View Full Version : US clears 2nd Navy SEAL in Iraqi abuse case
BMT (RIP)
04-23-2010, 14:52
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2010/04/23/clears-nd-navy-seal-iraqi-abuse-case/
Glad to see this... Third SEAL goes on trial in May, hopefully with the same outcome.
The verdicts have played into Iraqis' fears that courts will never hold U.S. troops accountable for atrocities or other abuses.
:rolleyes:
mark46th
04-23-2010, 16:47
I'm apalled they were even charged. I am also apalled that a dozen or so Somali pirates were in court today. Why are they being given the same rights I would be given? I guess that should be a new thread...Sorry for the atempted thread jacking.
Green Light
04-23-2010, 17:03
The verdicts have played into Iraqis' fears that courts will never hold U.S. troops accountable for atrocities or other abuses.
I don't know what else could have been done. They were offered Non-judicial punishment by COMSOCCENT and they refused (which you should do if you aren't guilty). They had an Article 32 Investigation which, due to the apparent lie of the master-at-arms, they had probable cause to go to a general court martial.
Charlie Cleveland, being the guy that he is, immunized everyone who was a witness. He threw in the wildcard that ensured that the truth would come out. The system worked darned well.
If these guys would have been guilty, they would have been hung out to dry. They would have gotten maximum sentences (the ramifications of something like this go far beyond national borders). But a jury found them not guilty. The pressure on the members of the board must have been tremendous. No, there wouldn't have been any pressure from the chain of command, but they realized what the ramifications would be if they got it wrong.
Not so sure Charlie made the right call on this.
The Reaper
04-23-2010, 17:26
Not so sure Charlie made the right call on this.
How?
TR
SkiBumCFO
04-23-2010, 19:54
I think the good general made the right call as he let the system work as it should. Got handed a plate of crap from the navy brass and did exactly what he should have.
I let out a little hooray when I heard the verdict today. I agree they should never have been charged in the first place, non-judicial or otherwise. As for the Somali pirates, should have let them go down with their little boat.
Given that you can "kill or capture" the target, any use of force less than deadly force affecting that capture is OK. If you can "kill" the cat, you can certainly put the beatdown on him while effecting said capture. What you CAN'T do is to put the beat down on them once they are no longer a threat and under your control. From what I've seen/read/heard, the "damage" was done while affecting capture, NOT after the flexcuffs went on. I - however - DO NOT KNOW what transpired. Concur that Chalrlie was handed a bag of excrement. However, ss noted in Rep. Dan Burton's letter to Charlie Cleveland, we seem to have created a "culture" wherein we immediately take the word of a terrorist scrote and look at our own actions with a jaundiced eye. We therefore oft overreact to appease the critics (many within our own ranks).
Concur he is a good dude and it'll be interesting to see how this plays out.
BUT...having done one or two CM's in my day, you lead off with your strongest case to try to get the others to plead out before you go to court. If this is all they've got, the evidence seems to be that this was miuch ado about nothing.
zuluzerosix
05-01-2010, 12:39
I don't know what else could have been done. They were offered Non-judicial punishment by COMSOCCENT and they refused (which you should do if you aren't guilty). They had an Article 32 Investigation which, due to the apparent lie of the master-at-arms, they had probable cause to go to a general court martial.
Charlie Cleveland, being the guy that he is, immunized everyone who was a witness. He threw in the wildcard that ensured that the truth would come out. The system worked darned well.
If these guys would have been guilty, they would have been hung out to dry. They would have gotten maximum sentences (the ramifications of something like this go far beyond national borders). But a jury found them not guilty. The pressure on the members of the board must have been tremendous. No, there wouldn't have been any pressure from the chain of command, but they realized what the ramifications would be if they got it wrong.
Question....
These sailors, even though they were found Not Guilty, are their careers ruined? I mean will they be able to advance in rank as other sailors can given their jobs, units etc... I have no idea about rank advancement opportunities in Naval Special Warfare. Are they done?