DISCOVERY CHANNEL - SFAS

[Richard]

Announced today.

Richard

WOULD YOU BE TOUGH ENOUGH?

DISCOVERY CHANNEL REVEALS THE GRUELING GREEN BERET SPECIAL FORCES SELECTION PROCESS IN TWO WEEKS IN HELL

-- World premiere special airs December 20 at 8 PM ET/PT on Discovery Channel --

The U.S. Army Special Forces (Green Berets) are America's elite warfare specialists. Who are they and what does it take to become one? Discovery Channel gives viewers an unprecedented close-up look at the brutal two-week training that separates the wannabes from the Berets in the two-hour world premiere of TWO WEEKS IN HELL airing on Sunday, December 20 at 8:00 PM ET/PT.

Over 14 days, a candidate's true character is exposed through physical and mental challenges. Discovery Channel was granted special access to document this grueling test of wills and wits from the inside for TWO WEEKS IN HELL. The Green Berets rely on creative, innovative, and stealthy tactics to destabilize an enemy from within a hostile environment. A Green Beret candidate may think he's the right man for the job, but the Special Forces Assessment and Selection (SFAS) will find out. The selection process is a brutal test designed to mentally and physically smash men down to their core.

The unique, first-hand access of TWO WEEKS IN HELL takes viewers deep inside the world of America's Green Berets. The Green Berets know exactly what they are looking for, and the SFAS cadre will twist the minds and destroy the bodies of those candidates who want the part. Everything at selection has a reason, but it's like no other selection process in the world. For those who try out, it's an avalanche of chaos, stress, and doubt.

They come from all across America, from both the military and civilian lives and most have no idea what they are really getting into. Only then will Special Forces know if they want to invest in what is left. Sixty percent of the candidates will not last the two weeks -- and passing this test is just for the opportunity to start real Green Beret training. SFAS has only one purpose: To find those candidates who have the physical and emotional ability to become Green Berets.

[deepblack 18x]

Thanks for the heads up Richard.

[Dusty]

I went thru the last easy class, myself. Actually gained weight during Phase I patrolling.

The only hard part was the day one ruck run with Bad Bob Howard. Lotta guys bounced the gate hard that night!

[head]

Thanks, will check it out.

I hadn't realized SFAS is now down to 2 weeks.

[Daweism]

QP Richard, excellent find, I will definitely check it out, thank you.

[ck333]

Thanks for the heads up Richard!

SFAS is still three weeks. I am awaiting orders for the January SFAS and it is still the 23 day course. Discovery must have filmed this during the time frame when SFAS was two-weeks and decided to keep it titled "Two weeks in Hell", rather than update the title to be more current.

CK

[Basenshukai]

I was in Camp Mackall when they were filming this. One afternoon I'm running PT with my German Shepherd along the airfield and I saw their cameras film the students running there as well. I think my dog and I ruined the shot. But, I was wearing 7th SFG PTs ... :)

[cback0220]

I saw a rough cut edition of it. Seemed well done, there was no narration in the version I saw. But there were a lot of candidates throwing up during log PT:lifter

[mojaveman]

I wish that I were young again and had the chance to go through SFAS just to experience it. In the old days we had pre-phase and I seem to remember it consisting of three weeks of tortuous PT in addition to some insane rucking and also some abbreviated land navigation training.

[armymom1228]

Should be interesting, thanks Richard.
AM

[BRAVO-SMASH]

there were a lot of candidates throwing up during log PT:lifter

Ah... The fresh stench of puke in the pit during pre-jump. Yum.

[The Reaper]

I saw a rough cut edition of it. Seemed well done, there was no narration in the version I saw. But there were a lot of candidates throwing up during log PT:lifter

That's just chumming.

One of the few times it is good to be short is under the log.

TR

[Defender968]

But there were a lot of candidates throwing up during log PT:lifter

I don't suppose it showed them putting their weakness in their pockets did it, I can’t imagine that would make for good tv! :D

[JJ_BPK]

Announced today.


After reading this, I think I need to read Lt Col Joe's book,,

Just to be prepared to watch the show... :D:eek::D:eek:

Thanks Richard..

[crockett18]

I saw the previews for this and man. One guy had a bloody nose that was gushing. It looks like a good eye-opening show.

Crockett18

[CSB]

I hope the presentation reflects the serious stress inducement and testing/evaluation that is taking place, perhaps by looking "over the shoulder" of the evaluators as they pull out clipboards/notepads, take notes and point out the motivational, leadership and stamina skills present or lacking in the candidates.

It would be too easy to simply describe "two/three weeks of hell" and make it look like an out of control frat party hazing, or a meaningless "manly-men doing manly things in manly ways" rite of passage instead of a finely tuned ASSESSMENT that has led to a pipeline of the finest UW warriors the world has ever known.

(And no, being a gray hair, I didn't have to go through SFAS. Ours was a less structured -- but I believe no less intensive and demanding -- individual selection process).

[Daweism]

I saw the previews for this and man. One guy had a bloody nose that was gushing. It looks like a good eye-opening show.

Crockett18

Wonder if they will give us a good look at "Nasty Nick", I attempted to look for videos of it on youtube, my efforts were in vain.

[KW9598]

im glad im not young and dont have to experience it again

[dadof18x'er]

Wonder if they will give us a good look at "Nasty Nick", I attempted to look for videos of it on youtube, my efforts were in vain.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjrWkLPqUZs

[armymom1228]

Wonder if they will give us a good look at "Nasty Nick", I attempted to look for videos of it on youtube, my efforts were in vain.

I am sure there are parts that will never see public light of day. But here is the preview. Go to the Discovery Channel website and search for "Two weeks in Hell"

http://dsc.discovery.com/videos/two-weeks-in-hell-nasty-nick.html

[KW9598]

I bet a lot will agree...Im not sure how advantageous it is to reveal things like SFAS...even edited. Whats the purpose....recruitment? I remembering talking to Discovery producer Gordon Forbes during shooting of the 3 night, 10 hour SEAL special about differences in USSF and SEALs...he never did get it. Some people think only one way...entertainment first.

90% of the anxiety, fear, and despair while going into things like BUDs, SFAS, is not knowing whats going to happen. Was for me at least.

Nice to know these days all you have to do is pop on the tube before your trip to Bragg and get a good idea for what awaits you.

Discovery Channel will benefit from this, but how does the Regiment?

[Abu-Shakra]

I bet a lot will agree...Im not sure how advantageous it is to reveal things like SFAS...even edited. Whats the purpose....recruitment? I remembering talking to Discovery producer Gordon Forbes during shooting of the 3 night, 10 hour SEAL special about differences in USSF and SEALs...he never did get it. Some people think only one way...entertainment first.

90% of the anxiety, fear, and despair while going into things like BUDs, SFAS, is not knowing whats going to happen. Was for me at least.

Nice to know these days all you have to do is pop on the tube before your trip to Bragg and get a good idea for what awaits you.

Discovery Channel will benefit from this, but how does the Regiment?

I don't know. I'm sure a lot of the older guys and old school guys will not like it. The cynic in me is saying "What's the point?". But I'm going to have to watch it and judge then. It seems like it's going to dampen some of the mysticism surrounding SFAS and SF.

Ultimately, it's cheap entertainment. I know I will be sitting from the comfort of my couch watching, laughing, drinking a beer and saying "Oh, that sucks".

[KW9598]

exactly....and to me that takes a lot from the mystic and respect those organizations hold in their selection process. Nobody should know anything about it..until you're in it :)

[armymom1228]

exactly....and to me that takes a lot from the mystic and respect those organizations hold in their selection process. Nobody should know anything about it..until you're in it :)

Agreed, OTOH, It could also spur someone that could end up being an asset to SF into attending SFAS. It is very much, in some respects the Sword of Damocles.

[greenberetTFS]

im glad im not young and dont have to experience it again

I'm glad I'm old and never had to experience it at all..................:rolleyes::eek::p

Big Teddy :munchin

[KW9598]

I'm not sure about the Sword of Damocles, but if someone needs a hollywood-ized special to spark their interest, may not be the right person. With that said, there's a lot of guys out there that were inspired by Robin Moore, etc. The difference is, the newer versions in my opinion give to much access to the real process.

[mojaveman]

Interesting thread.

I did a search but was unable to identify the year that SFAS was initiated.

Just curious.

[The Reaper]

Interesting thread.

I did a search but was unable to identify the year that SFAS was initiated.

Just curious.

Somewhere around 1988 or so, initially as SFOT, which became SFAS.

It was a real gut check back then, culminating in an ungodly ruck march back to Bragg.

TR

[armymom1228]

Somewhere around 1988 or so, initially as SFOT, which became SFAS.

It was a real gut check back then, culminating in an ungodly ruck march back to Bragg.

TR

So what did you guys do before then, to 'get selected' and what was the 'selection'?
AM

[Dusty]

I'm not sure about the Sword of Damocles, but if someone needs a hollywood-ized special to spark their interest, may not be the right person. With that said, there's a lot of guys out there that were inspired by Robin Moore, etc. The difference is, the newer versions in my opinion give to much access to the real process.


Shows my age.

When I went to Mackall, it was called the Sword of Demosthenes.

;)

[mojaveman]

So what did you guys do before then, to 'get selected' and what was the 'selection'?
AM

Before SFAS was enacted SF candidates went through three weeks of "pre-phase" training. Maybe it wasn't as intense as SFAS but I still saw a number of people quit. I also saw a lot of people quit or fail during the SFQC, especially during the land navigation portion of Phase I. After completing the SFQC I can remember some of the younger guys that I went through with getting kicked off of teams or thrown out of Group for doing stupid things. It could be that "selection" in Special Forces continues until the day that you retire.

[The Reaper]

So what did you guys do before then, to 'get selected' and what was the 'selection'?
AM

They washed somewhere around 50% of the class out during pre-Phase, as noted, and then my class lost another 50% of the remainder at Phase I. Some more were lost during Phase II, though most were recycled, and a few were busted in Phase III.

I believe that my class had around a 20% graduation rate.

The real issue was that people would apply for SF and PCS to the SFQC, then fail the PT test on Day 1. Then they were assigned to any available MOS and rank position on Bragg. An unsurprising number of people used that technique to get out of unpleasant and overseas assignments and get back to Bragg. Some more than once.

TR

[blue02hd]

They washed somewhere around 50% of the class out during pre-Phase, as noted, and then my class lost another 50% of the remainder at Phase I. Some more were lost during Phase II, though most were recycled, and a few were busted in Phase III.
TR

So let me do the math on this one,,,,

100% - 50% during pre-Phase = 50%. Then you lost another 50% in Phase 1, = 0%, then you lost more in Phase III,,,,?

I'll just stop asking questions now,,,,,,

:D:D:D:D:

[The Reaper]

So let me do the math on this one,,,,

100% - 50% during pre-Phase = 50%. Then you lost another 50% in Phase 1, = 0%, then you lost more in Phase III,,,,?

I'll just stop asking questions now,,,,,,

:D:D:D:D:

You were not the math whiz in school, were you?

100-50%=50.

50-50%=25.

25-20%=20.

TR

[deepblack 18x]

I bet a lot will agree...Im not sure how advantageous it is to reveal things like SFAS...even edited. Whats the purpose....recruitment? I remembering talking to Discovery producer Gordon Forbes during shooting of the 3 night, 10 hour SEAL special about differences in USSF and SEALs...he never did get it. Some people think only one way...entertainment first.

90% of the anxiety, fear, and despair while going into things like BUDs, SFAS, is not knowing whats going to happen. Was for me at least.

Nice to know these days all you have to do is pop on the tube before your trip to Bragg and get a good idea for what awaits you.

Discovery Channel will benefit from this, but how does the Regiment?

I would bet the house that this has something to do with bringing in more guys.

[armymom1228]

You were not the math whiz in school, were you?

100-50%=50.

50-50%=25.

25-20%=20.

TR

Thanks TR, I realize that what you went through and the current SFAS are probably quite different. I am sure each, in its own way, was 'difficult'.
If you had to do it all over again, and, could chose. Which of the two would
you pick?
AM, who is eternally curious.

[18C4V]

Looks like SFAS has changed to a more PRC or Ranger School approach. I went to SFAS prior to 9-11 and I don't remember anyone yelling (except for the primary instructor on the bull horn) at all to include during log and rifle PT. I was expecting SFAS to be like PRC and Ranger School with the smoke sessions. I definately liked the more relax mode of SFAS but it still was a gut check course.

Phase II was like a mini Ranger School with the smoke sessions. RIP SFC Tessar (CTS).

[greenberetTFS]

AM,

Not speaking for TR,but after reading get "Selected" the old way wasn't easy but not as it is now................... ;)

Big Teddy :munchin

[Richard]

Don't know how tough the old courses were compared to today - but as a Medic and looking at the start-drop-add-drop-add-drop-add-drop-add-drop-add-drop rate of all phases of our training - our class graduated 12 medics of nearly 200 program entrants (a few of which were recycled into another MOS).

And so it...went...;)

Richard's $.02 :munchin

[armymom1228]

AM,

Not speaking for TR,but after reading get "Selected" the old way wasn't easy but not as it is now................... ;)

Big Teddy :munchin

Nothing with you guys is ever 'easy'. :D

[kgoerz]

Don't know how tough the old courses were compared to today - but as a Medic and looking at the start-drop-add-drop-add-drop-add-drop-add-drop-add-drop rate of all phases of our training - our class graduated 12 medics of nearly 200 program entrants (a few of which were recycled into another MOS).

And so it...went...;)

Richard's $.02 :munchin

One thing they didn't do when I went thru the old course. Was give Students more then one recycle. You were given one chance at a recycle. Failed any other portion of the course and you were gone.

[echoes]

Nothing with you guys is ever 'easy'. :D

And that's why we luv 'em!!!;)

Just set my TV to record the documentary!:lifter

Holly

[jw74]

Thanks for the heads up on this documentary. It will have to be better than the 4 minutes I just watched on Spike TV of, "SPECIAL FORCES" (it was a bad collection of SWAT videos but the Host called them Special Forces instead of SWAT).

It doesn't take much effort in research to find the appropriate use of the title Special Forces and yet...

Soon there will be Food Network Special Forces: A cadre of top chefs using rail spatulas with surefire lights.

[jrgong]

Hello gentlemen,

There will be a documentary airing tomorrow, December 20th, on the Discovery Channel on SFAS. Here is two clips from youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjrWkLPqUZs&feature=player_embedded
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wpSJZLNFOHs&feature=channel

Enjoy

We've been discussing this topic for over a week now - moved to http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26593

I suggest you use the SEARCH function here before posting - it works well and can save embarrassment.

Richard

[echoes]

Soon there will be Food Network Special Forces: A cadre of top chefs using rail spatulas with surefire lights.

Excuse me for stepping out of my lane, but WTF are you talking about sir?

I find you grandious patheitc argument that SF, when/if Documented properly, is somehow akin to the assanine reality televison shows in production today, rediculous!

Just my .02 civilian opinion! You need to step off of that one, sir, as SF Men were, are, and are always going to be heroes!

Holly

Holly,

Although we certainly appreciate the strength of your support and feelings about SF - I think you misread jw74's post here - I read it as him just being sarcastic about the idea that it seems as if everyone wants to use the SF title nowadays for nearly anything.

Richard

[The Reaper]

Lighten up, Francis.

TR

[jw74]

Excuse me for stepping out of my lane, but WTF are you talking about sir?

I find you grandious patheitc argument that SF, when/if Documented properly, is somehow akin to the assanine reality televison shows in production today, rediculous!

Just my .02 civilian opinion! You need to step off of that one, sir, as SF Men were, are, and are always going to be heroes!

Holly

Holly,

Although we certainly appreciate the strength of your support and feelings about SF - I think you misread jw74's post here - I read it as him just being sarcastic about the idea that it seems as if everyone wants to use the SF title nowadays for nearly anything.

Richard

Richard read me correctly. How you came up with "grandious and patheitc" is beyond me. I have nothing but the highest regard for SF. If it were otherwise, I would not be a member here. The term "Special Forces" has a specific meaning in this country and it is misused constantly in media/entertainment. Words matter. Context matters. If you ever think I am being disrespectful to the men of SF in one of my posts, You are not reading me correctly.

[echoes]

Richard read me correctly. How you came up with "grandious and patheitc" is beyond me. I have nothing but the highest regard for SF. If it were otherwise, I would not be a member here. The term "Special Forces" has a specific meaning in this country and it is misused constantly in media/entertainment. Words matter. Context matters. If you ever think I am being disrespectful to the men of SF in one of my posts, You are not reading me correctly.

Richard--PM recieved, and thank you Sir!

jw, Am kind of a weird chick. See these guys are the real deal, and in a world filled with half-assed wannabees, it means a lot that They allow me to be a guest here...hence my reason for defense, where They are concerned! ( Not that they even need it...LOL!:o:o:o)

Holly

[deepblack 18x]

Anybody see those comments the YOUTUBE folks left on those previews? It's impressive how stupid people are.

[blue02hd]

You were not the math whiz in school, were you?

100-50%=50.

50-50%=25.

25-20%=20.

TR

Sorry TR, I stand corrected. I thought for a moment there that the entire class was dropped AND a few of the cadre were relieved as well. Now that would have been an awesome story!

Don't try to bracket me, I am already moving to a new hide site,,,,,,,

:p:p:p:p

[Richard]

Don't try to bracket me, I am already moving to a new hide site,,,,,,,

You can run but you can't hide...we've got you in our remote viewing sights - and you know what we can do to goats. ;)

Richard's jaded $.02 :munchin

[The Reaper]

Sorry TR, I stand corrected. I thought for a moment there that the entire class was dropped AND a few of the cadre were relieved as well. Now that would have been an awesome story!

Don't try to bracket me, I am already moving to a new hide site,,,,,,,

:p:p:p

As a matter of fact, they relieved about half of our cadre at the end of Phase 1 for abusive behavior. And the NCOIC was banging his right hand man's wife.

But that is another story. :D

TR

[SkiBumCFO]

I think I was a class or two ahead of TR (grad july 84) and I have always said "I went through the last easy class" However, in reality i guess it wasnt that easy. I probably had the same cadre and definitely had the same stats as TR. 500 show up at pre phase, 250 start phase 1 and something over 100 finish Phase 1. lose a few more in phase 2 and a couple in phase 3 and of course the two idiots (both sadly aquantainces of mine) that got a DUI the night before graduation and tossed out and literally shipped to Alaska. Lots of the people that failed out ended up in the 82nd as they had already PCSd to Bragg. TDY to a selection process makes a lot more sense to me. I didnt realize that a bunch of the Cadre were relieved. TR - was SSG Tacia still one of the TACs when you went through? Will always remember that guy. I am somewhat bothered by all the info out there and think some of the mystery of the course is gone but if the process still produces a high quality SF Soldier then i guess it isnt all that bad.

[armymom1228]

Richard read me correctly. How you came up with "grandious and patheitc" is beyond me. I have nothing but the highest regard for SF. If it were otherwise, I would not be a member here. The term "Special Forces" has a specific meaning in this country and it is misused constantly in media/entertainment. Words matter. Context matters. If you ever think I am being disrespectful to the men of SF in one of my posts, You are not reading me correctly.

JW, get your smelling salts out, then go to the discovery channel and do a search for "special forces". Yeah....I be the QP's didn't know the SEALs had been reanamed. :rolleyes:

As for Special Forces Chefs. I have seen a LOT Of food porn in my life. The ONLY way I am going to turn on the Food channel these days and risk my backside getting biggger is IF those QP chefs cook naked in thier 'beenies'..
I plead under the influence tonight..:D:p
AM

[pjody187]

Hope discovery puts the full episode on their site so I can watch it. Can't afford cable these days :boohoo

[deepblack 18x]

Hope discovery puts the full episode on their site so I can watch it. Can't afford cable these days :boohoo

I'm sure it will be all over youtube soon enough.

[NousDefionsDoc]

Sleeping during night land nav? Walking around with headlights (and on)? ROTFLMAO!

Bear Martin and Richmond Nail would have killed us!

[The Reaper]

Good program.

Too much yelling, IMHO.

Maybe the cut down to two weeks requires a big smoker early in the course. Or maybe it is the younger age of the candidates.

I am not a fan of the technique. Tell the candidates what to do and let them go.

The biometric monitoring is something that has been needed for a long time. Glad to see it added.

For those thinking that they will G2 the course from this show, I suspect that it has already changed significantly. Good luck.

TR

[Surgicalcric]

Good program.

Too much yelling, IMHO.

Maybe the cut down to two weeks requires a big smoker early in the course. Or maybe it is the younger age of the candidates.

I am not a fan of the technique. Tell the candidates what to do and let them go...

I concur.

I dont remember the cadre yelling during log/rifle PT and we had quite a few VW's that morning...

I know a couple guys who had gone thru the 24-day version and were med drops who went back to the 14-day and both of them said the 24-day version was easier on the body but harder on the mind (due to down time)...

[NousDefionsDoc]

I see sarcasm is still the training tool of choice.

I don't care for the "encouragement" either.

[Grey1]

Good program.

Too much yelling, IMHO.

Maybe the cut down to two weeks requires a big smoker early in the course. Or maybe it is the younger age of the candidates.

I am not a fan of the technique. Tell the candidates what to do and let them go.

The biometric monitoring is something that has been needed for a long time. Glad to see it added.

For those thinking that they will G2 the course from this show, I suspect that it has already changed significantly. Good luck.

TR


Is it possible that the yelling is a result of producers wanting a more "dramatic" show? I mean, someone, somewhere gave this a green light... is that same person one that could dictate the "mood" of the course to pander to hollywood? From the old school gents I have talked to, the lack of yelling/screaming in the course is designed to weed out those that don't possess the depth of faith in themselves to push themselves to excellence without being coached to it.

I still have yet to see the program tonight (going off the previews and other comments so far), we are hours behind regular times for shows. Just my .02

I have other thoughts on the possible reasons behind the presentation, but I'll keep those to myself for now. Time for evening PT before the show :lifter

[The Reaper]

Is it possible that the yelling is a result of producers wanting a more "dramatic" show? I mean, someone, somewhere gave this a green light... is that same person one that could dictate the "mood" of the course to pander to hollywood? From the old school gents I have talked to, the lack of yelling/screaming in the course is designed to weed out those that don't possess the depth of faith in themselves to push themselves to excellence without being coached to it.

I still have yet to see the program tonight (going off the previews and other comments so far), we are hours behind regular times for shows. Just my .02

I have other thoughts on the possible reasons behind the presentation, but I'll keep those to myself for now. Time for evening PT before the show :lifter

No.

You should keep your opinion and questions to yourself until you have seen the video, and probably till you have been selected.

Best of luck, and stay out of The Monkey Bar.

TR

[MackallResident]

I enjoyed the program. Saw a couple of places I recognize(I believe), at least nasty nick. I was talking to my buddy at Carson on and off throughout, and he said it was similar to what he went through(he finished the whole shebang earlier this year). I think it was great for Discovery to put it out there.

I wish it was in my best interest to be assessed, but I am going a different route to the unconventional Army, so you "candidates" give it your best shot, and I'll give you a ride in a few years ;)

Keep the faith, MC

[chapollin]

good program! now back to pt! :lifter:lifter:lifter I'LL be there in few months

[deepblack 18x]

good program! now back to pt! :lifter:lifter:lifter I'LL be there in few months

Don't lie to the board, the GT score you told me you had does not make you qualified for training.

[Defender968]

Good program.

Too much yelling, IMHO.

Maybe the cut down to two weeks requires a big smoker early in the course. Or maybe it is the younger age of the candidates.

I am not a fan of the technique. Tell the candidates what to do and let them go.

The biometric monitoring is something that has been needed for a long time. Glad to see it added.

For those thinking that they will G2 the course from this show, I suspect that it has already changed significantly. Good luck.

TR


TR in our class there was not that much yelling, still plenty of sarcasm, but mostly in a lowered voice, during log pt there was yelling, but not that much.

Unless we were an anomaly they have done away with the biometric monitoring already. They still have tracking ability, but unless it was able to get biometric stats without touching the body it didn't collect it.

I was little surprised at some of the techniques it showed for cadre during the Star, I personally would rather they not have showed that, some may do the right thing when they might normally not because they know the capabilities and some of the SOP the cadre are using.

I also am surprised how much of team week they showed, IMO it will provide an edge that we didn't have on several of the events that others didn't have. The course has changed some, but I also saw a lot of things that were the same.

Overall I thought it was pretty well done, and I enjoyed watching it with my wife, I saw some familiar faces and she got to see some of what I did. I personally don’t think it gave away to much more than can be currently found in books and on the internet with a little searching. One can have a pretty good idea of what to expect if one chooses, but I don’t think there’s a way around that in the information age, but that’s just my .02.

[CSB]

As you may have noticed from my earlier post, I was concerned that the show might be exactly that: a show in the nature of a frat hazing, with the pledges barfing to amuse the viewer.

Thank God it was not such a video.

It was as fair and accurate a view of SFAS as we are likely to see from Hollywood.

Many years ago (too many years than I would like to admit to) I penciled in the following when briefing candidates for Special Forces, before there was an SFAS. But now I submit it to Camp Mackall, with all copyrights thereunto appertaining, for such use as they may feel appropriate:


United States Army Special Forces

You need not be the strongest, but you must be strong;
You need not be the leader, but you must lead;
You need not be the most intelligent, but you must be intelligent;
You should not be the follower, but you must follow.

You must love the Constitution of United States of America,
the Government it created, and the Nation it serves.

You may not succeed,
but if you fail,
let no blame rightfully be placed upon you.

[chapollin]

Don't lie to the board, the GT score you told me you had does not make you qualified for training.

Kid! When you speak 4 different languages, had served you country honorably and went through some of the hardest us army courses 3 points on a GT score can be waved. For a kid that has not even been through basic training you are not looking to smart, if anyone have any question just pm me.

[Costa]

Thought the show was pretty good but I thought they should have mentioned a few things about security clearance and a little summary of SFQC to show what was in store.

oh yea, I think I hear incoming. :munchin

[Grey1]

No.

You should keep your opinion and questions to yourself until you have seen the video, and probably till you have been selected.

Best of luck, and stay out of The Monkey Bar.

TR

Roger that. Moving out.

[McFearless]

Personally, I enjoyed the show. My wife and I watched it a few hours ago. Informative and a nice look at what's in store. Still very excited... and nervous.

[mffjm8509]

Entertaining....

Cp Mackall has changed a lot since I left in 2003....

mp

[cornelyj]

Just added rolling left and rolling right into my PT program...

[lksteve]

Cp Mackall has changed a lot since I left in 2003....
Yeah...they changed the decor quite abit since '76...:munchin

[Surgicalcric]

Kid! When you speak 4 different languages, had served you country honorably and went through some of the hardest us army courses 3 points on a GT score can be waved. For a kid that has not even been through basic training you are not looking to smart, if anyone have any question just pm me.

We dont care how many languages you speak or what you have done in your past.

The standard is the standard and there is a reason for the it. My personally feeling -and one shared by many of my brethren- is it shouldnt be waved. That's one of the ways we will end up with the Regiment being "Average Forces." Unfortunately it is more important to fill the opening with anyone than the right "one" it would seem...

Go do PT.

Crip

[Big Boss]

That's just chumming.

One of the few times it is good to be short is under the log.

TR

Sir,
I'm a bit short (5'5). Should I tippy-toe? :lifter

[Go Devil]

Sir,
I'm a bit short (5'5). Should I tippy-toe? :lifter

"If you are taller than the man in front of you, step in front of him. Right Face. If you are taller than them man in front of you, step in front of him."

Equal fun for all.

Midget Log Teams have a hard way to go.

[The Reaper]

Kid! When you speak 4 different languages, had served you country honorably and went through some of the hardest us army courses 3 points on a GT score can be waved. For a kid that has not even been through basic training you are not looking to smart, if anyone have any question just pm me.

This is not helping your case.

TR

[CSB]

Yeah...they changed the decor quite abit since '76...

They could at least saved one of the tar paper covered shacks for the Camp Mackall Museum.

[CoLawman]

Enjoyable show. Watched it last night with my son. It was like watching Monday night football with a color commentator and play by play man. :D

[peepee1]

They could at least saved one of the tar paper covered shacks for the Camp Mackall Museum.

They have one! Among all of the new buildings, they kept one. I asked my Cadre after SUT and he filled me in as to what and why it's there... I thought it was a shed for lawn equipment or something:).

Too bad they can't show a two hour program on the rest of the Q course(Two Years in Hell)... because SFAS was easy now that I look back in comparison to the other.... two years... cough... cough.(and TR told me that after I so proudly posted that I had been "selected" on here :D). Back to studying for the Medic Course and keeping the chub off...

[greenberetTFS]

Nothing at all like I can remember...............;)

Big Teddy :munchin

[ODA 226]

One thing they didn't do when I went thru the old course. Was give Students more then one recycle. You were given one chance at a recycle. Failed any other portion of the course and you were gone.

We graduated 13 out of 125 that started Phase One together and had a dozen or so medics finish up Phase 3 with us. NO RECYCLES! Fail ANY task and you were GONE!

[ODA 226]

Entertaining....

Cp Mackall has changed a lot since I left in 2003....

mp

Changed even more since I left in 1978! :eek:

[lksteve]

We graduated 13 out of 125 that started Phase One together and had a dozen or so medics finish up Phase 3 with us. Same here...they did allow recycles into the class, though...

[NousDefionsDoc]

We graduated 13 out of 125 that started Phase One together and had a dozen or so medics finish up Phase 3 with us. NO RECYCLES! Fail ANY task and you were GONE!

Yeah, I didn't get the impression they really wanted us either...;)

Until we'd done it

[freelander]

I just watched it with my wife and son. It seemed well put together enough. The puking reminded me of some PT sessions we have done. I did not know the land nav was a cumulative 50 miles. Is that how it has always been? A good SGT from 19th group told me the first time through selection he WVed because of all the unknown waiting around. I imagine there was not a lot of that in the 2 week version. HE also said that the best thing physically to remember is "legs and lungs". Looked about right...

[armymom1228]

It looked like a well put together show. I almost, at one point, felt sorry for the
team 4 PL.

That one team that used thier rucks to carry the downed pilot and the way they spelled each other by sliding in and out, was interesting.

I cringed when the commentator asked if there had ever been any women QP's.
I was thrilled to see they sidestepped that pandora's box nicely.

The Nasty Nick, looks like great fun.

[jdl141]

Unfortunatley I missed the show last night. I've been looking all over for when they might replay it but with no luck. Does anybody have any info about when it might be coming on again?

Thanks.

[deepblack 18x]

Unfortunatley I missed the show last night. I've been looking all over for when they might replay it but with no luck. Does anybody have any info about when it might be coming on again?

Thanks.

There are no future airings scheduled at this time. It should be on youtube very soon though.

[longrange1947]

Yeah, I too missed the show due to head up fourth point of contact. Will have to go to Mackall and see the changes. Went through in 67-68, did not even know what a retest or recycle was then, and know a few changes happened when I was last there in 96. Heard the place is unrecognizable from what I remember.

[lksteve]

The Discovery Channel is showing on their website that it will air tonight at 2300. YMMV.Actually, MMDV...my schedule shows "Who was Jesus"...it shows 2 Weeks in hell was on last night at 2300...

[JoelBlack]

Good program.

Too much yelling, IMHO.

TR



I recorded Two Weeks in Hell and let my brother, a RI down at 6th RTB for swamp phase, watch it and he said that the SF assessors did not yell one bit. They stood there with there arms crossed not saying a word. He said they were probably doing that for the cameras.

I quote word for word his exact comment....."I can't believe they're documenting this!"

[olhamada]

I watched this last night (DVR) and couldn't believe one of my best friend's little brothers was front and center several times as a candidate. I knew "Caleb" made it, but it was a nice surprise to see him in the pit, on the STAR Course, and at the white board. I hadn't realized that he was there during the filming.

I also couldn't believe "they" allowed this to be documented, but thought it was very well done, still left a lot to the imagination, and showed how few really make it.

[Streck-Fu]

He said they were probably doing that for the cameras.


I guess there isn't enough drama for most American audiences unless there's a bunch of yelling going on. I would prefer to see it as it actually is. I think most of the people interested in watching it, would feel the same way.

Perhaps the yelling draws in a few more channel surfers.

[US Patriot]

Great show the other night. Saw one of my friends that I ride bikes with. Was cool that I knew someone from there. You guys do a great job and I hold you all in high regard. Thanks for all you do and the sacrifices you make. Keep up the hard work..

[The Reaper]

I recorded Two Weeks in Hell and let my brother, a RI down at 6th RTB for swamp phase, watch it and he said that the SF assessors did not yell one bit. They stood there with there arms crossed not saying a word. He said they were probably doing that for the cameras.

I quote word for word his exact comment....."I can't believe they're documenting this!"

Actually, more of them appeared to be using their Air Force hand warmers than crossing their arms.

Pretty funny when you see someone chewing ass with their hands in their pockets.

TR

[JoelBlack]

On the star navigation course, a candidate was walking on the road which is against the rules (roadkill). When he got caught the SF assessor asked the candidate for his roster number. The candidate shot his cluster flare at the cadre and escape into the tree line. Now when everyone returned to the RV candidates were asked to show their clusters. One might think this would ruin ones SF career, but he was allowed to continue his interview. The reason being.... Thinking outside of the box. Thats the kind of stuff SF look for. He also received a major minus.:D

[Counsel]

I cringed when the commentator asked if there had ever been any women QP's.
I was thrilled to see they sidestepped that pandora's box nicely.

You were not the only one that thought that. :D

[The Reaper]

On the star navigation course, a candidate was walking on the road which is against the rules (roadkill). When he got caught the SF assessor asked the candidate for his roster number. The candidate shot his cluster flare at the cadre and escape into the tree line. Now when everyone returned to the RV candidates were asked to show their clusters. One might think this would ruin ones SF career, but he was allowed to continue his interview. The reason being.... Thinking outside of the box. Thats the kind of stuff SF look for. He also received a major minus.:D

Where did you hear this story?

Just FYI, it is pretty hard for a tired, worn-out student with a rubber weapon, GPS locator, a reflective vest, and 50-70 pounds on his back to run into the woods blindly and escape from a freshly rested cadre member who knows the AO intimately, is carrying no load, has access to an ATV, and who is wearing NVGs.

TR

[Richard]

Where did you hear this story?

Right up there with reindeer antlers - shoulda run it by Snopes or PolitiFactcheck first! :p

Richard

[JoelBlack]

Where did you hear this story?

Just FYI, it is pretty hard for a tired, worn-out student with a rubber weapon, GPS locator, a reflective vest, and 50-70 pounds on his back to run into the woods blindly and escape from a freshly rested cadre member who knows the AO intimately with no load and wearing NVGs.

My thoughts exactly...

Brother went through a year and half ago. I recorded and watch it with him last night and when a candidate had got caught on the road he pointed at the screen and told me the story.

Maybe escape is not the correct wording... Blatantly walked into the tree line.

[BRAVO-SMASH]

My thoughts exactly...

Brother went through a year and half ago. I recorded and watch it with him last night and when a candidate had got caught on the road he pointed at the screen and told me the story. He stated the cadre most likely did not give chase.

Didnt know they gave major minus at selection :rolleyes:... Yeah, I dont think they do.

[The Reaper]

My thoughts exactly...

Brother went through a year and half ago. I recorded and watch it with him last night and when a candidate had got caught on the road he pointed at the screen and told me the story.

Maybe escape is not the correct wording... Blatantly walked into the tree line.

Sometimes, people tell stories that are not factual or may have been embellished.

While I was dealing with SFAS, if you were a roadkill who fired pyro at a cadre member and tried to escape, you would have been run down, thumped, out of the course, NTRed, and recommended for UCMJ pretty quickly.

I am formally throwing the BS flag on this one. Will be more than happy to call the cadre and inquire on your brother's behalf, if you want.

TR

[Surgicalcric]

...Thinking outside of the box. Thats the kind of stuff SF look for...

I love hearing people talk about "thinking outside the box." It seems those who talk the most are those who cant manage to think inside the box, attempting to use it as a defense for poorly thought out ideas/decisions...

Also, I would hold off on deciding what it is we are looking for until such time you understand a lil more about us.


Crip

[Slantwire]

On the star navigation course, a candidate was walking on the road which is against the rules (roadkill). When he got caught the SF assessor asked the candidate for his roster number. The candidate shot his cluster flare at the cadre and escape into the tree line. Now when everyone returned to the RV candidates were asked to show their clusters. One might think this would ruin ones SF career, but he was allowed to continue his interview. The reason being.... Thinking outside of the box. Thats the kind of stuff SF look for. He also received a major minus.:D

That story was pretty universally known among the 18X candidates in 2007. It seemed it happened in the class before the storyteller's buddy, no matter which class that buddy had been in.

[BryanK]

Unfortunatley I missed the show last night. I've been looking all over for when they might replay it but with no luck. Does anybody have any info about when it might be coming on again?

Thanks.

I emailed Discovery, and this is what they replied (I missed it as well):

Dear Viewer,

Thank you for contacting Discovery Channel.

Two Weeks In Hell is currently scheduled to re-air on January 14th at 8
p.m. EST.

For programming and schedule information, please visit our website at
www.discovery.com, then click on TV Schedule. Our schedules are published
for the current and following month. If you are not able to locate the
programming you are looking for, we recommend checking back periodically to
see if it has been added to the current schedule.

For your convenience, use the "Newsletters" feature on our website to
receive e-mail reminders letting you know when your favorite program is
going to be televised.


Sincerely,

Viewer Relations
Discovery Channel

HTH

[freelander]

Question to the QPs...

No rank, no HOAHs, but during team week, are candidates drawn to the inclination to pull the rank card in situations where shit has hit the fan and no one has any control? Team 4 was ok according to the cadre and then the good idea fairly came in and jacked it up. IOW, people wanted to input their .02 and contribute to the confusion as a result. If a candidate was tapped as PL and made it known that his decisions would stand and he alone would be accountable for them, how would that go down in SFAS? Also, do senior NCOs or officers announce themselves quietly and naturally stand out or is that discouraged?

Correct me if I am wrong, which I probably am, but it would seem that those with leadership experience would on average, be able to untangle team 4 type situations and thus accomplish the mission.

Thank you for your service and time.

[18C Troll]

Sounds like the story in my class, except he ran into the woods and when the Cadre asked for his roster number all he heard was an e-tool squeking open. Same stories differant times.

[Utah Bob]

I'm glad I'm old and never had to experience it at all..................:rolleyes:

Big Teddy :munchin

Ditto!:D

[TrapLine]

I enjoyed watching the show and the glimpse it gave into the process of becoming a QP. As others have pointed out, while I was watching I thought that the show might reveal a lot to upcoming students and wondered if it could hurt the process. I almost kicked myself when I reminded myself who was teaching the class. Something tells me the cadre have a pretty big bag of tricks. Finally, I could not help but wonder if some of the cadre featured walk the halls of ps.com.

[Jasf10]

Question to the QPs...

No rank, no HOAHs, but during team week, are candidates drawn to the inclination to pull the rank card in situations where shit has hit the fan and no one has any control? Team 4 was ok according to the cadre and then the good idea fairly came in and jacked it up. IOW, people wanted to input their .02 and contribute to the confusion as a result. If a candidate was tapped as PL and made it known that his decisions would stand and he alone would be accountable for them, how would that go down in SFAS? Also, do senior NCOs or officers announce themselves quietly and naturally stand out or is that discouraged?


I like that there was no rank and the no Hooahs. "Hooah" can get really annoying. "Hooah" what they teach you in basic training..."don't think, just say hooah".

No rank helps to avoid credentialism.

I wonder if the guy that lost his weapon got selected? :eek:

[Utah Bob]

Sometimes, people tell stories that are not factual or may have been embellished.

TR

Very diplomatically put. :D
Who said talking to G chiefs doesn't give you valuable experience in tactful, interpersonal communications. :D

Some of us tend to blurt out, "Oh Bullshit!";)

[Surgicalcric]

...are candidates drawn to the inclination to pull the rank card in situations where shit has hit the fan and no one has any control...

Show up and find out.

We are not going to give away all the keys to the process...

Crip

[Team Sergeant]

I like that there was no rank and the no Hooahs. "Hooah" can get really annoying. "Hooah" what they teach you in basic training..."don't think, just say hooah".

No rank helps to avoid credentialism.

I wonder if the guy that lost his weapon got selected? :eek:

What's a "hooah" ???

I will tell you having served 20 years I never said "hooah"......:rolleyes: Then again I never used the word "operator" when referring to Special Forces soldiers.

[Costa]

I still can't believe kids were bringing contraband like ripped fuel and thinking they could get away with it. I couldn't help but think- What idiots!

[Surgicalcric]

What does ripped fuel do?


Google not working?

Crip

[The Reaper]

There are people posting on this thread that are excellent examples of why we have a selection and assessment process.

Some of you would probably be on the truck headed back to Bragg before the first 24 hours were passed.

Trust me, after watching over 40 classes, you get a sense of these things.

TR

[abc_123]

There are people posting on this thread that are excellent examples of why we have a selection and assessment process.

Some of you would probably be on the truck headed back to Bragg before the first 24 hours were passed.

Trust me, after watching over 40 classes, you get a sense of these things.

TR

Concur.

The funny thing is that they're all thinking right now, "He can't mean me. He must be talking about those OTHER guys..." :rolleyes:

[IrishYanksFan]

Anybody see those comments the YOUTUBE folks left on those previews? It's impressive how stupid people are.

The same idiots do that on the Ranger School videos. First, some of them think SF and the Rangers are the same thing and then there are wannabe Marines who keep posting about how Marine basic is just as hard as Ranger School....

Instant communication and anonymity breed stupidity.

[wet dog]

...I couldn't help but think- What idiots!

Buyer beware, these are the cats who are trying to make it to "your team".

Where are you in the pipeline?

[wet dog]

Sounds like the story in my class, except he ran into the woods and when the Cadre asked for his roster number all he heard was an e-tool squeking open. Same stories differant times.

Cadre in question? Wait for it, ready....

SFC Gallant.

He lived in the boat house at MacKall. Fact vs. Fiction. SFC Gallant caught me crossing the road at a diagonal, I heard tires on dirt, he arriving by motorcyle. He was known to coasting in on neutral, lights out only to kick students in the back for running the roads. I ditched in the bushes, this was before reflective vests, chem lights or any surveillance/tracking sytems. Land nav was a extension of patroling, and not being seen by cadre was a bonus. We had more students fail land nav for leaving weapons behind.

When SFC Gallant asked for my roster number, all I said was, "I wont lie, but if you can catch me, I'm yours, but I'm ready to fight". All SFC Gallant said was, "Move out".

Months later, he shook my hand crossing the stage.

[Dozer523]

Who needs roads?
As I recall, there were pretty nice trails running parallel to the roads about 25 meter into the woods. The herd instinct . . . like wildebeest heading to water.

[Team Sergeant]

Who needs roads?
As I recall, there were pretty nice trails running parallel to the roads about 25 meter into the woods. The herd instinct . . . like wildebeest heading to water.

Those "trails" are now mined or over grown with the dead bodies of "SF Candidates" used for fertilizer.

TS

[Bushmaster]

Seems like the course has not changed much since it first started.

It gave me a flashback to my younger days. For those of you still trying to make it through SFAS, this might be an example of what it takes to make it through:

I went through SFAS in April 89, which I believe was the first SFAS class after the name change from SFOT. I was, for the most part, a young kid at age 23 compared to the average candidate. It seems most of the guys I was there with had been in a few years, several had been in a Ranger BAT or with division (82nd) and had been in Grenada.

I was not a Rep 63 having spent three years in the Marine Corps infantry, but I sometimes felt like one since I knew little about the Army or SF at the time. So I tried to keep my mouth shut and learn and give everything I had.

I had made it through the individual gateways with no problems. Luckily I was in good shape and was good at reading a map. I survived the team events, and I look back over the last 25 years and I can say those were some of the toughest 8-10 days of my career.

On the morning of the last day (did not know it was the last day then,) we started out on an individual road march in the very early morning long before the sun came up. As always we never knew how far or how fast we needed to go-"This is a timed event candidate. Do your best."

I was walking inclines and jogging the declines and flat ground and was a couple hours into it when I came to a steep decline. I was trying to be careful, but in the dark, I hit a deep rut from the recent rain and turned my ankle. I ended up in the ditch, but knew I needed to get up and walk it off or I was done. Somehow I got to my feet and tried to walk it off. I never really did. I sucked it up for the next several hours and I would say at least 10 miles. I never stopped moving after that because I knew I was in danger of never getting back up. I thought about stopping and taking my boot off to look at it, but I could feel the swelling and knew that was a bad idea and I would never get my boot back on.

Finally after several miles and I don't know how many hours, I made it to the end point. By the time I got there I was barely moving and dragging my foot. A couple of guys helped me get my ruck and my tired ass in the back of the truck and all I could think of was that I had came so far only to not make it because of bad luck. I had convinced myself that I was not going to try again.

We got back to Bragg to the SWC area (it was over by the Joel dental clinic then) and a medic took one look at my foot and they took me to Womack (the old one.) I still remember the face of the female doc who came in to check me out-lol. I think all the broken blisters on my shredded feet scared her more than my ankle. And I am sure I did not smell that great either. She was kind of hot though after spending three weeks at Mackall.

They took x-rays and found that my ankle was fractured. They put me in a temporary cast to immobilize it until the swelling went down and I could get in to see an ortho specialist.

I got a ride back to the SWC area and was told to move out (on crutches and a cast) to the "code room." When I got there one of the cadre stopped me and asked me what I was doing. I told him I had just got back from Womack and had broken my ankle on the road march. He said "No shit-what is your Roster number" and looked at the white tape on my cargo pocket before I could reply. He pulled out a green notebook and said "Congratulations-you have been selected" and shook my hand and told me to get my ass inside.

In reading through some of the post here-I think this post was about me:

http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=178900&postcount=679


If not, some other unlucky bastard went through the same crap.

All I can say for you guys who are going to the course is to NEVER QUIT-no matter what. That advice goes even after you make it and have completed the Q course.

[Dozer523]

Those "trails" are now mined or over grown with the dead bodies of "SF Candidates" used for fertilizer.

TS
Good. did it yourself, I bet.
Not that I ever used 'em. Heard about 'em from the Nigeria guy.;)

[rltipton]

Seems like the course has not changed much since it first started.

It gave me a flashback to my younger days. For those of you still trying to make it through SFAS, this might be an example of what it takes to make it through:

I went through SFAS in April 89, which I believe was the first SFAS class after the name change from SFOT. I was, for the most part, a young kid at age 23 compared to the average candidate. It seems most of the guys I was there with had been in a few years, several had been in a Ranger BAT or with division (82nd) and had been in Grenada.

I was not a Rep 63 having spent three years in the Marine Corps infantry, but I sometimes felt like one since I knew little about the Army or SF at the time. So I tried to keep my mouth shut and learn and give everything I had.

I had made it through the individual gateways with no problems. Luckily I was in good shape and was good at reading a map. I survived the team events, and I look back over the last 25 years and I can say those were some of the toughest 8-10 days of my career.

On the morning of the last day (did not know it was the last day then,) we started out on an individual road march in the very early morning long before the sun came up. As always we never knew how far or how fast we needed to go-"This is a timed event candidate. Do your best."

I was walking inclines and jogging the declines and flat ground and was a couple hours into it when I came to a steep decline. I was trying to be careful, but in the dark, I hit a deep rut from the recent rain and turned my ankle. I ended up in the ditch, but knew I needed to get up and walk it off or I was done. Somehow I got to my feet and tried to walk it off. I never really did. I sucked it up for the next several hours and I would say at least 10 miles. I never stopped moving after that because I knew I was in danger of never getting back up. I thought about stopping and taking my boot off to look at it, but I could feel the swelling and knew that was a bad idea and I would never get my boot back on.

Finally after several miles and I don't know how many hours, I made it to the end point. By the time I got there I was barely moving and dragging my foot. A couple of guys helped me get my ruck and my tired ass in the back of the truck and all I could think of was that I had came so far only to not make it because of bad luck. I had convinced myself that I was not going to try again.

We got back to Bragg to the SWC area (it was over by the Joel dental clinic then) and a medic took one look at my foot and they took me to Womack (the old one.) I still remember the face of the female doc who came in to check me out-lol. I think all the broken blisters on my shredded feet scared her more than my ankle. And I am sure I did not smell that great either. She was kind of hot though after spending three weeks at Mackall.

They took x-rays and found that my ankle was fractured. They put me in a temporary cast to immobilize it until the swelling went down and I could get in to see an ortho specialist.

I got a ride back to the SWC area and was told to move out (on crutches and a cast) to the "code room." When I got there one of the cadre stopped me and asked me what I was doing. I told him I had just got back from Womack and had broken my ankle on the road march. He said "No shit-what is your Roster number" and looked at the white tape on my cargo pocket before I could reply. He pulled out a green notebook and said "Congratulations-you have been selected" and shook my hand and told me to get my ass inside.

In reading through some of the post here-I think this post was about me:

http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=178900&postcount=679


If not, some other unlucky bastard went through the same crap.

All I can say for you guys who are going to the course is to NEVER QUIT-no matter what. That advice goes even after you make it and have completed the Q course.

Some very interesting things happen in SFAS, that's no doubt. One of the funniest things I ever saw in my life was on the last day orienteering course.

I was cruising down one of the tank trails (Feb '91 roads were okay...STAR was in Phase 1 [13]) about 45 minutes into the course headed to my 2nd point and feeling good. I see a dude sitting beside the road ahead of me with his road guard vest over his ruck, boots off, shirt off, feet propped up on rucksack, grubbing on an MRE.

No talking or encouraging was allowed back then, but I asked if he needed medical attention so I could tell cadre at my next point and he didn't reply, so I kept truckin.

A couple of seconds later a silver Dodge D-50 rolls up and I hear one of the cadre roll up and ask, "You ok candidate?"

To which the candidate responded, "F*** you, this is bull****. I quit."

Enos told the dude, "Throw your s*** in the truck then."

The dude got into the back of the truck and said , "It's your s***, you throw it in the truck" and that's about all I heard.

I've used those words, "F*** you, this is bulls***. I quit," many times since then in various situations, but have never been able to get the same effect he did. It was at the time the funniest thing I could have possibly heard and boosted my morale greatly.

The course looks about the same as it was but a week shorter, with the STAR instead of orienteering forEVER, and the yelling thing...meh could do without that. ALL the cadre used to say was "Do your best."

It was fun seeing that stuff, especially the clowns with the hanging sandman. I remember a team in my class did that too and they didn't come in until after midnight that night...of course we carried 2 then, not 1 and a box.

Man, I was a tool in SFAS. It's a wonder I got selected from some of the stupid stuff I did. I must have gave all the right answers at the interview.

It's a good thing, because if I had not gotten selected on the first run I was definitely NOT doing it again. Definitely the hardest thing I ever did outside of combat operations.

I think we started with 280ish and finished with 80ish. I think all but a few got selected. It snowed and sleeted the whole freaking time...terrible experience for me. I finished the final longrange movement on a broken foot that bothered me daily from then until the day it got chopped off.

Merry Christmas & be safe,
Randy

[caveman]

I really wish I could find this online. I missed its initial showing and I'll be at WLC for the next.

[MtnGoat]

They could at least saved one of the tar paper covered shacks for the Camp Mackall Museum.

Amen to That one!!

[gun_bunny]

I wonder if the guy that lost his weapon got selected? :eek:

Yes he did, he was in my old battalion. Reported into the Q a few months after me. Relieved while still in student company for being late and lying to the cadre.

[HisDisciple]

I finished the final longrange movement on a broken foot that bothered me daily from then until the day it got chopped off.

:confused:

[happyg]

I emailed Discovery, and this is what they replied (I missed it as well):

Dear Viewer,

Thank you for contacting Discovery Channel.

Two Weeks In Hell is currently scheduled to re-air on January 14th at 8
p.m. EST.

For programming and schedule information, please visit our website at
www.discovery.com, then click on TV Schedule. Our schedules are published
for the current and following month. If you are not able to locate the
programming you are looking for, we recommend checking back periodically to
see if it has been added to the current schedule.

For your convenience, use the "Newsletters" feature on our website to
receive e-mail reminders letting you know when your favorite program is
going to be televised.


Sincerely,

Viewer Relations
Discovery Channel

HTH

This time and date is now listed on the discovery site for the next airing. It will also air at 11pm. I personally am glad I will miss seeing it. Have fun for all that will watch.

[caveman]

:confused:

Read his profile dude.

[Surgicalcric]

:confused:

If you have a question ask it. However if that smiley is all you can muster for a response I suggest you not respond in the future.

Go do PT...

Crip

[drmbldr]

Common sense tells us the reason why "BUD's" and now "Two Weeks of Hell" aired was because recruiting numbers are down and Uncle Sam needed something tasty to draw candidates. Leave it to commercialism to dramatize the experience and give armchair critics our reality T.V.

I don’t want to sound rude but I’m a little disappointed to see DOD commercializing another of the U.S. military’s ‘elite’ secret societies (It was truly entertaining and I will watch it again on January 14). IMHO all spec ops and selection processes need always remain secret. The story of the families and members who've earned their respected rites of passage should be shrouded in secrecy and received from outsiders as rumor or legend.

I’d prefer to be spoken of and compared to mystic creatures (like Bigfoot) of which fanatical people are in search of but never see.

Sodalitas, professionals.

Dr. M

[koz]

Common sense tells us the reason why "BUD's" and now "Two Weeks of Hell" aired was because recruiting numbers are down and Uncle Sam needed something tasty to draw candidates. .

Sodalitas, professionals.

Dr. M

I don't think that's the case. My understanding is that recruiting numbers are at an all time high - thanks to a crappy economy....

[testedone]

I don't think that's the case. My understanding is that recruiting numbers are at an all time high - thanks to a crappy economy....

Yep, one of my guys in the Guard was trying to go Active, they had no real interest, they said their numbers are good..kind of odd they would not want some experience?

Also the latest Army Times stated numbers are high..

[SATCOMBEAST]

The Army as a whole should be good on numbers, thanks to the economy. I have seen that the retention rate was over 300% of stated goals, also the number of age 30 plus new Soldiers is growing dramaticaly. One of the guys on my team is 40 years old and has a J.D.

[wet dog]

One of the guys on my team is 40 years old and has a J.D.

A future public servant or politician maybe? Clocking time in the Army for experience will curtainly put him above his peers later when he runs for office.

Or maybe having a degree, is just that, a degree. One must live life to enjoy it.

[blue02hd]

Common sense tells us the reason why "BUD's" and now "Two Weeks of Hell" aired was because recruiting numbers are down and Uncle Sam needed something tasty to draw candidates.
Dr. M

Wrong, try again.

[Ryanr]

By the way, this is on right now for anyone that missed it the first time.

[Big Boss]

I won't miss it this time. :munchin

[Paslode]

I watched it. Looks like fun in a challenging sense.

They mentioned during the show that the city dwellers tend to have a difficult time with night navigation and I was curious as to what causes them the problems and why.

[CSB]

They mentioned during the show that the city dwellers tend to have a difficult time with night navigation and I was curious as to what causes them the problems and why.


Because they are afraid of the dark and afraid of water.

[Paslode]

Because they are afraid of the dark and afraid of water.

You have got to be joshing me...

[ZonieDiver]

You have got to be joshing me...

QP's don't kid! ;)

You'd be surprised how many people are afraid of the dark - which is, I think, a very inate response of we humans. There are SO many people afraid of water, as I find often in my scuba diving instructions.

Why does this fact surprise you????

[longrange1947]

You have got to be joshing me...

Ever see the panic when the lights go off in a city??

Those boys are never without lights. It is a basic part of their makeup.

Water is for drinking and not walking. Walking in water drowns people.

These are not my made up answers, they were expressed by more than one city folk. :munchin

[Costa]

Hey hey.... easy now.
I happen to be from a "city" and I love the water. I just don't like wet boots.

As for the dark... well, there are more critters here than in the Ft. Bragg immediate area. Florida panthers (rare but still there), hogs, lots of snakes, and lots of fire-ants fill the "woods" around here.

If I've done my research correctly, the most dangerous things around Ft. Bragg (besides the obvious) are bears, and about 5 different kinds of snakes. Assorted rattlers, copperheads, cottonmouths, and coral snakes. Anything else I'm missing?

[longrange1947]

A quick search will turn up a whole bevy of critters. :munchin :D

Don't forget fauna's sister flora while you are at it.

[Costa]

Roger that.

I can semi-understand the dark, if you've never been outside or an outdoorsy kind of person and are unfamiliar with "sounds". I think most of it hinges on people letting their minds get the better of them though. At least that's what I found when people freaked out in the water.

[ZonieDiver]

You should see people on their first night dive in open water - far from land! The "Jaws" theme music is playing in their head, and I have had them drip nervous sweat on me as I waited in the dark water for their giant stride off the swim platform.

Me... I've always kind of liked the dark. We ugly guys look better! :D

[Grey1]

Hey hey.... easy now.
I happen to be from a "city" and I love the water. I just don't like wet boots.

As for the dark... well, there are more critters here than in the Ft. Bragg immediate area. Florida panthers (rare but still there), hogs, lots of snakes, and lots of fire-ants fill the "woods" around here.

If I've done my research correctly, the most dangerous things around Ft. Bragg (besides the obvious) are bears, and about 5 different kinds of snakes. Assorted rattlers, copperheads, cottonmouths, and coral snakes. Anything else I'm missing?

You're missing the draw monster... so I hear.

[wet dog]

Anything else I'm missing?

The young adult raising Pot on federal property and eager to take your issued weapon knowing you have no ammo.

Pay attention during all safety briefings, good luck.

[Paslode]

QP's don't kid! ;)

You'd be surprised how many people are afraid of the dark - which is, I think, a very inate response of we humans. There are SO many people afraid of water, as I find often in my scuba diving instructions.

Why does this fact surprise you????

I understood failure for sleeping, physical inability......

But the Night Navigation my reaction/dismay was it is one thing to be out in the woods with nothing and have no idea who, what or where....they have a map, a compass and a head lamp to read the map which is like GOLD!!! They have an abundance of sticks to test for water depth and maybe logs to use for floats if need be. If you make enough noise in the brush most critters will steer clear of you.

So my surprise....I took for granted that those that made it to SFAS were beyond that fear and/or would have been aware of what they had available to them. But I forget that every City Kid doesn't have the opportunity to play in the woods, or parents that promote such activity.

But I am still a bit perplexed that one would apply for a job/function that they know requires such activities, when they have a extreme fear of such activities.

[head]

So my surprise....I took for granted that those that made it to SFAS were beyond that fear and/or would have been aware of what they had available to them. But I forget that every City Kid doesn't have the opportunity to play in the woods, or parents that promote such activity.

But I am still a bit perplexed that one would apply for a job/function that they know requires such activities, when they have a extreme fear of such activities.

Made it to SFAS? Doesn't take much to make it "to" SFAS.

It's the same with the guys on the show who thought they could overcome their fear of heights on Nasty Nick. SFAS is designed to identify these type of weaknesses.

Also, the ability of honest self-critique in order to identify your possible weaknesses beforehand goes a long way, but most men will never even come close to replicating what SFAS will present. Yeah, they might think their fear is not that big an issue... but combine that with all the other factors, and the fear that would ordinarily just raise your BP a couple points, now makes you unable to function.

But, take it from me, city boys can do just fine out there, but they still hate ticks attaching themselves on body parts they have no business being near. Not cool.

[wet dog]

Me... I've always kind of liked the dark...

It must be in our blood or something in the water.

Before I has fallen asleep, one night my youngst (at the time, aged 6.5 yrs.) came into my room and slowly moved onto the bed covering my mouth with a gloved hand. He asked in a whisper, "Am I getting better at sneaking up on you?"

"Your doing fine son, now go back to bed".

[1stindoor]

All the snakes and other assorted animals didn't bother me one bit...but I had the misfortune of running into a spider web in the middle of the night...with my face...I'm pretty certain that monster is still in my hair or on my back somewhere.

Somewhere out there is about 500 meters of a pace count that got lost when I hit the web.

[Paslode]

Made it to SFAS? Doesn't take much to make it "to" SFAS.

It's the same with the guys on the show who thought they could overcome their fear of heights on Nasty Nick. SFAS is designed to identify these type of weaknesses.

Also, the ability of honest self-critique in order to identify your possible weaknesses beforehand goes a long way, but most men will never even come close to replicating what SFAS will present. Yeah, they might think their fear is not that big an issue... but combine that with all the other factors, and the fear that would ordinarily just raise your BP a couple points, now makes you unable to function.

But, take it from me, city boys can do just fine out there, but they still hate ticks attaching themselves on body parts they have no business being near. Not cool.

Even on the boob tube Nasty Nick got me puckering a bit. I respect height and ladders...mild fear ;) add some sleep deprivation and physical fatigue it could become a bigger obstacle than it would normally be.

Pass or fail, the amount of self knowledge one can gain is huge.

[wet dog]

Even on the boob tube Nasty Nick got me puckering a bit. I respect height and ladders...mild fear ;) add some sleep deprivation and physical fatigue it could become a bigger obstacle than it would normally be.

Pass or fail, the amount of self knowledge one can gain is huge.

O.K., let's dig deeper. What single obstacle "got your goat"?

Dirty Name, Tunnel, etc.

[Paslode]

O.K., let's dig deeper. What single obstacle "got your goat"?

Dirty Name, Tunnel, etc.

Of everything I saw the climbing wall is the only thing that made me gulp, and it is also the one obstacle I'd kick myself in the ass if I didn't complete it.

[The Reaper]

Guessing or speculating without having been there is a waste of time.

Wait till you meet The Whopper.:D

TR

[Paslode]

Guessing or speculating without having been there is a waste of time.

Wait till you meet The Whopper.:D

TR

True. But in this instance my days of playing with fire is tempered, I am resigned to appreciating the challenge as a spectator and comparing similar challenges to things I have dealt with. And the only Whopper that is going to come my way is from Burger King, Malt Balls or a good sized bass.

That said, I'll do my damnedest to make sure my two City Kids learn to enjoy the dark woods and all it has to offer.

[Scimitar]

Doesn't Bragg have a pretty good Boar problem?

S

[Richard]

Doesn't Bragg have a pretty good Boar problem?

Yep - all those damn power-point command briefs being given by some staffer in a monotone tone of voice - put me to sleep every time. :p

And so it goes...

Richard's $.02 :munchin

[Costa]

Doesn't Bragg have a pretty good Boar problem?

S

Problem or solution?

It's all in the seasoning....
Everglades works on everything.

[Go Devil]

Guessing or speculating without having been there is a waste of time.

Wait till you meet The Whopper.:D

TR

Is this the "Tough One" that I remember so well?

If I remember correctly the Tough One (along with the rappelling wall) was enjoyed on the Sunday before Team Week (week three).

[reubadoob]

Watched the show here in Iraq. Thought it was good. I think it was put together fairly professionally considering what it was covering.

Towards the end of the show, the narrator made mention of SFAS becoming "3 Weeks In Hell". I haven't seen any other details about this on the web. Does anyone have any info into SFAS moving to 3 weeks?

[qckslvr13]

Does anyone know when the show is going to air again or somewhere online that I can watch it as a full episode and not as clips? My wife's brother in law is in the process of applying for SFAS and I wanted to send him the link to watch the episode and possibly let him borrow my copy of Get Selected for Special Forces.

[Surgicalcric]

...Does anyone have any info into SFAS moving to 3 weeks?

What more info do you NEED to know Sir.

The number of days/weeks is irrelevant to preparing for or being successfully selected at SFAS. If you have talked to an SF recruiter he should have provided you with all you need to know.

Crip

[wet dog]

...Does anyone have any info into SFAS moving to 3 weeks?

The two week SFAS cycle, I'm assuming was a test that didn't work well. Cadre size, available staff, world wide work demands, etc. caused the school house to make suttle changes to test and evaluate course curriculums.

Going back to 3 weeks is not new.

[head]

Watched the show here in Iraq. Thought it was good. I think it was put together fairly professionally considering what it was covering.

Towards the end of the show, the narrator made mention of SFAS becoming "3 Weeks In Hell". I haven't seen any other details about this on the web. Does anyone have any info into SFAS moving to 3 weeks?

ATRRS has all you need to know, sir.

[reubadoob]

Crip-
I agree with you 100% on the length be irrelavant. I haven't spoke with a recruiter in a while but last time I did it was still at 2 weeks and to us here in Iraq training we were still under the impression selection was 2 weeks. The show just aired this past weekend over here so the word of SFAS moving to 3 weeks was news to us.

Head-
Thanks for the info

[Bechorg]

I cant seem to find the full presentation anywhere on the net, just clips. Anyone know where I can find the full deal?

I am in Germany and I dont have AFN.

[wet dog]

I cant seem to find the full presentation anywhere on the net, just clips. Anyone know where I can find the full deal?

I am in Germany and I dont have AFN.

Brother,

You really didn't miss much.

[ZonieDiver]

Brother,

You really didn't miss much.

Oh, I don't know about that! It has some of the best puking sequences since the "barf-o-rama" segment of "Stand By Me"! :D

[wet dog]

Oh, I don't know about that! It has some of the best puking sequences since the "barf-o-rama" segment of "Stand By Me"! :D

ok, ok, so he missed the puking. I however, require more stimulation as entertainment.

True story, while serving a MTT at Benning, my ODA assisted with IOBC, all LTs, most newly Airborne grads, in their first and 6th jump since BAT.

We conducted a 2 hrs flight NOE, most of the students were feeling slight air sickness. My friend, the ODA Medic gave me a motion sickness bag. Unknowing to others, I had a second bag already filled with a water mushed up MRE. When I turned to relieve myself, I turned around again giving him a 'full' bag of puke. He began gulping the meal, and 20 LTs lost theirs.

WD

[bandycpa]

ok, ok, so he missed the puking. I however, require more stimulation as entertainment.

True story, while serving a MTT at Benning, my ODA assisted with IOBC, all LTs, most newly Airborne grads, in their first and 6th jump since BAT.

We conducted a 2 hrs flight NOE, most of the students were feeling slight air sickness. My friend, the ODA Medic gave me a motion sickness bag. Unknowing to others, I had a second bag already filled with a water mushed up MRE. When I turned to relieve myself, I turned around again giving him a 'full' bag of puke. He began gulping the meal, and 20 LTs lost theirs.

WD


Okay, now THAT was funny right there! Laughed out loud in my office.


Bandy

[greenberetTFS]

ok, ok, so he missed the puking. I however, require more stimulation as entertainment.

True story, while serving a MTT at Benning, my ODA assisted with IOBC, all LTs, most newly Airborne grads, in their first and 6th jump since BAT.

We conducted a 2 hrs flight NOE, most of the students were feeling slight air sickness. My friend, the ODA Medic gave me a motion sickness bag. Unknowing to others, I had a second bag already filled with a water mushed up MRE. When I turned to relieve myself, I turned around again giving him a 'full' bag of puke. He began gulping the meal, and 20 LTs lost theirs.

WD

WD,

Your a one sick puppy!!!!................:rolleyes::eek:;)

Big Teddy :munchin

[SeanWV]

I missed it, so I sent discovery an email and they finally got back to me today

Two Weeks In Hell is currently scheduled to re-air on March 15th at 8pm
EST.

Case anyones interested :munchin

[DevilSide]

I missed it, so I sent discovery an email and they finally got back to me today



Case anyones interested :munchin

Thanks, I'll be sure to tune in :munchin

[LJ19]

I missed it, so I sent discovery an email and they finally got back to me today



Case anyones interested :munchin

Thanks for that information.

[dadof18x'er]

I missed it, so I sent discovery an email and they finally got back to me today



Case anyones interested :munchin

it also is being aired at 11:00 that same evening after the USS Indianapolis story @10:00

[suede18]

SeanW thanks man Ive been trying for months to watch the video. Ill be sure to mark it on the calendar.

[Edgerusher71]

Just watched it again this time I had some teammates watching and even my girlfriend for a bit.

[Pete]

Got work done early, nothing else on TV so I watched it last night.

Yeap, still lots of red clay, sand and pine trees out there. Miles and miles of - more miles :D.

Almost, I say again, Almost felt sorry for team 4 :D.

[albeham]

WOW, TM4 did not have a good week.

Yep the place is still there, and the way it went down for me is still very fresh in my mind.


Damm glad to see its still doing what is needed to bring out the best in a man.
Giving the best to the teams..

I missed the contractor name that was using the new system.

AL :munchin

[Geenie]

if anyone knows where to find this online I would be very grateful for a PM. I've searched all over the internet and can't find it; Very frustrating :(:boohoo
Perhaps it will be available on dvd sometime in the future...

[armymom1228]

if anyone knows where to find this online I would be very grateful for a PM. I've searched all over the internet and can't find it; Very frustrating :(:boohoo
Perhaps it will be available on dvd sometime in the future...

You bother to go to the source? Discovery Channel?

http://dsc.discovery.com/videos/two-weeks-in-hell/

[Geenie]

You bother to go to the source? Discovery Channel?

http://dsc.discovery.com/videos/two-weeks-in-hell/

Yes, I did. And while the trailers that can be found there are interesting, they were not able to quench my thirst for the whole show.

[Sierra Bravo]

Yes, I did. And while the trailers that can be found there are interesting, they were not able to quench my thirst for the whole show.

It's scheduled to air again 3/16 at 11PM

[dadof18x'er]

if anyone knows where to find this online I would be very grateful for a PM. I've searched all over the internet and can't find it; Very frustrating :(:boohoo
Perhaps it will be available on dvd sometime in the future...

you can find it on one of those file sharing sites (torrent?) if your brave enough to use them;)

[Trip_Wire (RIP)]

I watched it last night at 2300 on the Discovery Chanel (8). It was on earlier at 2000 hrs. Yes, team #4 did have a 'bad day!.

I thought it was very informative for anyone planning on attending SFAS. :D

[Pete]

.......I thought it was very informative for anyone planning on attending SFAS. :D

Right you are but for any of you planning on going - being there is a whole lot different than watching it on TV. The first trip to the pit lasted longer than the two hour show.

You just don't know the feeling of being worn out, lack of sleep, don't know shit, react, react, react - until you've been there.

When you're standing in the dark, miles from your next point and you think you're alone - WRONG :D.

[Defender968]

When you're standing in the dark, miles from your next point and you think you're alone - WRONG :D.

Now that's just mean man....mean.....but very true....you're always being assessed:D

[Last hard class]

We didn't have the log PT or that rolling back and forth crud. It looks like it really sucks! Who's in charge of the morning chow anyway? The eggs looked a little runny.

Surprising how many candidates quit on the first day. I realize it's only pre phase but these guys are prepping for months and then say they didn't have their minds right. I wonder what they think about during the duffle bag drag?


Back at your old unit:

"How did you do soldier? Well sir, I was hanging tough for the first hour and half"


LHC

[Koa18B]

My wife said that there was a candidate that fell asleep during land-nav and outright hid his reflector vest and ruck.

God that had to been amusing to see a cadre walk up on him in middle of the night!

[Koa18B]

Right you are but for any of you planning on going - being there is a whole lot different than watching it on TV. The first trip to the pit lasted longer than the two hour show.

You just don't know the feeling of being worn out, lack of sleep, don't know shit, react, react, react - until you've been there.

When you're standing in the dark, miles from your next point and you think you're alone - WRONG :D.

I have to agree. Especially for the 18x's that have never been to any other school other then Sand Hill and Airborne. The intensity is so much higher. On TV it would seem intense but in real life the constant strain on all your senses and muscles will get to you and break you down quick.

[albeham]

Talking about SFAS, when was the first class started?

AL

[The Reaper]

Talking about SFAS, when was the first class started?

AL


There is an entire thread dedicated to that somewhere, but it is generally in the 1988 range, having been preceded by SFOT.

TR

[Pete]

There is an entire thread dedicated to that somewhere, but it is generally in the 1988 range, having been preceded by SFOT.

TR

There were still some non-SFAS students in the system in 1990. Failure required the student to go through SFAS before being recycled - of course there were a number who said "No" and others who did not make it through.

For the ones that did - It was a real "gut check".

[albeham]

I went in 1988. WOW

I am getting old, but what fun I am having with it!!!


It was the summer of '88, it was three weeks, and it had a suck factor of 1000!!

But damm glad I did it.


AL F.

Thanks

[Last hard class]

There were still some non-SFAS students in the system in 1990. Failure required the student to go through SFAS before being recycled - of course there were a number who said "No" and others who did not make it through.

For the ones that did - It was a real "gut check".

I never heard that.Can you imagine? Get nailed at the end of Robin Sage and having to suck up SFAS as a result? That would be a little extra motivation when your running out of gas.

Watching the show, it's almost not fair anymore. The technology they have now really gives the cadre an edge. How is a student supposed to avoid the swamp when you are wearing a gps and the choke points have thermal nvg?:D

[Defender968]

Well I think it’s continuing to do what it was meant to, one of my old troops called me yesterday and said he had seen the program, said it looked tough as hell but made him want to go for it at the same time, if he didn't have a medical issue that precluded him from doing so I think he'd do great.

[BMT (RIP)]

Went to Mackall '66 for LZ & DZ training.

Some of you were not even an EVIL GLEAM in your dad's eye yet!!! :D

BMT

[albeham]

Went to Mackall '66 for LZ & DZ training.

Some of you were not even an EVIL GLEAM in your dad's eye yet!!! :D

BMT


WOW your older then me... 65 I took shape. You give me hope in a long life...

:munchin

[mojaveman]

When I went through the pipeline back in '84 I can remember a number of candidates getting driven away in a white van by the Cadre and never to be seen again. This happened from Pre-phase all of the way through phase III. We lost one officer and about a dozen elisted guys. We never found out what happened to them. I suspected that they were psychologically evaluated and then terminated or simply interviewed by the SWTG CSM and then terminated. Anyway, I guess even though we didn't realize it they were actually watching us pretty closely and also doing some type of 'selecting'.

[Dozer523]

When I went through the pipeline back in '84 I can remember a number of candidates getting driven away in a white van by the Cadre and never to be seen again. This happened from Pre-phase all of the way through phase III. We lost one officer and about a dozen elisted guys. We never found out what happened to them. I suspected that they were psychologically evaluated and then terminated or simply interviewed by the SWTG CSM and then terminated. Anyway, I guess even though we didn't realize it they were actually watching us pretty closely and also doing some type of 'selecting'. Your suspicions are incorrect. There was no interview, they were ground up into LRRP meals. They were part of your resupply bundle. Yum!

[ZonieDiver]

Your suspicions are incorrect. There was no interview, they were ground up into LRRP meals. They were part of your resupply bundle. Yum!

Soylent Green (Beret)??? :D

[Kett]

After copious research I'm turning only dead ends on a place to buy or rent the documentary. I'd like to actually have a physical copy of the documentary. Discovery Channel's response is to wait for next seasons viewing schedule to see if they have it there.
I normally prefer to just sit quietly and find my own answers, but this is not revealing anything close to a positive result.

I had this same issue with the Discovery Channel documentary on the "Rescue Warriors". In the end I had to ask a friend of mine who was on it for a copy.

Thanks in advance,

Kett

[Dozer523]

Soylent Green (Beret)??? :D
Tastes like chickens.:p
After copious research I'm turning only dead ends . . .
Kett Check with Garcia.

[GatorBuck]

I noticed this thread a few days after march 15, so I also emailed Discovery. It airs again on May 14th at 8pm EST. However the only information on purchasing the documentary was that it is not available for purchase. No details on when it might be either.

[civil]

Thanks Joe in Rosell I'm getting my DVR set to record it now!

When I was down at MEPS this last week I was talking with the counselors about it they said it was awesome and any 18x'er should watch.

[dadof18x'er]

I noticed this thread a few days after march 15, so I also emailed Discovery. It airs again on May 14th at 8pm EST. However the only information on purchasing the documentary was that it is not available for purchase. No details on when it might be either.

apparently it is for sale...http://store.discovery.com/detail.php?p=262249&v=discovery&pa=discoveryxml

as for the May 14th showing, I can't find any info on that.

[civil]

It's on tonight at 9pm, 11pm, and 12am on discovery channel
(times in eastern standard)

Also Saturday the 15th at 12am on discovery

[122418b]

I have a little bit different perspective.

I went thru the Q course one and a half times. I enlisted as a teenager in the early 80s until I bit the dust on a written test (81 FDC in the Phase II weapons Course) then went back and graduated, after attending SFOT ( what SFAS was first title in the late 80s.


Let me be clear. Both old prephase and Phase I and SFOT were a suckfest. A different kind of suck, but a suck non the less.

Hats of to my comrades who made it thru the q off the street. For me, however, second time around was much easier after having been a trooper, pushed troops, been to Ranger school, been a FDC chief, etc. Also, it gave me a base of experience to take to a ODA.

I went to SFOT in fall 88. I recently watched the special. One of other posters on this forum advised that he does not remember all that yelling. I agree. I remember very little of the cadre shouting. The course was severe enough that there was a huge drop rate.

My .02 cents

Death is nature's way of telling you you've failed selection.

[Geenie]

It has been brought to my attention that the documentary is now available online. I won't post a link due to the copyrighted nature of the material, but a quick search should get anyone who wishes to see it the desired results.

[Eagle5US]

I have a little bit different perspective.

Let me be clear. Both old prephase and Phase I and SFOT were a suckfest. A different kind of suck, but a suck non the less.


I went to SFOT in fall 88. I recently watched the special. One of other posters on this forum advised that he does not remember all that yelling. I agree. I remember very little of the cadre shouting. The course was severe enough that there was a huge drop rate.

My .02 cents

Death is nature's way of telling you you've failed selection.
I was less than a year behind you, and I agree...no yelling. No swearing, no name calling, no nothing. Very simply..."your task is to (insert task here)" at the end of said task, your next task is to (insert next task). The uniform and time for the next task was put out at the end of the previous task. You either showed up or not, in the correct uniform or not.
People quitting was followed by the statement "Do you wish to voluntarily withdraw from this training?" Simple yes or no was all that was accepted.
I was treated very much as a professional soldier. Though I did not ever know what the standard was, I knew that there was a standard. There was ZERO information provided regarding standards...simply "run down the marked path as fast as you can until you are told to stop". You would round a corner or crest a hill and a cadre member would be standing in the woodline, call your roster number, and you would sit there and watch others run (or walk) on past. This was the Jedi portion of it that caused many to "psych themselves out"...I must have done something wrong, gone too slow, they saw me cut that corner through the woodline, etc.... and as such, these guys would quit.
Even later as an SFAS Cadre, I saw the same type of behavior. It was interesting to be on both sides of that fence.
SFAS has most certainly changed....but I have to defer to those in the know that they are actually doing what is best for USSF in their processes. It used to be that all the schools whooped and hollared at you. Now that "every school out there" is a gentleman's school...perhaps the extra stress of something folks aren't used to is indeed the element of progression to aid in assessment.

PA

[Horned Frog]

The Discovery Channel has a new series titled "Surviving the Cut" which is intended to highlight the training endured by US military elite units. From http://dsc.discovery.com/tv/surviving-the-cut/

"With extraordinary, unprecedented access, Surviving the Cut takes viewers into the intense world of military elite forces training. From divers and snipers to para-rescue men and bomb specialists, the elite and how they earn a place in the coveted units are the focus in this compelling all new series."

The episode guide lists the following:
Army Ranger School, USAF Pararescue, USMC Recon, SF Diver, USN EOD, and the ever popular Marine Sniper.

EDIT:
This information has already been posted in the General Discussion Forum, under a post by the name Surviving the Cut.

[MightMonkey]

If you're on iTunes, you can download the documentary for free from their store.

[SouthernDZ]

People quitting was followed by the statement "Do you wish to voluntarily withdraw from this training?" Simple yes or no was all that was accepted.PA

I did my vacation from medlab (90 day TMC-14 rotation) back in 89. The SFAS cadre were authorized two responses to any and all questions posed by candidates:

1. "Do you wish to quit?"

2. "Do you wish to see a medic?"

I don't remember them yelling either of those questions.

[CombatMuffin]

Just finished watching the documentary. It was interesting to see a part of the selection process for the Special Forces, however small that part may have been.

While the physical tests were entertaining and educational to watch, I loved the psychological ones: Testing teamwork, leadership and sheer ingenuity.

Giving the replies in this and other threads and the comment made at the end of the documentary, I am guessing the course gets revamped often to the changing conditions.

Those assessing the candidates performance seemed professional at all times, but I couldn't help but try to imagine what was going through their heads, since they have all been through it and more.

All in all it was fun to watch and get a peek at how the QP's start selection.

[Green Light]

Team 4 was a real study in group dynamics, or lack of it. I'm sure most of us could see the missed opportunities. There are some groups of people who just get "stuck on stupid." I'm sure that every one of those guys can look back and see where they screwed the pooch but they weren't tired and disoriented.

It happens. I saw a field grade officer get brain lock and his company grades and NCOs pulled his cookies out of the fire when it counted. Like on the other teams, the others stepped in and said "Hey - let's try this . . ." I'm glad that they're testing that now. It'll save a bunch dead guys later.

It's interesting to see the young guys going through. When you get down to it, they're a lot like us older guys.

[Dozer523]

It's interesting to see the young guys going through. When you get down to it, they're a lot like us older guys. Except for the "younger" part.:D (Strike up Those Were The Days, My Friend)
Initially the idea was to see if a candidate was the "right cut of cloth". If the material was right, no matter what the pattern, the suit would fit.

[tetra]

I just received the DVD today and watched it. I thoroughly enjoyed it. There were some really good lessons learned.

What I liked most about it, besides a few lines the Cadre said during log PT, was that it also showed/hinted at what not to do AND what to do instead. For instance, Group 4 didn't have anyone jump up and volunteer to take control of their group and instead stayed quiet to the detriment of the group tasks. Instead of having a fail group, it's probably better for someone to take charge and attempt to do something better for the group which no one seemed to do. In addition to no sleeping on ruck's and no walking on roads - I would hate to be road kill.

Also, I'm going to my local national forest and doing night land nav with either my Dad (enlisted -> retired 11B 2 years ago) or my recruiter. It seemed to me, from the documentary, that after the PT a really big focus was on rucking and land nav and land nav seems to me to be one of the areas most easily increased with a bit more focus and studying before attending.

It was also interesting to see the difference between SFAS and the Air Force PJs (Surviving the Cut (which is also a really interesting/informative show to watch)) Extended Training Day that aired this past Wednesday (8/25).

All in all, It has made me more hungry for attending SFAS and really affirmed that I made a good choice in choosing 18X. I'm glad SF/Army - whoever - allowed this documentary to be shot. For now, however, the 25m target.

Paul

[Wiseman]

An individual has uploaded the Discovery documentary about SFAS on youtube in 9 parts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTVLKGsZCKc&feature=related

You can see the subsequent parts on the right side.