View Full Version : Ketchup?
Has anyone else noticed a decline in the quality and flavor of ketchup? To the point where it might be called "Kerry's Revenge"?
I dropped by Costco and bought .... well ... a supply sufficient for way too long. It was, I regret to say, Heinz. Later, I learned that Hunt's and Heinz Organic had produced better taste results.
So, the question becomes - how to remedy the problem.
At THIS SITE (http://www.gourmetsleuth.com/cooking-conversions/gram-conversions.aspx), there is a recipe for ketchup.
One 6-ounce can tomato paste* 170
1/2 cup light corn syrup* 113
1/2 cup white vinegar* 113
1/4 cup water 1 tablespoon sugar* 69.6
1 teaspoon salt* 6.083
1/4 teaspoon onion powder* 1.17
1/8 teaspoon garlic powder* 0.585
With the number to the right as estimates of the weight, in grams, of the line items. In contrast, the ketchup I bought shows that 17 grams of ketchup include about 190 milligrams of sodium.
As nearly as I can tell, that suggests that the salt has been cut about 13% from the original...although I wouldn't swear to it. I get the impression people don't use analytical balances for recipes.
I'm thinking of taking 1/2 cup of Heinz, adding 1/10 tsp salt, a pinch of onion and garlic powder, and 1/4 tsp of sugar.
However - perhaps someone has a better idea? (With better not including dropping the current supply in the Goodwill box under cover of darkness!)
I dropped by Costco and bought .... well ... a supply sufficient for way too long. It was, I regret to say, Heinz. Later, I learned that Hunt's and Heinz Organic had produced better taste results.
<<SNIP>>
However - perhaps someone has a better idea? (With better not including dropping the current supply in the Goodwill box under cover of darkness!)Why not just return the ketchup to Costco and get back your money? In my experience, Costco has a generous return policy.
FWIW, I've not noticed the change in taste of Heinz ketchup.:confused: Then again, I use that condiment rarely and when I do, it isn't on the plate for long.
Remember Boys and Girls......practice Safe Eating....
ALWAYS use a condiment. :D
nmap, there is something wrong with the conversion system as 28gr.= 1oz. the column showed measurements over that amount. The same is true for teaspoon measurements.
Heinz ketchup...we are putting a burger on the menu and will be making our own ketchup. I'll try what you posted and then our little ditty, I'll post the taste test...
If you have time always make your own; if nothing else at least you know whats in it!!!
One 6-ounce can tomato paste* 170
1/2 cup light corn syrup* 113
1/2 cup white vinegar* 113
1/4 cup water 1 tablespoon sugar* 69.6
1 teaspoon salt* 6.083
1/4 teaspoon onion powder* 1.17
1/8 teaspoon garlic powder* 0.585
nmap, there is something wrong with the conversion system as 28gr.= 1oz. the column showed measurements over that amount. The same is true for teaspoon measurements.
It's true that one ounce of weight = 28 grams; however, a fluid ounce of water is more like 29.5 grams. The teaspoon amounts of onion and garlic powder are even more problematic, since those are (according to my understanding) dried (or freeze dried?) and ground, so a given volume of these materials is likely to be lighter than a volume of water. The only thing I could find that even hinted at a value was dried yeast.
So...you can see why I was very hesitant to put any faith in my 13% figure! :D
But I'm excited about the prospect of your ketchup taste-test. I'll look forward to seeing more! And, if you'd like, I'll track down another recipe I found that had a lot more ingredients...
Thanks as always.
BTW - Sigaba - good idea about Costco. I called them, and they'll be getting back some of Kerry's Revenge Sauce. ;)
BTW - Sigaba - good idea about Costco. I called them, and they'll be getting back some of Kerry's Revenge Sauce. ;)Not for nothin' am I known as The Costco Kid .:D
A long time ago, there was a discussion here which lead me to the Dean of the Astrophysics Department at Princeton University to resolve something equally important....please tell me that 1 gram still equals a gram 1gram...volume and weight are two different issues…but, as I seem to recall, that conversation and the usual suspects questioned the relative value of motion and speed…
Ok, so what does a gram of air weigh?
Red Flag 1
01-25-2010, 17:49
FWIW, political air carries less weight.
RF 1
Ok, so what does a gram of air weigh?
Depends on the value of G....assuming, of course, that we're at non-relativistic speeds... :D
However, ignoring those, 0.775 Liters of air should weigh 1 gram - if measured in a vacuum...but if we're at sea level, the air displaced equals the volume of the air weighed, so although the mass is still 1 gram, the weight is now zero.
Maybe I should just switch to mustard. ;)
FWIW, political air carries less weight.
RF 1
Exactly. Per Avogadro's law, the temperature of the hot air expelled implies that the gas will expand to an arbitrarily large volume....
Maybe I should just switch to mustard. ;)Have you ever mixed a small amount of mustard with ketchup?
Saturation
01-25-2010, 18:58
I find my ketchup vastly improves when I add some Tabasco.
Kicks it up to savory/sweet.
Have you ever mixed a small amount of mustard with ketchup?
Yes, it's good! Along that line, a little mustard powder might add to it...
Sometimes, a drop or two of Tabasco sauce is good, too.
dr. mabuse
01-25-2010, 19:35
*.
nmap, have you noticed the same for cocktail sauce?
Just not as good as it used to be.
Haven't had store-bought in a long time.
I have. I guess the trouble is that so many products have seemed degraded that I supposed I was just being cranky. :D
But do you have a good recipe for cocktail sauce?
dr. mabuse
01-25-2010, 20:22
*
Dozer523
01-25-2010, 21:20
My Reason For Living (who sells food for a living with one of the largest food service Companies in the world) says that it isn't the recipe gone bad. It's that tomatoes were especially crappy this year. Her company was actually forced to buy tomatoes from
(wait for it; no sh!t)
Canada! Aye!
Peregrino
01-25-2010, 21:37
Another equally plausible reason for the apparent decline in the quality of your condiments is jaded taste buds (or faulty memories of "how good it used to be"). Kick it up a notch with some horseradish. Do you have a cold? Most of taste is actually smell. (Something else the horseradish will cure! :D) Lots of supporting characters in your cast of reasons.
ZonieDiver
01-26-2010, 05:23
My Reason For Living (who sells food for a living with one of the largest food service Companies in the world) says that it isn't the recipe gone bad. It's that tomatoes were especially crappy this year. Her company was actually forced to buy tomatoes from
(wait for it; no sh!t)
Canada! Aye!
I haven't seen a "real" tomato outside of a farmer's market or my own garden in 20+ years. I am not sure what those "red things" in the grocery store produce section are, but they ain't tomatoes! (Yes, Dan Quayle was right... there is an E in tomatoes and potatoes! :D)
A thread on Ketchup and nobody mentioned Mushroom Ketchup?
A new twist for a meat dish.
Had it once and liked it but might be a little involved to make a batch.
I haven't seen a "real" tomato outside of a farmer's market or my own garden in 20+ years. I am not sure what those "red things" in the grocery store produce section are, but they ain't tomatoes!
If you could cut one of them open you'd probably find a bone. Then again, if you could cut one at all you could use it for gasket material.
Team Sergeant
01-26-2010, 12:23
Dr. math to the rescue!!!!!
Converting Ounces to Ounces
Date: 06/03/2002 at 03:36:35
From: Jessica
Subject: weight of mass and liquid?
I know this should be easy to figure out, but my roommate and I are having a small debate on weight. I am a cocktail waitress here in Vegas and was trying to figure out the total weight of my tray if, say, a mug of beer weighs 25oz.
I figured an ounce is an ounce like when they say "what weighs more, a ton of bricks or a ton of feathers? - neither, a ton is a ton."
However my roommate started to convince me that liquid is weighed differently, which I understand, but how is it converted? I'm sorry the question is so elementary, I have taken science and math classes, but never did grasp any of it.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 06/03/2002 at 09:14:26
From: Doctor Rick
Subject: Re: weight of mass and liquid?
Hi, Jessica.
I think the source of confusion here is that there are two different units called an "ounce". (Actually, there are more than that, but two are in common use today.) There is the ounce of weight, technically called the avoirdupois ounce, and the ounce of volume or capacity, called the fluid ounce.
When you say a mug of beer "weighs 25 oz.", you are probably
referring to the volume of beer, not its weight. I don't have any beer around, but a can of soda is labeled "12 fl. oz.", meaning the soda in the can has a volume of 12 fluid ounces -- not a weight of 12 avoirdupois ounces.
To "convert" volume (in fluid ounces) to weight (in avoirdupois ounces), we need to know the density of beer -- the weight of a unit volume of beer.
The density of water is close to 1 av. oz. per fl. oz., but not quite. A gallon of water weighs 8.34 pounds. There are 128 fl. oz. in a gallon and 16 av. oz. in a pound, so 128 fl. oz. of water weigh 8.34 * 16 av. oz. and therefore 1 fl. oz. of water weighs 8.34 * 16 / 128 av. oz.
= 1.0425 av. oz.
Thus 25 fl. oz. of water weigh 25 * 1.0425 av. oz. = 26.0625 av. oz. The density of beer will be close to that of water, but we can't say exactly what it is. Here is a web site that lists several measurements of the density of beers:
Density of Beer: The Physics Factbook, edited by Glenn Elert
http://hypertextbook.com/facts/2000/BlairElefant.shtml
It indicates that the density of beer is something like 5% greater than the density of water (1 g/cm). Thus 25 fl. oz. of beer will weigh closer to 27.4 av. oz.
Don't forget that this doesn't include the weight of the empty mug!
- Doctor Rick, The Math Forum
http://mathforum.org/dr.math/
Red Flag 1
01-26-2010, 12:46
Thanks TS!!
Finally, a beer specs calculator!!!!
RF 1
Dozer523
01-26-2010, 13:07
Aparantly Dr. Math failed to notice the question came from a "a cocktail waitress here in Vegas" who had "taken science and math classes, but never did grasp any of it."
He was probably just excited he was going to get to say . . . "convert" volume (in fluid ounces) to weight (in avoirdupois ounces), we need to . . . "
(Ohhhhhhhh doctor, that sounds dirty! are you realllllly a doctor?") Hope he got a phone number or something before her head exploded.:p
My Reason For Living (who sells food for a living with one of the largest food service Companies in the world) says that it isn't the recipe gone bad. It's that tomatoes were especially crappy this year. Her company was actually forced to buy tomatoes from
(wait for it; no sh!t)
Canada! Aye!
That's an interesting possibility. Thank you!
Another equally plausible reason for the apparent decline in the quality of your condiments is jaded taste buds (or faulty memories of "how good it used to be"). Kick it up a notch with some horseradish. Do you have a cold? Most of taste is actually smell. (Something else the horseradish will cure! :D) Lots of supporting characters in your cast of reasons.
The faulty memories are a possibility - I find that more problematic each year. ;)
But I first noticed the issue during the transition from glass bottles to plastic squeeze bottles. The ketchup just seems different - different thickness, different appearance, different taste. The change is subtle, but seems real.
I like your idea of adding some horseradish - but for decongestion, I find a few minutes in a steam room are even better. Mountain cedar used to cause some allergies to kick in, but 3 steam room sessions per week has eliminated the problem. It is a very pleasant cure!
dr. mabuse
01-26-2010, 23:01
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Got to be related to the transition from cane sugar to high fructose corn syrup in everything.
I wouldn't be surprised.
In San Antonio, we can sometimes obtain Coca Cola produced in Mexico. They use pure cane sugar, in contrast to the corn syrup used here. The taste is remarkably better.
dr. mabuse
01-27-2010, 17:36
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It seems I have found my answer. The problem is high fructose corn syrup.
HEB - a regional supermarket - has started putting out some products under their own label. Their ketchup used cane sugar and no corn syrup. The taste was far, far better.
So, read the labels and avoid the corn syrup. Ketchup can taste good again! :lifter