View Full Version : We are supposedly using this in the Summer?
http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2010-05/us-special-forces-set-carry-laser-guided-smart-bullet-weapon-battle
Saw this article has anyone heard about it or field tested it out other then the soldier from some ACR ?
mark46th
05-10-2010, 18:11
If each round ensured a hit or near hit on an enemy, it would be money well spent. IIRC, during the Vietnam War, something like 1 out of 50,000 rounds hit an enemy...
And we thought the M-4's were cool when we got them. They are only good to 500M though?
The Reaper
05-10-2010, 22:17
Another leftover from the OICW fiasco.:rolleyes:
The warhead lacks lethality, unless it goes off in the barrel as it did during testing.
Too heavy, too expensive, and eats very heavy batteries like a mofo.
I do not see SF using this.
TR
Mississippi10
05-11-2010, 20:36
The warhead is going to take few seconds to get downrange, and it's very seldom going to cause even a disabling injury to anyone more than six or seven meters from point of detonation. The bad guys over in the sandbox have lots of bad qualities, but total stupidity isn't one of them; they're going to figure out pretty quick to pop up, shoot, pop back down and move ten meters to one side or the other. This is even assuming that the system works as advertised. Back in the late, great, Southeast Asia wargames, we were given some experimental M-79 rounds which (on a vacant parking lot) bounced and detonated in the air a few fractions of a second later. On dirt or vegetation they just bounced.
geardo211
05-11-2010, 23:46
Sounds like a solution in need of a problem. Aren't most engagements in Afghanistan beyond 500m anyway? Why are we buying plasma rifles in 40w range, when the money could be used to refit our current equipment? I know I would appreciate it more if everyone in my squad had a PAQ4/PEQ15, and M4's that still had some finish left on them. JMO though.
I agree with everyone I do not see this as a tactically sound or efficient weapon for any team. It seems far to bulky and cumbersome.
The Reaper
05-21-2010, 02:50
The Army spent millions with HK to develop this, and it was an epic failure when it was killed ten years ago.
Looks like they are trying to recoup some of their losses by repackaging, renaming, and reissuing it.
TR
Looks like they are trying to recoup some of their losses by repackaging, renaming, and reissuing it.
TR
You're right about that, Sir. Expect the NDIA jockeys will never give up. Used car salesmen in plaid pants. Wait 'til the next "expo" and this round will be the best thing to come along since they tried to sell striped paint to the Navy.
There'll be PowerPoint slides, voice over narratives, free mousepads and pens...Can't wait...gets me all choked up just thinking about it.(sigh)
x SF med
05-21-2010, 09:20
A well trained 'natural' with an M203 or M79 can hit a window ... and have the round go off in the room... is there really a need for a laser?
Also, if you're close enough... you can throw a grenade into a window.
Spend the money on good equipment, training and food for the troops, not expensive BS that's going to make an arms company rich.
dr. mabuse
05-21-2010, 09:51
*
longrange1947
05-21-2010, 10:27
The OCIW has been stripped into three separate possible weapon components and are again being pushed through such crap as "Weaponology" (sp?) shows, and other BS on Discovery and Military channels. They show guys in uniform shooting it and how great it is. It is similar to the so called .50 replacement that fires a similar round very fast and a computer sets each war head to detonate at a set location based o the sight and laser range finder. The operator can set point impact, delay, or proximity. I still have not seen an official test of any of them. H&K is really trying to salvage this one. I saw this crap in the early 90s and it did not work then and as far as I know does not work any better now.
Sinister
05-21-2010, 11:34
Each Program Manager - Small Arms (a full colonel) has to show he fielded a weapon to the Warfighter in Combat if he expects to make brigadier -- which is why none of these bad/stupid ideas dies.
The cost of funding this weapon system could have (and should have) been used to begin re-phasing the M4 upper receiver with a piston impingement system. Like so many have already stated this system will prove to be ineffective in the field, and what it will accomplish can already be achieved by properly employing weapons already in use.
mark46th
05-22-2010, 09:38
I have to agree with x-SF Med. An experienced M-79 user can be very accurate.
I just returned from the NDIA conference in Dallas, I am spoke with the PM from PM Soldiers Weapons, they have already successfully tested the capability of the system and are working on increasing the lethality of the system and they are working on additional munitions for the system. Think about launching a flashbang type round into the windows of a building they you are about to enter.
I have been invited to go out an shoot the weapon, when I do I will be able to give a more informed opinion
Just my two cents
ReconRover
05-26-2010, 14:17
Like the XM-8....I see that this is AWESOME!
Seriously, it is not big enough. It really needs to be at least 18 inches longer, 12 inches taller, and perhaps have the HK M23 "diver grip compatible" .45 lower on it....but with a much larger trigger guard so that it can be used while wearing Spetznaz issued winter mitts.
Awesome! MORE PLASTIC!!!
steve912
05-15-2011, 01:31
There were reviews on this weapon recently, that people who field tested it loved it, and didnt want to give it up. I hope it is true, but then again it is a news story and we all know how factual those all are...
(update)
http://www.armytimes.com/news/2011/02/army-xm25-punisher-battlefield-test-021411w/
I do see the problem that it is only shooting a distance of 500 meters, with a future expansion of 700 to 1000 meters... And for it to be useful to you guys it needs to go over 2000 Meters.. Hopefully they can make that happen.
The Reaper
05-15-2011, 08:39
There were reviews on this weapon recently, that people who field tested it loved it, and didnt want to give it up. I hope it is true, but then again it is a news story and we all know how factual those all are...
I used to hear the same thing about cigarettes....
TR
steve912
05-15-2011, 09:02
Dually noted.
Maybe I missed something here about this weapon? What would you carry in addition to this weapon for self defense?
For example the M-79 man had a 1911A1 strapped to his side. Both the XM148 and M203 had the M16A1.
Anybody???:confused:
greenberetTFS
06-07-2011, 12:33
My question is very simple,being out of the loop for many years now,I'd like to ask just what patch is that soldier wearing?...........;)
Big Teddy :munchin
My question is very simple,being out of the loop for many years now,I'd like to ask just what patch is that soldier wearing?...........;)
Big Teddy :munchin
That would be 3rd ACR... ;)
EchoSixMike
09-18-2011, 05:50
And while all this $ has been squandered on a boondoggle, there are at least three different companies trying to market medium velocity, enhanced warhead 40mm grenades that work with the M32 and M320 GL's already in service. Ranges from 600-800m, with better effects than current HEDP 40mm shells. And we're(US Mil) going to have to keep 40mm GL's in service regardless of the success or failure of this 25mm thing, due to alternate shells such as ILLUM, less lethal riot control, marking smoke, etc. S/F.....Ken M
If they can perfect and simplify it. It would be great. This is what R&D is for. But I can't not agree with Reaper. This could be a ploy to re-coup money, rename and repackage.
Scimitar
09-18-2011, 11:20
Couldn't help but quote the original article
Army plans call for full production start in 2012 and an initial buy of 12,500 XM-25s. Until then, warfighters might get dumbed-down sense of such a weapon's effectiveness by playing with the detonate-upon-command grenade launcher in Halo: Reach.
really..... :rolleyes:
S