View Full Version : Wizards' dispute a 'stain' on NBA
LongWire
01-03-2010, 04:29
Shocking or Not? Bad for the NBA is right, who thinks there aren't "Thugs" in the NBA, or any other Major sport for that matter.
I'm betting that the guns weren't unloaded as claimed, and that the team management/lawyer is covering up that fact. Who brings an unloaded gun anywhere?
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http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/01/03/SP5G1BCPOT.DTL
Wizards' dispute a 'stain' on NBA
Rusty Simmons, Chronicle Staff Writer
Sunday, January 3, 2010
(01-03) 04:00 PST PORTLAND - --
Reports this weekend of two Washington players pulling guns on each other reverberated across the country to the Warriors' locker room and affected each NBA city in between.
"People who read this might not pay full attention as the story develops," guard Stephen Curry said. "All they see or hear is 'players with guns,' and that's going to be a negative mark on the league.
"Even if it turns out to have been blown out of proportion or completely untrue, it's a negative stain on the league."
On Thursday, reports surfaced of a dispute between Washington Wizards guards Gilbert Arenas and Javaris Crittenton. The altercation allegedly escalated from a disagreement on the team plane Dec. 19 to a gun-presenting standoff after practice Dec. 21.
Arenas told the Associated Press on Saturday that it was "bad judgment" to bring unloaded guns into the Wizards' locker room, and he has a meeting with law enforcements authorities Monday. He had previously tweeted, "I wake up ... and see I'm the new John Wayne. Media is too funny."
Regardless of how the story plays out from here, it will tarnish the league's long fight against the stigma that its players are "thugs" and all of the negative connotations that go along with that word.
The Warriors interviewed said they didn't know any players on the team with guns, and Curry added, "I couldn't name one guy in the NBA who would brandish a gun."
The NBA collective bargaining agreement prohibits firearms at league facilities. The clause was added in 2005, following a 2002 incident involving Chris Mills - then a teammate of Arenas' with the Warriors. After a fight with Portland's Bonzi Wells, Mills allegedly pulled a weapon on the Blazers' team bus.
"Of course, this is bad for the league," center Andris Biedrins said. "We can't have things like that happen."
Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/01/03/SP5G1BCPOT.DTL#ixzz0bXlMVsFB
Ret10Echo
01-03-2010, 05:53
"Washington" Wizards....now, I don't follow the NBA but I do follow the news and anti-gun legislation. These two chumps were (allegedly) at the practice facility in downtown Washington right? Surprising that they have carry permits.
L.W. I don't find it shocking, regardless of the truth of the story. I think it reinforces the opinions of those who look down on most professional athletes and it elevates these wannabe losers in the eyes of the thug society they appear to represent.
Maybe next time they will be loaded.
BigJimCalhoun
01-03-2010, 09:31
Can we change the name back to the "Washington Bullets?"
Why is it that humanity somehow grossly over-associates money and fame with "class" and legitimacy?
Money doesn't equal class... hell just look at Dennis Rodman.
How many celebrities fail to pay child support, get arrested for drug abuse, beat their spouses and girl friends, etc etc etc...
I've met dirt farmers in Afghanistan that have more class than many of our American celebrities and cultural "heros"
Thugs. Nothing more nothing less...
The Reaper
01-03-2010, 10:09
Let me ask a question.
If two PS.com board members (or any normal citizens) were caught brandishing firearms and threatening one another in a public place in DC, do you think the discussion would be taking place without us visiting jail, or at least the courtroom?
Some animals are more equal than others, indeed.
I would say that Stephen Curry is not just a rookie, but also has his head solidly in the sand. He cannot name a single NBA player who would do this, and he knows two who actually did:rolleyes:
TR
hahaha... SO true in our current society
"ALL ANIMALS ARE EQUAL, BUT SOME ANIMALS ARE MORE EQUAL THAN OTHERS."
Utah Bob
01-03-2010, 18:49
If the NBA gets another stain on it, how can you tell? Just business as usual. :rolleyes:
Imagine the scandal if it had been two MLB players . Front page news for weeks.
I say give all guns, lock them in a room and let them see who the best gangster is..
ZonieDiver
01-03-2010, 19:40
I would say that Stephen Curry is not just a rookie, but also has his head solidly in the sand.
I could have sworn his head was "elsewhere"! (i.e. "4th point of contact):D
Wizards' dispute a 'stain' on NBA
Rusty Simmons, Chronicle Staff Writer
It is interesting that Mr. Simmons wants to talk about "stains" on the NBA but he is consistently silent on the front office and coaching issues that plague the team he covers. Two guys maybe draw weapons on each other and Mr. Simmons expresses moral outrage. He covers a team that steals millions of dollars a year from Warriors fans by letting Don Nelson run the team, and he consistently writes about how things are looking up, and what a great bunch of guys are on the Warriors roster.:rolleyes:Regardless of how the story plays out from here, it will tarnish the league's long fight against the stigma that its players are "thugs" and all of the negative connotations that go along with that word.It is good to know that one can always count on a journalist to tell us what is going to happen in the future regardless of what facts are known (or not known) in the present.
FWIW, Mr. Simmons's article not only contradicts itself but willfully ignores the alleged facts as reported by other outlets. Source is here (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/01/02/AR2010010202018.html?nav=hcmoduletmv).Multiple sources have confirmed that Crittenton became upset with Arenas over a card game on Washington's team flight from Phoenix on Dec. 19. Crittenton was annoyed about losing money in the game. After Arenas mocked Crittenton, the two began arguing with trash talk escalating, according to sources. A person who was on the plane and witnessed the squabble said Crittenton joked with Arenas that he would shoot him in his left knee, which has kept him sidelined for much of the past two seasons.
When the players arrived for practice on Dec. 21, Arenas placed three guns on a chair next to Crittenton with a note that read, "Pick one." Two sources said the guns were the same guns Arenas had brought to the arena following the birth of his third child early last month. Arenas, according to sources, was expecting Crittenton to see it as a joke, based on his earlier comments. But Crittenton wasn't laughing. He grew enraged and tossed one of the guns across the room, saying that he had his own gun, according to a person who was in the locker room at the time.
According to a league source, when President Ernie Grunfeld was informed of the incident shortly thereafter and he immediately called the league office, which led to an investigation that CBSSports.com first reported on Dec. 24. Grunfeld, according to the same source, has been in communication with the league office on a daily basis.
NBA Commissioner David Stern has yet to make a public statement about the situation, but he has a history of coming down hard on players for off-court incidents that place others in danger. The collective bargaining agreement bans firearms from league facilities.
The NBA and the Wizards have both said they will wait until legal authorities complete their investigation before deciding on a punishment for Arenas and Crittenton. They both could face stiff fines and suspensions. My two cents, the account above tracks better with what is known publicly about Arenas, who has a well deserved reputation for having a mercurial sense of humor and known for moments of questionable judgment rather than being a "thug" or a "gangster."
FWIW, the Washington Post published an account of Mr. Arenas's youth in 2006. That article is available here (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/28/AR2006102800830.html).And by the way, for those who may not follow closely the Association, it may well be worth noting that there's speculation that the story is not just being driven by the facts but by the front offices of teams (including the Wizards) to engineer trades for Mr. Arenas. Source is here (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/01/03/AR2010010302215.html) and there (http://www.mikejonessports.com/2010/01/bad-breakup-more-likely-than-happy.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+MikeJonesSports+%28Mike+Jones+S ports%29).
So before one concludes that this is story is just another example of a certain category of professional athlete being this or not being that, maybe it is also an example of a certain category of ownership seeking to avoid taking responsibility for poor leadership, deficient vision, bad managerial decisions (i.e. the hiring of certain GMs and coaches), and just putting out a crappy brand of basketball.
Just my two cents.
So before one concludes that this is story is just another example of a certain category of professional athlete being this or not being that, maybe it is also an example of a certain category of ownership seeking to avoid taking responsibility for poor leadership, deficient vision, bad managerial decisions (i.e. the hiring of certain GMs and coaches), and just putting out a crappy brand of basketball.
Just my two cents.
I wish i could pull a weapon on some folks at work, then say i was joking, then have people say it's not my fault and defend me by accusing lack of leadership at work. To be exempt of all responsibility of right or wrong would be nice every once in a while if my leaders are to take the heat for it.
...so then am I to assume there are three levels of responsibility beyond the actual ball player that just has an 'odd' sense of humor?
the coach
the GM
the Owner
Now if I am to put this into perspective:
A soldier does the same thing, instead we let him slide and blame:
the recruiter
drill sgt
current company cdr
...somehow I thing Joe Snuffy would find himself behind bars waiting for the ink to dry on his 'field grade AR-15'
The entire 'pro-sports' industry is little more than a dog and pony show. The owners look the other way until it benefits them to show some moral outrage.
That still doesn't excuse the "professional" athletes from acting like "professionals".
overall... I could care less: I don't follow sports any more.
My point is simply this.
These days when there's agreement with the thrust of a news story or an editorial, the article generally receives a lot less critical inquiry than items with which there's disagreement.
IMO, the fourth estate and its associates in the blogosphere are counting on that kind of a reaction. By fostering this dynamic, they keep Americans on their agenda when they should be accommodating ours.
In this instance, is the story really about "spoiled athletes" in the Association or is the story about the news media and their whispering campaign against the Second Amendment?
YMMV.I wish i could pull a weapon on some folks at work, then say i was joking, then have people say it's not my fault and defend me by accusing lack of leadership at work. To be exempt of all responsibility of right or wrong would be nice every once in a while if my leaders are to take the heat for it.Stickey--
First, please show me where I said that Mr. Arenas or Mr. Crittenton should not be held responsible for their actions.
Second, IIRC, you're an educator at the start of his career. It may be worth your while to touch base with a mentor or a college you trust about incidents in which accusations of wrongdoing in the workplace turn things upside down before an investigation even takes place.
Third, please correct me if I'm misreading you, but you seem to be saying that were it not for the consequences you'd behave like Mr. Arenas.
Ret10Echo
01-05-2010, 05:44
...somehow I thing Joe Snuffy would find himself behind bars waiting for the ink to dry on his 'field grade AR-15'
The entire 'pro-sports' industry is little more than a dog and pony show. The owners look the other way until it benefits them to show some moral outrage.
That still doesn't excuse the "professional" athletes from acting like "professionals".
overall... I could care less: I don't follow sports any more.
Well Billy, I guess we get to see what sort of sense of humor the Feds have and how far up or down the foodchain this goes. Maybe some space in the Burris suite?
....oh and by the way...they are now HIGH POWERED HANDGUNS...:eek: The clown car is getting pretty full on this one already. Should reach critical mass shortly.
Front Page of this morning's Washington Examiner:
Grand jury mulling gun charges against Wizards' Gilbert Arenas
By: Bill Myers
Examiner Staff Writer
January 5, 2010
Federal prosecutors have convened a grand jury to explore an incident in which Washington Wizards All-Star Gilbert Arenas allegedly brandished high-powered handguns in the team locker room, The Examiner has learned.
Arenas and his lawyer, former U.S. Attorney Ken Wainstein, huddled with police and prosecutors Monday afternoon trying to explain the Dec. 21 incident with teammate Javaris Crittenton. There have been conflicting reports about whether the two men faced off in an angry confrontation over gambling debts or whether displaying the weapons was part of a bad joke.
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/local/Grand-jury-mulling-gun-charges-against-Wizards_-Gilbert-8718511-80662317.html
Dozer523
01-05-2010, 07:21
Now if I am to put this into perspective:
A soldier does the same thing, instead we let him slide and blame:
the recruiter
drill sgt
current company cdr
...somehow I thing Joe Snuffy would find himself behind bars waiting for the ink to dry on his 'field grade AR-15'. Never seen a "Command Climate Witch Hunt"? Had a Company Commander in Afghanistan who had his "Command Climate" investigated after an Neg Dis in formation. Turns out the young man had been set up after he got into a barracks fight the day before. The MP investigation revealed the SL and some of the squad mates had been hazing him for months. (With photos of smiling faces, duct tape and tea-bagging.) There was no way the PSG and PL could not have know of it, and tacitly encouraged it. SL was relieved and busted. Nothing for the PSG / PL. Company Commander was relieved and exiled to the other side of the country . . . . "Command Climate".
Oh and the 15-6 Investigating Officer a female transportation officer.
LongWire
01-05-2010, 08:35
SL was relieved and busted. Nothing for the PSG / PL. Company Commander was relieved and exiled to the other side of the country . . . . "Command Climate".
Oh and the 15-6 Investigating Officer a female transportation officer.
That amount of oversight and non common sense type of thinking is appalling!!!!
Let me know when they find Jimmy Hoffa's body or a 'real' tooth belonging to John the Baptist and I might pretend to be interested in anything the NBA does or does not do anymore.
And so it goes...;)
Richard's $.02 :munchin
bandycpa
01-05-2010, 08:54
Is this comparable to what Plaxico Burress did? As I recall, Burress accepted a plea deal for 2 years prison time for his gunplay.
Bandy
YMMV.Stickey--
First, please show me where I said that Mr. Arenas or Mr. Crittenton should not be held responsible for their actions.
Not they shouldnt be, but how can they're leadership be accountable?
Second, IIRC, you're an educator at the start of his career. It may be worth your while to touch base with a mentor or a college you trust about incidents in which accusations of wrongdoing in the workplace turn things upside down before an investigation even takes place.
The comment was a general statement and reflected a general person with the use of myself as that person. I assume[d] that the generality would have been understand...picked up on. Your unnecessary concern for my mental well-being are appreciated, regardless of the patronization that could be inferred.
Third, please correct me if I'm misreading you, but you seem to be saying that were it not for the consequences you'd behave like Mr. Arenas.
You are misreading me. Again, generalities seem to escape even the most educated, always looking for something deeper, to in-turn confound and flatter others.
Your unnecessary concern for my mental well-being are appreciated, regardless of the patronization that could be inferred.In regards to your conclusion that I am patronizing you, I would point out the irony.teacher (aka "babysitter" at times)You are misreading me. Again, generalities seem to escape even the most educated, always looking for something deeper, to in-turn confound and flatter others.With respect, I am not looking for something deeper. Instead, I'm reading your posts assuming that you mean what you write.
Bluntly, my concern is not for your mental well-being. My concern is for your students. You have demonstrated consistently an interesting perspective towards life choices and cultural sensibilities with which you disagree. It is my perception that, rather than striving to educate young people and to provide them with sustainable examples of how they might live their lives differently, you would rather control them. A recent example of this dynamic follows.<<SNIP>>
This is the problem with the youth, especially those from inner-city. We can't prevent them from watching them on MTV or the internet, but why allow these thugs to have access to our youth, like ESPN/Under Armor has done today and events that should be reinforcing positive behavior and civility?
<<SNIP>>In your distaste for "a joke and a disgrace" of a half time performance for an entertainer you liken to a "thug," you assume that viewers in the stands at and home are incapable of mediating the difference between entertainment and reality without your intervention.
And what of that intervention? You tell us that you "[couldn't] find the email addresses for the head-honchos at ESPN/ABC/UnderArmour/etc..." Yet, the top of the ESPN food chain is only as far away as the Magic Kingdom's management team's website, which is here (http://corporate.disney.go.com/corporate/management_team.html). The person you might want to contact is this guy <<LINK (http://corporate.disney.go.com/corporate/bios/george_bodenheimer.html)>>.
Sigaba,
I will try to keep this short and simple as we obviously agree to disagree on perspectives and it is quite possible that much meaning is lost/created in written text on forums.
....Bluntly, my concern is not for your mental well-being. My concern is for your students. You have demonstrated consistently an interesting perspective towards life choices and cultural sensibilities with which you disagree. It is my perception that, rather than striving to educate young people and to provide them with sustainable examples of how they might live their lives differently, you would rather control them. A recent example of this dynamic follows.In your distaste for "a joke and a disgrace" of a half time performance for an entertainer you liken to a "thug," you assume that viewers in the stands at and home are incapable of mediating the difference between entertainment and reality without your intervention.
Not trying to control them. Any staff member/administrator would agree that i am one of the most open minded and tolerant teachers they have had. Teaching kids the difference between right and wrong is necessary, but it is also necessary to continue to reinforce it. I can sit a child in front of vegetables or candy and teach them the benefits of the veggies over the candy, and the marjority would choose the candy over the veggies. So do i just sit back and let them eat candy, knowing the harm it could cause? You can guide a horse to water but can't make it drink, but that does't mean you don't keep taking it to the water, and sit back and hope with a bunch of ideals that they will drink. A thug is a thug, i would hope that they would be able to differentiate between the reality of it and the entertainment part of it. But if we flip the roles, and say someone in a political position did the things that these "thugs" do, would we or should just shrug off their lack of morals and ethics they display when they're on their own time and consider them solely politicians when on the clock and accept their behavior as such for our young to experience? I wouldnt think so, but again, that's my perspective.
And what of that intervention? You tell us that you "[couldn't] find the email addresses for the head-honchos at ESPN/ABC/UnderArmour/etc..." Yet, the top of the ESPN food chain is only as far away as the Magic Kingdom's management team's website, which is here (http://corporate.disney.go.com/corporate/management_team.html). The person you might want to contact is this guy <<LINK (http://corporate.disney.go.com/corporate/bios/george_bodenheimer.html)>>.
The link and names on the entire site provided no email addresses or POC. They didnt the first time i searched for it and they didnt when you attempted to guide me there.
Babysitting..., ask any teacher that is in touch with reality and pose the question, "do you feel that you are babysitting at times?", they would say yes. There are always those 2-3 students that will never respond to any type of motivation (positive, negative, common sense talks, begging, pleading, etc...) I know that's not what the texts, thesis, etc...would have us believe from our education classes, but put in military terms, "it only briefs well". Just not reality.
.02
Maybe the craft has changed but the professional educators who taught me teaching never compared young people to "babies" or to "horses." They quietly impressed upon me the utility of believing that students should be treated first, second, and third as human beings.
I respectfully disagree with the notion that it is within an educator's authority to teach students morality. Nor do I agree with the notion that lessons on ethics should go beyond academic integrity and other elements of an institution's policies. I was trained that it is a teachers job to teach students how to think, not what to think.
In regards to your campaign to stop "thugs" from ruining the lives of "inner city" youths, I remain highly skeptical. You suggest a scenario in which we "flip roles," yet, by your comments on "thugs," it is evident that you decline the opportunity to do just that.
While you decry the alleged ethical and moral lapses of one component of American mass popular culture, your silence on other components is curious. The most avid consumers of hip hop "thuggery" are not "inner city" youths you want to rescue <<LINK (http://online.wsj.com/public/article_print/SB111521814339424546.html)>>.Additionally, more Americans consume the brand of "thuggery" produced by the WWE than that of any hip hop singer or allegedly displayed in sporting events--with the exception of a handful of NBA games and other marquee contests <<LINK2 (http://tvbythenumbers.com/2010/01/05/cable-ratings-lots-of-football-wwe-raw-spongebob-ncis-dominate-weekly-cable-charts/37746)>>. (From the data, it is clear that the true culprit is the guy wearing square pants, not the asshats and their insipid hype men wearing baggy pants. I mean, for crimminy sake, how much does a Patagonia tech web belt cost these days?)
The link and names on the entire site provided no email addresses or POC. They didnt the first time i searched for it and they didnt when you attempted to guide me there.Google is broken? One can only communicate by email?...[T]he biggest disappointment are the students that do not want to learn. . . .I have tried to spoon feed these kids the quiz and test material, throwing blatant hints as to what is going to be on them and what the answers are, and still, because they don't care, they still fail. What my fellow teachers are saying makes sense, the students that show effort are the students that have decent parents that support the idea of a good education. The other students come from families that don't care, therefore, they do not care.So based upon this formulation, what does your level of effort to find relevant contact information and to communicate effectively your displeasure over the game in question say?
Surgicalcric
01-06-2010, 21:48
Stickey and Sigaba - time to take it to PM.
Crip
LongWire
01-07-2010, 09:57
Update- Big Surprise right????
http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/01/new-details-emerge-in-wizards-gun-incident.html
I don't care for the sport of basketball, but I watch Sportscenter and they of course talk about this. This picture is what sent it over the top. This man does not see anything wrong with what he did and you could see that in this picture which was during the starting line up intro before the game. When David Stern (NBA commissioner) saw this he indefinitely suspended him. I'd say kick the both of them out of the NBA. Its ridiculous, what kind of an example they are setting as professional athletes.