive Privilege was not a good reason to with hold information from Congress.

Badger52

06-20-2012, 09:26

Since this was a local opperation, as asserted by Holder, and Obama knew nothing about it, as Obama asserted, how does Executive Privlege apply....if it doesn't involve The Executive?Apparently 'executive' means the entire Executive Branch of government. You know, those things (pre-campaign) "under the radar" that were never briefed, kept in files that don't exist, the location of which can't be confirmed.

Frankly, at this point I'd still be concerned about some of the field agents that have already come forth, that the DoJ might be concerned enough to consider them "on suicide watch."

Badger52

06-20-2012, 09:36

This is gonna make Watergate look like a traffic report. :lifterI certainly hope so. My $.02, Issa needs to, within media dealings anyway, pull the stick back on his target fixation with Holder and reaffirm the message that:

- Straw purchase stings have existed for a long time but the difference is that field agents were specifically, in real-time, directed to back off their surveillance of the weapons and let them walk.
- Field agents repeatedly expressed appalled concern that eventually Mexican civilians would be murdered and, further, eventually a brother officer would become a victim as well. (both have come to pass)

... then 15 minutes later he can return to the pissin' contest over Holder if he wants.

But the WHY needs to get to the American electorate RFN.

BOfH

06-20-2012, 10:04

Granted: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/20/house-republicans-tee-up-imminent-contempt-vote-against-holder/

Since this was a local opperation, as asserted by Holder, and Obama knew nothing about it, as Obama asserted, how does Executive Privlege apply....if it doesn't involve The Executive?

Oh but it does. Which confirms what we already knew: Fast and Furious was to be the straw man for more gun control, and Obama was in on it since 'under the radar'. :(

rdret1

06-20-2012, 10:09

This is the most corrupt administration in recent memory! If I am wrong, someone tell me which one was more so. What really gets me is BHO's campaign promise of being so transparent. He has kept everything secret other than what was supposed to be kept secret, then they have leaked that with wild abandon!

JJ_BPK

06-20-2012, 10:15

This interpretation is what I thought defined "executive privilege" ??

Judge Napolitano on ‘Fast and Furious’ Documents: Executive Privilege Only Applies If the President Was Personally Involved

This morning, the White House asserted executive privilege over documents related to Operation ‘Fast and Furious,’ per Attorney General Eric Holder’s request. Following this move, Judge Napolitano warned that we may be on the “precipice of a constitutional confrontation between the executive branch, the White House, and the Congress.”

Executive privilege, in its definition, provides protection over communications with the president himself, according to the judge. The letter sent by Eric Holder requesting executive privilege does not detail a discussion with the president, but Judge Napolitano said, “The implication is there.”

“If the attorney general sat down and discussed it with the president, he probably doesn’t want the Congress and the public to know that,” Napolitano said.

Napolitano also said that executive privilege only pertains to “military, diplomatic and sensitive national security matters.”

"Now, was fighting the drug gangs at the border a sensitive national security matter? And, if so was the President of the United States of America personally involved in making decisions as to how to conduct that fight? If that’s the case, this has reached a different level and we now know why the attorney general has ferociously defended these documents,” Napolitano said.

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2012/06/20/judge-napolitano-on-fast-and-furious-documents-executive-privilege-only-applies-if-the-president-was-personally-involved/

Badger52

06-20-2012, 10:24

Which confirms what we already knew: Fast and Furious was to be the straw man for more gun control, and Obama was in on it since 'under the radar'. :(I think they did a fine job force-feeding SECSTATE so she could stand up with the MexPrez during her very first visit and proclaim what an evil, gun-running place we are - just what they wanted her to say. That must've produced a 'tingle' down their collective leg.

Streck-Fu

06-20-2012, 10:49

The offer from Holder on the release of the documents was conditional that such a release would end the investigation. That is not an 'extraordinary offer'....it is attempt to an out.

LINK (http://www.desmoinesregister.com/viewart/20120620/NEWS09/120620005/Obama-asserts-executive-privilege-Fast-Furious-)

Issa spokesman Frederick Hill said that at the meeting, "the attorney general indicated he would only be willing to produce a subset of documents that numbered fewer than 1,300 pages if the committee would first agree that the production of these documents would end the committee's investigation of the Justice Department."

Destrier

06-20-2012, 11:14

Executive privilege? Either the Executive Branch did not know about fast and furious. Which many witness's testified too; and executive privilege does not apply. Or, the executive branch knew about fast and furious and is now claiming executive privilege.

They all need to be fired.

Badger52

06-20-2012, 11:55

Holder, in his letter to Obama requesting he assert executive privilege, said those documents pertain to the "deliberative process" on how to respond to congressional and media inquiries. "Deliberative process" (about something that one side allegedly knew nothing about in the first place) = "our discussions about how the hell we deflect/evade/safely lie and, if necessary, kick someone else to the curb."

But they're probably aware that most Americans have a short memory.

T-Rock

06-20-2012, 13:59

This is the most corrupt administration in recent memory!

Carter was a freaking Prince among Men compared to BHO and this incompetent Administration.... :(

tonyz

06-20-2012, 17:20

Where's a no-knock warrant when you need one? :mad:

Made my day - thanks.

:lifter

The Reaper

06-20-2012, 19:58

I'm just waiting for Holder and the POTUS to start arguing what the definition of "is" is.

TR

MR2

06-20-2012, 22:00

I'm just waiting for Holder and the POTUS to start arguing what the definition of "is" is.

TR

I'm just waiting for Mr. Holder to get a good look under the bus...

BrokenSwitch

06-20-2012, 22:50

Votes are in...

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/committee-votes-hold-eric-holder-contempt-over-fast-202646073.html

Mycroft

06-21-2012, 10:30

Vote was right along party lines. Expected from the committee, sadly. House vote next week may end up determining the fate of Holder and Obama.

Badger52

06-21-2012, 12:27

Meeting to meeting & quick bite but Megyn Kelly just had the prez of the National Border Patrol Council (McCubbin, their union) on camera representing all their officers and, in very few words, summarizing their reasons for calling for Holder's immediate resignation. Said they'd hoped it would play out properly, and have been silent till now, but:

- Holder has shifted or denied blame
- Holder has failed to take any accountability as "top cop" and,
- the Terry Family has yet to hear a word from him in terms of either solace or an apology.

McCubbin was of few words, but a decision articulated well to Ms. Kelly.

Aggreeing with a union; writing this down in my "I'll-Be-Damned book.

SMP9168

06-21-2012, 21:45

Ret10Echo

06-22-2012, 02:00

D-MD

In today's political environment.....THAT is all that matters to them.

Stargazer

06-22-2012, 07:38

"This committee has a job to do. The Justice Department has a job to do. And some kind of way, we have to find a way, as the adults in all of this, to make that happen and make it work.
And I am very serious about that. You know, life is short. And I tell my staff that every day I look in the mirror and I face my own mortality. And the question is, how can I be most effective and efficient? And when we do this ring-around-the-rosy stuff, what happens is that none of us are effective.
And you heard me make a commitment to that lady, Ms. Terry, I shall not rest until everybody involved in this process—and I mean that—I shall not rest until all of that is addressed."

- Rep Elijah Cummings D-MD June 15th, 2011

Hmmmm, guess he changed his mind.

I listened to the entire hearing on c-span and it was nauseating (not that I expected it to be otherwise). I could identify within the first 5 seconds what party they represented. Jackie Speier (CA) must be taking the same supplements as Pelosi when calling ATF agents cowboys and accusing them of not working with higher ups in DOJ... I was thinking, what planet are you on... isn't that part of what is trying to be determined is how far UP in the DOJ and Adm. were aware...

Dusty

06-22-2012, 08:40

Democrats are the old "pinkos".

Badger52

06-22-2012, 10:46

Democrats are the old "pinkos".That's an accurate perception & true in most cases. My Mom described for me one time what led her to change party "tendencies" post-WWII, story sounds similar to Pres. Reagan's. She became a black-sheep within a huge, mostly cotton-farming/small-biz family, on that topic anyway. But the fact remained, the Democratic party of my depression-era parents was a completely different animal pre-FDR and Uncle Joe's influence.

Peregrino

06-22-2012, 18:00

----- the Democratic party of my depression-era parents was a completely different animal pre-FDR and Uncle Joe's influence.

Would that by any chance be a reference to Mr. Stalin? :munchin

FWIW - the only "Fast and Furious" I'm seeing now is the tap dancing DOJ and the Dems are doing. :mad:

Badger52

06-22-2012, 19:30

Would that by any chance be a reference to Mr. Stalin? :munchinYup, FDR actually was quite an admirer according to 1st person accounts written later of those around him. Shocking.

Sarski

06-22-2012, 20:21

I guess Holder and the POTUS couldn't move FAST enough to sweep this all under the rug. I bet they are FURIOUS about that.

This must be some kind of bad dream for them. Kind of like the last 3.6 years has been for the rest of us. Welcome to reality.

Sigaba

06-22-2012, 21:15

Yup, FDR actually was quite an admirer according to 1st person accounts written later of those around him. Shocking.FWIW, Robert Dallek, a historian who made his name with his study of FDR's foreign policy, offers his interpretation of FDR's view of Stalin here (http://ww2history.com/experts/Robert_Dallek/Roosevelt_s_idealistic_vision) and there (http://ww2history.com/experts/Robert_Dallek/Roosevelt_s_relationship_Stalin).

The short version is that FDR did not really trust Stalin but held a "certain regard" for the man as well as Russia. FDR's public praise of Stalin reflected a cynical belief that a certain amount of manipulation was in order to lead American public opinion away from its pre-war preference for isolationism and towards policies that were internationalist and multilateral in nature, and that these policies could not be achieved without the cooperation of the Soviet Union.

Although Gary Kern (https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/csi-publications/csi-studies/studies/vol47no1/article02.html) holds FDR in low esteem, in a piece for the CIA's unclassified edition of an issue of Studies in Intelligence, he does not argue that FDR admired Stalin.

Instead, Kern argues that FDR was overly confident in his ability to charm Stalin and believed that the dictator would participate in FDR's vision of the post World War II world if Russia's legitimate expectations were reasonably met. Kern also suggests that FDR and his advisers knew that American facilities in the Soviet Union were bugged and that some comments may have been made for Stalin's consumption.

Both of these interpretations emphasize the wheels within wheels nature of FDR that allow for Dallek's favorable view of FDR as well as Kern's scathing remarks. (They also reflect the ongoing debates over FDR's role in the origins of the Cold War.)

My two cents. What was wrong with FDR was not his alleged bias towards socialism or communism written after the fact, but rather his unwillingness to tell his advisers what he wanted to do and how he wanted to do it. Add to this dynamic his deliberate cultivation of ambiguity, his cynical manipulation of American public opinion his misplaced reliance on his ability to bend the will of others to his, and his willingness to privilege political advantage over principle when doing so served his interests.

In other words, FDR was not at all like the current resident of the White House.

Now for the rant. What happened to incumbent's position on transparency and open government as put forth in the first week of his presidency (http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=85677&st=&st1=#axzz1yU3G9yzB)? My Administration is committed to creating an unprecedented level of openness in Government. We will work together to ensure the public trust and establish a system of transparency, public participation, and collaboration. Openness will strengthen our democracy and promote efficiency and effectiveness in Government.

Government should be transparent. Transparency promotes accountability and provides information for citizens about what their Government is doing. Information maintained by the Federal Government is a national asset. My Administration will take appropriate action, consistent with law and policy, to disclose information rapidly in forms that the public can readily find and use. Executive departments and agencies should harness new technologies to put information about their operations and decisions online and readily available to the public. Executive departments and agencies should also solicit public feedback to identify information of greatest use to the public.Oh, that's right...This memorandum is not intended to, and does not, create any right or benefit, substantive or procedural, enforceable at law or in equity by a party against the United States, its departments, agencies, or entities, its officers, employees, or agents, or any other person.

JJ_BPK

06-23-2012, 04:09

My Administration is committed to creating an unprecedented level of openness in Government. We will work together to ensure the public trust and establish a system of transparency, public participation, and collaboration. Openness will strengthen our democracy and promote efficiency and effectiveness in Government. Government should be transparent. Transparency promotes accountability and provides information for citizens about what their Government is doing. Information maintained by the Federal Government is a national asset. My Administration will take appropriate action, consistent with law and policy, to disclose information rapidly in forms that the public can readily find and use. Executive departments and agencies should harness new technologies to put information about their operations and decisions online and readily available to the public. Executive departments and agencies should also solicit public feedback to identify information of greatest use to the public.

Oh, that's right...

This memorandum is not intended to, and does not, create any right or benefit, substantive or procedural, enforceable at law or in equity by a party against the United States, its departments, agencies, or entities, its officers, employees, or agents, or any other person. .

Good... :D

Badger52

06-23-2012, 05:26

In other words, FDR was not at all like the current resident of the White House.Solidly referenced; and a hat-tip for your choice of font color. ;)

JJ_BPK

06-23-2012, 05:40

Looks like the SS have stepped up the security level,, for some reason???

Forkless Friday at Obama event

LAKE BUENA VISTA, Fla. --Does a fork or dinner knife pose an unacceptable danger to President Barack Obama?

One wouldn’t think so, given the hundreds of lunches and dinners he’s attended ranging from state dinners to political fundraisers to run-of-the-mill stops on the rubber-chicken circuit.

However, at one such lunch Friday afternoon, guests heard an unusual announcement that they needed to hand over their silverware for security reasons.

“It’s very important that you use your utensils as soon as possible,” National Association of Latino Elected and Appointed Officials board member Raquel Regalado told about 1000 delegates at the group’s annual conference.

(Also on POLITICO: Obama blames GOP for playing politics on immigration)

Regalado hurried the diners to finish up their salads and pre-cut chicken breasts, saying that the Secret Service required that there be no knives at the tables and that the forks be rounded up before Obama entered the room.

“As you know, we’re having another speaker and there is some Secret Service involved. So there’s a reason why there’s no knives at your table and the forks will be collected. ... And I’m not joking,” Regalado told the audience in a ballroom at Disney’s Contemporary Resort at Walt Disney World. “So, like the good Hispanic mother I’m here to tell you to please, eat your lunch.”

A Secret Service spokesman confirmed that the agency made the request, but said such requirements are common at large events where the president speaks at about the same time people are dining.

continued:

http://www.politico.com/politico44/2012/06/forkless-friday-at-obama-event-127056.html

:munchin

Badger52

06-25-2012, 11:22

"Oh, Brudder."
:rolleyes:

LINK to full story. (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/25/issa-acknowledges-fast-and-furious-whistleblower-once-proposed-gunwalking/)

For the first time since Congress began investigating Operation Fast and Furious more than a year ago, a top lawmaker on Sunday publicly acknowledged another botched "gunwalking" investigation that was proposed and conducted by the Fast and Furious scandal's chief whistleblower.I don't care if Issa brought it up himself, I don't care if he lays out a pre-school level timeline on 50 easels...

For those that live on the 15sec sound-bite as they walk the halls, and have to vote on a full contempt citation, one of Issa's prime whistleblowers has the credibility of whaleshit for the time being.

Badger52

06-26-2012, 10:35

LINK to full FoxNews article (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/26/issa-challenges-obama-executive-privilege-claim-on-furious/)
A challenge to President Obama using executive privilege in the investigation into the federal government’s failed Fast and Furious gun-tracking operation was met Tuesday with a strong White House response in which a spokesman referred to the probe as “absurd.”

“The congressman’s analysis has as much merit as his absurd contention that Operation Fast and Furious was created in order to promote gun control. Our position is consistent with executive branch legal precedent for the past three decades,” said White House spokesman Eric Schultz.
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman."
- William Jefferson Clinton

Dusty

06-26-2012, 11:14

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/26/gop-senators-press-holder-for-special-prosecutor-into-potential-national/

Snip

Among the concerns about the leaks are recent news reports regarding the United State’s drone attacks in the Middle East.

Their letter points out the recent New York Times story about the drone program and its list of human targets states the reporting involved interviews with "three dozen of [President Obama's] current and former advisers."

It suggests that Thomas Donilon, the national security adviser, is a likely source in The Times reporting, considering he is “the commenter of record on events."

Snip

Badger52

06-27-2012, 06:25

It suggests that Thomas Donilon, the national security adviser, is a likely source in The Times reporting, considering he is “the commenter of record on events."

SnipI've been wrong before but this could end up with the hunt for the Dem's version of "Scooter" LIbby. Someone might get hung out to dry, but not as quickly because the media is more complicit with libs. In the end with this crowd I don't care if the water swirls clockwise or CCW as long as the bowl gets flushed.

Hand

06-27-2012, 07:54

Looks like there just might be some aisle crossing going on for this contempt vote tomorrow - interestingly enough it may be driven by the NRA!

Some Democrats will probably vote for Holder's contempt charge as well. The NRA has made it a key issue for their congressional ratings, which means that perhaps as many as a half dozen or more Dems will give the contempt charge a flavor of bi-partisanship.

Read more: http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2012/06/last_ditch_effort_by_white_house_to_avoid_holder_c ontempt_vote_fails.html#ixzz1z0AKGTbq

Paslode

06-27-2012, 08:16

If Holder is found in contempt, what exactly will it accomplish?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contempt_of_Congress

According to a CSPAN Resident Congressional Scholar back in 2000:

Contempt of Congress is initiated by a resolution reported from the affected congressional committee which can cite any individual for contempt. The resolution must then be adopted by the House or Senate. If the relevant chamber adopts the contempt resolution recommended by one of its committees, the matter is referred to a U.S. Attorney for prosecution. The U.S. Attorney may call in a grand jury to decide whether or not to indict and prosecute. If prosecuted by the courts and found guilty of contempt, the punishment is presently set at up to one year in prison and/or up to $1,000 in fines.

According to a MSNBC Q&A back in 2007:

A: Contempt of Congress is a federal misdemeanor, punishable by a maximum $100,000 fine and a maximum one-year sentence in federal prison.

Kind of looks like a slap on the wrist.

Hand

06-27-2012, 08:28

If Holder is found in contempt, what exactly will it accomplish?

Kind of looks like a slap on the wrist.

That's a good point. The only way I can see it helping the investigation would be if it led to him being replaced AND his replacement being more compliant and producing those documents. But thanks to BHO's declaration last week, those documents are now beyond the scrutiny of anyone as I understand it.

It would be nice if he had to wear a sign around his neck that said "Big Fat Liar" whenever he appears in public.

Streck-Fu

06-27-2012, 09:27

Paslode

06-27-2012, 10:39

Janet Reno was held in contempt of Congress, any one remember her punishment?

I know it was nothing close to Madoff's penalties.

Let's see Bernie is doing hard time for a long time for running a scam. Whereas Ms. Reno withheld evidence in the Clinton Impeachment and innocent women and children were incinerated under her watch. She was never assigned a Leavenworth jump suit and she got to host Saturday Night Live.

afchic

06-27-2012, 10:41

I know it was nothing close to Madoff's penalties.

Let's see Bernie is doing hard time for a long time for running a scam. Whereas Ms. Reno withheld evidence in the Clinton Impeachment and innocent women and children were incinerated under her watch. She was never assigned a Leavenworth jump suit and she got to host Saturday Night Live.

As the updated version of Pat:D

Badger52

06-27-2012, 11:44

Janet Reno was held in contempt of Congress, any one remember her punishment?

List of those held in contempt since 1975: LINK (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contempt_of_Congress#Partial_list_of_those_held_in _contempt_since_1975)(By your link) Committee cite only; what they wanted they got anyway during the Clinton impeachment proceeding.

Dusty

06-27-2012, 11:56

(By your link) Committee cite only; what they wanted they got anyway during the Clinton impeachment proceeding.

They didn't get jail time for he and the missus...

head

06-27-2012, 12:14

They didn't get jail time for he and the missus...

But he's still married to her... almost punishment enough ;)

afchic

06-27-2012, 12:30

But he's still married to her... almost punishment enough ;)

Which may be why she lost the primary. I don't know if a study has ever been done, but I know quite a few Dem women who didn't vote for her because she stayed with Bill. Their view was that if she didn't think enough of herself to kick his ass to the curb, then she couldn't be trusted to make good judgements when it came to running the country.

Badger52

06-27-2012, 12:37

Which may be why she lost the primary. I don't know if a study has ever been done, but I know quite a few Dem women who didn't vote for her because she stayed with Bill. Their view was that if she didn't think enough of herself to kick his ass to the curb, then she couldn't be trusted to make good judgements when it came to running the country.That's an observation I heard from several women at the time. Their reaction was like:

"What!?!? She's this articulate well-educated modern self-sufficient woman and she suddenly turns into Tammy Wynette?"

Dusty

06-27-2012, 13:12

Which may be why she lost the primary. I don't know if a study has ever been done, but I know quite a few Dem women who didn't vote for her because she stayed with Bill. Their view was that if she didn't think enough of herself to kick his ass to the curb, then she couldn't be trusted to make good judgements when it came to running the country.

His value as her political vehicle outweighed that of being her husband.

tonyz

06-27-2012, 16:22

IBD
6/26/12

http://news.investors.com/article/616213/201206261851/fast-and-furious-gun-control-plot.htm?p=full

Scandal: The head of the House oversight panel suggests the real reason for the administration's invoking executive privilege in the Fast and Furious case is to hide proof that the operation was part of a push for gun control.

Defenders of President Obama's use of executive privilege to provide cover for Attorney General Eric Holder in the gun-running fiasco that resulted in the deaths of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry and ICE Agent Jaime Zapata may dismiss it as just another conspiracy theory. But the suggestion by Rep. Darrell Issa, R-Calif., that the deadly operation was conceived to advance the administration's gun-control agenda is quite plausible.

"Here's the real answer as to gun control," Issa said on ABC's "This Week": "We have email from people involved in this that are talking about using what they're finding here to support the — basically assault weapons — ban or greater reporting."

Issa was asked about the possible connection after comments he made at an NRA convention. "Could it be," he said on NRA News' "Cam & Company" program, "that what they really were thinking of was in fact to use this walking of guns in order to promote an assault weapons ban? Many think so. And they haven't come up with an explanation that would cause any of us not to agree."

Perhaps the answer is in the documents that Holder and Obama are risking much to hide. As we observed recently, the way Fast and Furious, the government's gun-running operation, was executed made no sense unless its intended purpose was to facilitate violence with U.S. weapons in the interests of pursuing the administration's gun-control agenda.

As Issa noted on "This Week," the Department of Justice announced on April 25, 2011, "right in the middle of the scandal," that it was requiring some 8,500 gun stores in Arizona, California, Texas and New Mexico to report individual purchases of multiple rifles of greater than .22 caliber by law-abiding American citizens to the ATF because such guns are "frequently recovered at violent crime scenes near the Southwest border."

Like the ATF-supplied guns found next to the body of Brian Terry?

Coincidence? We think not. On July 14, 2010, roughly five months before Agent Terry's murder, ATF Field Ops Assistant Director Mark Chait emailed Bill Newell, ATF's Phoenix special agent in charge of Fast and Furious. "Bill," the email read, "can you see if these guns were all purchased from the same (licensed gun dealer) and at one time? We are looking at anecdotal cases to support a demand letter on long gun sales. Thanks."

A Jan. 24, 2011, email showed Newell saw it as an opportunity "to address (the) Multiple Sales on Long Guns issue." Chait emailed Newell that "this case could be a strong supporting factor if we can determine how many multiple sales of long guns occurred during the course of the case."

These documents, and perhaps others that have been withheld, show that Fast and Furious was intended not to interdict gun trafficking, but to make the administration's case for more gun control. According to Sen. Charles Grassley, R-Iowa, "There's plenty of evidence developing that the administration planned to use the tragedies of Fast and Furious as rationale to further their goals of a long gun reporting requirement."

Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and others in the administration had been pushing the discredited line that 90% of guns seized in Mexico came from the U.S. as justification for stricter gun laws and reporting rules.

The final damning evidence that Fast and Furious was a gun-control plot just may be in the documents the administration is fast and furiously trying to hide.

Gypsy

06-27-2012, 17:02

His value as her political vehicle outweighed that of being her husband.

Or so she thought.

I never would have voted for her for many reasons, but you could add afchic's comments to my list.

Dusty

06-27-2012, 17:36

Or so she thought.

I never would have voted for her for many reasons, but you could add afchic's comments to my list.

She's not even cute anymore!:D

Sarski

06-27-2012, 17:41

That final damning evidence that Fast and Furious was a gun-control plot just may be in the documents the administration is fast and furiously trying to hide.

That and maybe a bit more specifics on just which dealers and cartels the walked weapons went to...you know in case there might be snowballs chance in hell of maybe getting a few of them back, perhaps before they show up at any more crime scenes, or are filtered along to eastern european mobs.

Paslode

06-28-2012, 07:19

This is unrelated to the Fast & Furious debacle, but it is a prime example what happens when you screw the people over.....a dog & pony show that more often than not leads to nothing.

Rep. Charlie Rangel (D-N.Y.) is one of the longest serving members of Congress who on Tuesday won the most serious reelection battle of his career to defend his upper Manhattan seat. In 2010, the House Ethics Committee charged Rangel, then chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee, with 13 counts of violating House rules and federal laws alleging various financial dealings that broke the public trust. As a result, Rangel stepped down from the committee. Born on June 11, 1930 in New York City, the Korean War veteran was first elected in 1970.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/charlie-mahtesian/2012/06/rangel-results-still-unsettled-127509.html

Badger52

06-28-2012, 13:18

This is unrelated to the Fast & Furious debacle, but it is a prime example what happens when you screw the people over.....a dog & pony show that more often than not leads to nothing.The consideration of Holder's contempt citation is in progress, albeit continually interrupted with resolutions, each of which requires 50 min. of debate. (The latest by Sheila Jackson-Lee.) The first one that recognized that the Committee is within its purview to initiate/intervene in proceedings to issue subpoenas was "important." (Otherwise committees are impotent.) This'll be alot of slogging to get where they're likely to go anyway.

I'm betting the eventual cite vote will be something like the agreement to agree on agreeing to it... 254 - 173.

Dusty

06-28-2012, 14:52

Bad link

Paragrouper

06-28-2012, 14:57

http://video.foxnews.com/video-live-streaming.html?video_id=1155606982001

Dance fever!

Paslode

06-28-2012, 15:06

The consideration of Holder's contempt citation is in progress, albeit continually interrupted with resolutions, each of which requires 50 min. of debate. (The latest by Sheila Jackson-Lee.) The first one that recognized that the Committee is within its purview to initiate/intervene in proceedings to issue subpoenas was "important." (Otherwise committees are impotent.) This'll be alot of slogging to get where they're likely to go anyway.

I'm betting the eventual cite vote will be something like the agreement to agree on agreeing to it... 254 - 173.

Kind of like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Rvr5RGx3uw

Badger52

06-28-2012, 18:52

Kind of like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Rvr5RGx3uwLOL. Guess my numbers were off. I completely failed to factor in the "departure from the battlefield" factor.

MR2

06-28-2012, 19:03

On the day in which the U.S. House of Representatives has determined that Attorney General Eric Holder’s actions are egregious enough to warrant a criminal contempt vote, the AG has skipped town and headed to … Disneyworld.

http://redalertpolitics.com/2012/06/28/on-day-of-contempt-vote-eric-holder-skips-town-heads-to-disneyworld/

Paslode

06-29-2012, 13:55

The toothless dog & pony show continues.....it's all about formalities.

The contempt vote technically opens the door for the House to call on the U.S. attorney for the District of Columbia to bring the case against Holder before a grand jury. But because U.S. Attorney Ronald Machen works for Holder and because President Obama has already asserted executive privilege over the documents in question, it was expected Holder's Justice Department would not take that step.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/29/after-holder-contempt-vote-republicans-eye-civil-court-case-to-extract-furious/

Dusty

06-29-2012, 19:56

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cm8hgoLc80&feature=related

Snip

Despite voting to hold Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. in contempt of Congress, there’s little House Republicans can do in the short term to compel him to turn over documents — unless it wanted to revisit a long-dormant power and arrest him.

The thought is shocking, and conjures up a Hollywood-ready standoff scene between House police and the FBI agents who protect the attorney general. It’s a dramatic and unlikely possibility not least because Congress doesn’t even have a jail any longer. But in theory it could happen.

Snip

Paslode

06-29-2012, 20:25

Badger52

06-30-2012, 06:10

Deleted; Paslode had link above to what I was looking for.

tonyz

07-19-2012, 09:55

ATF chief warns of 'consequences' to outside whistleblowing

Washington Guardian

New Fast and Furious fallout: Video warns ATF agents about reporting wrongdoing outside 'chain of command'

UPDATED 8:12 AM EDT, JULY 19, 2012 | BY JOHN SOLOMON

http://washingtonguardian.com/whistleblower-video-chill

tonyz

07-30-2012, 19:49

5 named in Fast & Furious probe

Published: July 30, 2012 at 8:31 PM
UPI

http://m.upi.com/story/UPI-36811343694693/

WASHINGTON, July 30 (UPI) -- Investigators have determined five Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms agents are responsible for a failed gun-walking program the Los Angeles Times said.

The newspaper reported Monday it had obtained a copy of a report by Republican investigators finding five senior ATF officials are collectively responsible for the Fast and Furious operation. The report found the failed operation was "marred by missteps, poor judgments and inherently reckless strategy," the newspaper said.

The House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform, chaired by Rep. Darrell Issa, R-Calif., voted last month to find U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder in contempt because he had not turned over documents the committee demanded. The Republican-controlled House also voted to hold Holder in contempt.

The report to be released this week alleged the Justice Department had a role in the Fast and Furious program, citing an assertion by Kenneth E. Melson, formerly acting director of ATF, that his superiors in the department "were doing more damage control than anything" else amid public disclosure of the failed operation.

Republican investigators said they will issue two more reports, focusing on what they called "the devastating failure of supervision and leadership" at the Department of Justice and an "unprecedented obstruction of the [congressional] investigation by the highest levels of the Justice Department, including the attorney general himself," the Times reported.

Five people were indicted July 9 in the death of U.S. Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry in 2010. Two guns found at the scene of Terry's death were traced to the Fast and Furious program.

Paslode

08-02-2012, 15:16

William Hoover was one of the five ATF officials House oversight committee chairman Darrell Issa and Iowa Republican Sen. Chuck Grassley singled out as responsible for Operation Fast and Furious. ATF spokesman Drew Wade told the AP that Hoover resigned on Tuesday – the day Issa and Grassley released the congressional report in which they singled out Hoover and four of his colleagues.

http://dailycaller.com/2012/08/02/atf-official-resigns-after-issa-grassley-nail-him-in-congressional-fast-and-furious-report/

Badger52

09-11-2012, 11:47

Fox link in full here. (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/09/11/exclusive-long-awaited-furious-report-spreads-blame-across-agencies/)
Much of the blame in the report is directed at three ATF managers: Phoenix Agent in Charge Bill Newell, Supervisor Dave Voth and Case Agent Hope MacAllister.

Their attorneys claim they've been scapegoated. Debra Roth, an attorney for MacAllister, wrote to Inspector General Michael Horowitz that the report "fails to account for the abdication of oversight, guidance and responsibility by ATF headquarters and Main Department of Justice...

"Following the briefing ... Mr. Voth received accolades from his superiors. No one in ATF leadership or at Main Justice raised any concerns with Mr. Voth about the direction of the investigation. If anything, they were encouraging him," Voth attorney Joshua Levy said.

A fresh game of musical chairs, anyone? Get 'em now, while supplies last!

The Reaper

09-11-2012, 16:44

Wonder how long before they are offered immunity in return for telling the truth about who knew what, and when?

TR

Surf n Turf

09-29-2012, 11:44

Wonder how long before they are offered immunity in return for telling the truth about who knew what, and when?

TR

TR, it looks like Univision will NOT let go of this – We can’t get any information from the DOJ or US News outlets, let’s hope that this opens the whole issue to the public.
SnT

Get the full story on "Fast and Furious" on a special edition of Univision's "Aquí y Ahora" (Here and Now) this Sunday, September 30, 2012 at 7:00 p.m. ET/PT (6 p.m. Central), (TOMORROW) ---which will be aired with closed captioning in English.

http://abcnews.go.com/ABC_Univision/News/untold-story-fast-furious-scandal/story?id=17342034#.UGcQvZjA_Tq

Badger52

09-30-2012, 07:21

To be fair, others have had their jaws on this like a Gila lizard - David Codrea at Gun Rights Examiner & Mike Vanderboegh at SSI - and never let go. Still it's good to see some outrage-loaded external coverage.

Everything in Congress (including subpoenas) takes a minimum of 30 days; I think it probably takes 30 days to staff a procurement action for a urinal mint. And that clock doesn't start ticking till potential recipients have been warned via the press, threatened with action via formal letters (see timetable above), and other posturing.

Oh, and there are re-election campaigns going on... especially enjoyed by those who think the DoJ's own IG report - which naturally paints senior leadership with Tom Sawyer's paint-bucket - needs to be "thoroughly digested."

It will be interesting to see what that program has. It'll also be interesting to see how many can be drawn away from the final quarter of their 2nd Sunday afternoon NFL game.
:rolleyes:

Badger52

10-01-2012, 07:53

FNC's coverage (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/01/report-claims-to-have-found-57-more-guns-tied-to-operation-fast-and-furious/) - citing Univision - will perhaps give the Univision effort some more traction.

Edited to add: No timeline of this operation is complete without noting SECSTATE Clinton's visit to Mexico in March 2009. Just over 2 months into the job she makes ridiculous claims about the percentages of weapons recovered in Mexico being from the US. These are almost immediately proven to be bogus, but that context is worth noting in light of Candidate Obama's off-record promise to the Brady bunch that they would work on gun control but would have to do some things "under the radar."
Just bein' fair & balanced....

Badger52

10-16-2012, 10:53

LINK to the FNC story (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/16/justice-department-seeks-dismissal-fast-and-furious-lawsuit/?test=latestnews)

The Justice Department on Monday night sought dismissal of a lawsuit by a Republican-led House of Representatives committee demanding that Attorney General Eric Holder produce records about the botched law enforcement probe of gun-trafficking called Operation Fast and Furious.

In its court papers, the Justice Department says the Constitution does not permit the courts to resolve the political dispute between the executive branch and the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee that is seeking the records. My cursory looks tell me this last is not true; in fact, the Constitution is closer to being mute on the subject. However, Congress has the option of Legislative Courts (with about as many teeth as a 20-yo Redbone hound). Still at issue is the obstruction by failure to provide documents under subpoena. Seems to me this is still a criminal matter, brought by Congress on behalf of its people.

Bottom-line, just looks like more clock-ticking dissembling from senior DoJ officials to me.

Badger52

10-30-2012, 11:03

LINK to Part II of III of the Committee Report (http://oversight.house.gov/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/10-29-12-Fast-and-Furious-The-Anatomy-of-a-Failed-Operation-Part-II-of-III-Report.pdf)

Probably lost in terms of coverage due to weather (natural & political).
There is only a single footnote mention of anything furthering another agenda later that had been previously talked about in other emails released between ATF field/district and their "higher" - who certainly seems to still enjoy top-cover from the sitting POTUS.

As with this operation & others, from the NBPP to Benghazi, their control, their power, their agenda, by any means necessary. If they know (but no one else can prove they know) about an op run amok, then let it go - nothing to lose, all to gain, casualties be damned.

If they end up having to arrange packout of household goods between November & January, they should thank their lucky stars that things which happen to departing office-holders in some other countries aren't likely to happen to them.

Badger52

12-04-2012, 15:00

This oughta fix things. (http://www.examiner.com/article/issa-parrots-the-unknowable-as-holder-deputy-abandons-ship?CID=examiner_alerts_article)
:rolleyes:

Citing an unproven assertion from the September Office of Inspector General’s report on Fast and Furious gunwalking, House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform Chairman Darrell Issa issued a statement yesterday on the departure of Eric Holder’s Chief of Staff, Deputy Attorney General Gary Grindler.

“ ... Grindler was appropriately faulted by his Department’s own Inspector General for keeping information about a connection between the murder of a Border Patrol Agent and a mishandled department operation away from the Attorney General and the Department of Homeland Security,” Issa asserted.

“We determined that Grindler learned on December 17, 2010, of the link between weapons found at the Terry murder scene and Operation Fast and Furious but did not inform the Attorney General about this information,” Issa quoted from the report. (Bear in mind another aide had informed Holder of the Terry murder the night it happened.)

If that's all the Committee can muster at this point it's back to some real interesting stuff. (http://professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=477108#post477108)
:munchin

SF18C

12-04-2012, 15:45

Issa has found something much more important than F&F or Benghazi...

Inland Rep. Darrell Issa will hold a congressional hearing next week to examine the science behind Human Growth Hormone testing, and why its implementation in the National Football league has been delayed.

http://blog.pe.com/political-empire/2012/12/03/congress-issa-to-probe-hgh-testing-in-the-nfl/

This is why the Repugs ARE OUT OF TOUCH with our Constitution!!!!

mark46th

12-04-2012, 17:29

I think Issa just wants his picture taken with Dick Butkus...

Badger52

12-26-2012, 16:47

I think Issa just wants his picture taken with Dick Butkus... THAT is funny. Meanwhile....

What with Benghazi, Laurel & Hardy over the fiscal cliff, cabinet shuffleboard, pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

A little-noticed brief filed last Thursday by House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform Ranking Member Elijah Cummings and fellow Democrats John Conyers, Jr., Henry A. Waxman, Edolphus Towns and Louise M. Slaughter, asks the United States District Court for the District of Columbia to dismiss without prejudice the civil complaint by the Oversight Committee against Eric Holder following the Attorney General being found in contempt of Congress for refusing to produce subpoenaed documents related to the Fast and Furious gunwalking investigation.

More at this link. (http://www.examiner.com/article/cummings-seeks-dismissal-of-fast-and-furious-suit-against-holder?CID=examiner_alerts_article)

Team Sergeant

12-27-2012, 11:55

THAT is funny. Meanwhile....

What with Benghazi, Laurel & Hardy over the fiscal cliff, cabinet shuffleboard, pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

More at this link. (http://www.examiner.com/article/cummings-seeks-dismissal-of-fast-and-furious-suit-against-holder?CID=examiner_alerts_article)

I expect no less from the left-wing socialist administration.

Paslode

06-30-2013, 08:51

The ATF leader who oversaw a botched undercover operation in Milwaukee will now be in charge of the agency's embattled Phoenix office, where agents allowed more than 2,000 guns to walk into the hands of suspected criminals through the infamous "Operation Fast and Furious."

http://www.jsonline.com/watchdog/watchdogreports/atf-leader-who-oversaw-botched-sting-will-run-phoenix-office-b9943426z1-213728421.html

Badger52

07-01-2013, 17:19

Is this like moving to Double Jeopardy where the scores can really change?
Or just more proof the Peter Principle isn't a novel?

Yet... what a completely logical thing from this administration.

tonyz

07-07-2013, 12:21

Police chief killed with rifle lost in ATF gun-tracking program

LA Times
BY RICHARD A. SERRANO
July 5, 2013, 3:45 p.m.

WASHINGTON—A high-powered rifle lost in the ATF’s Fast and Furious controversy was used to kill a Mexican police chief in the state of Jalisco earlier this year, according to internal Department of Justice records, suggesting that weapons from the failed gun-tracking operation have now made it into the hands of violent drug cartels deep inside Mexico.

<snip>

http://touch.latimes.com/#section/-1/article/p2p-76571135/

MR2

07-07-2013, 12:44

Semantics is everything. I just wonder what the LA Times considers a "high-powered rifle"?

Paslode

07-07-2013, 12:44

Badger52

07-12-2013, 16:05

Titled appropriately, but good luck with that.

Editorial: Forget Operation Fast and Furious? Not with bodies still piling up
In Mexico, they have known for some time. Officials there have attributed more than 200 deaths to Fast and Furious weapons. A Justice Department document made public this month by the Los Angeles Times’ Richard A. Serrano reveals what may be the most recent: Luis Lucio Rosales Astorga, police chief in the town of Hostotipaquillo, was shot to death Jan. 29 when gunmen opened fire on his patrol car. One bodyguard was killed and the chief’s wife and a second bodyguard wounded.No rush, apparently. Perhaps the ATF is waiting for the guns to wash ashore, one by one, after the drug criminals are done with them.
LINK to full article here. (http://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/editorials/20130710-editorial-forget-fast-and-furious-not-with-bodies-still-piling-up.ece)

tonyz

08-21-2013, 06:16

More Fast and Furious guns surface at crimes in Mexico

By SHARYL ATTKISSON / CBS NEWS/ August 14, 2013, 12:54 PM

Three more weapons from Fast and Furious have turned up at crime scenes in Mexico, CBS News has learned, as the toll from the controversial federal operation grows.

According to Justice Department tracing documents obtained by CBS News, all three guns are WASR-10 762-caliber Romanian rifles. Two were purchased by Fast and Furious suspect Uriel Patino in May and July of 2010. Sean Steward, who was convicted on gun charges in July 2012, purchased a third. The rifles were traced yesterday to the Lone Wolf gun shop in Glendale, Ariz.

During Fast and Furious and similar operations, federal agents from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms (ATF) encouraged the Lone Wolf and other gun stores to sell massive amounts of weapons to questionable purchasers who allegedly trafficked them Mexican drug cartels.

Patino is said to have purchased 700 guns while under ATF's watch. Ever since, a steady stream of the guns have been recovered at crime scenes in Mexico and the U.S. But the Justice Department has refused repeated requests from Congress and CBS News to provide a full accounting. An estimated 1,400 guns are still on the street or unaccounted for.

Last November, a Fast and Furious weapon was found at a shootout between a Mexican drug cartel and soldiers where a beauty queen was killed. Two weapons used in the murder of Immigration and Customs Enforcement Agent Jaime Zapata in Mexico on Feb. 15, 2011 also came from suspects who were under ATF watch but not arrested at the time. And two Fast and Furious AK-47 type rifles were recovered from the murder scene of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry in December 2010; he'd been shot by illegal immigrants who were smuggling drugs.

ATF special agent John Dodson blew the whistle on his agency's gunwalking in an interview with CBS News in 2011.

The government first denied any guns had been allowed to "walk" into criminal hands. Later, the Justice Department acknowledged using the strategy, claiming it was intended to see where the weapons ended up in hopes of capturing a major cartel leader. But the agency ordered an immediate halt to the practice calling it highly improper.

The Justice Department's refusal to turn over certain Fast and Furious documents led to a bipartisan vote in the House of Representatives in June 2012 to hold Attorney General Eric Holder in contempt of Congress. Then, the Obama administration used executive privilege for the first time, to withhold requested documents from Congress. The Republican-led House Oversight Committee is suing for release of the material.

<snip>

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57598487/more-fast-and-furious-guns-surface-at-crimes-in-mexico/