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akv
10-01-2009, 11:51
Granted this is coming from a civilian and Israeli perspective, I thought folks here still might find the transcript of interest.


October 2009
Israel and Iran – an Assessment

Author: Alon Ben-David, Military Analyst
(alonb@10.tv)

The showdown with Iran over its nuclear program is about to reach the critical moment: within the next year it will be decided whether Iran will be allowed to continue developing nuclear capabilities or will be forced to desist. Since the June Presidential elections through the recent exposure of the clandestine nuclear facility in Qom, the Iranian regime's position has deteriorated both internally and internationally. Although Iran remains defiant and is still determined to pursuit its nuclear ambitions, it is now facing a firm international coalition convinced in the need to prevent the Islamic Republic from obtaining nuclear weapons. Israel, which in the last years began adapting to the idea it might be left alone to face Iran, is now encouraged by the determination of the US and EU powers to stop Iran. Yet, Israel continues to maintain and improve its military options against Iran, but those will not be considered before spring 2010.

How far is Iran from getting the bomb?

In order to become a nuclear power, Iran needs three elements: fissile material, the actual nuclear device, and the means to deliver it (missiles, fighter aircraft). While there is no dispute that Iran possesses both the ability to produce fissile material and the missiles to deliver a nuclear warhead, there is an ongoing controversy between intelligence agencies on whether Iran is already developing the actual weapon.

Missiles: Iran has been anything but shy in displaying its ballistic missile capabilities, currently covering a 2,000 km range and with a potential of extending it to 4,000 km, which will place all of Europe within their reach. The recent missiles – the Shahab-3, Ghadr-1 and Sejil-2 – were all designed to accommodate nuclear warheads.

Fissile material: under the surveillance cameras of the IAEA, the centrifuges at Iran's uranium enrichment facility in Natanz produce 3kg of low-enriched uranium (LEU) per day. So far, Iran has amassed 1,500kg of LEU, which, by a matter of a decision, could be fed again into the centrifuges and turned into 30kg of high-enriched uranium, more than enough for making one nuclear bomb.
Despite initial setbacks, during the last year Iran had mastered the technology of uranium enrichment and now has all the know-how to produce the fissile material.

The weapon: there is no doubt that Iranian engineers began sketching the Iranian bomb years ago. Some of their drawings and calculations were obtained by intelligence agencies and delivered to the IAEA. There is, however, a disagreement whether the "weapon group" – the body that designs the actual bomb - continues working. Israeli Mossad, UK MI6 and German BND claim they do – US intelligence agencies assess that the work on the actual bomb had ceased in 2003 and hasn't renewed since. Based on all that, intelligence estimates on when Iran could produce its first nuclear bomb vary from 2010 to 2015. It could be, however, that Iran will choose to continue amassing fissile material and remain a screw-turn away from making an actual bomb.

Could negotiations dissuade Iran?

For the first time, the masters of brinkmanship from Tehran are facing a powerful international coalition, resolved to reach a decisive outcome from the negotiations and willing to move to harsher sanctions, should the negotiations fail. Among the P5+1, the US, UK, France and Germany hold a tight unified position, while Russia is still reluctant and China is not a partner in this effort. Therefore, there is no credible threat of UN Security Council sanctions against Iran. Still, the threat of US and EU sanctions is quite deterring for Iran, and the powers will allow the negotiations to continue until December, before considering moving to sanctions. Weakened by the exposure of the Qom facility and the internal strife, Iran realizes it will have to make some concessions in order to avoid facing exacerbated sanctions. Yet, it has no intention of giving up its nuclear ambitions. The coming months will show an Iranian veil dance: entering the negotiations fully covered, while indicating it is willing to take off a veil or two, as long as it gets to keep some veils on by the end of the dance. In other words, Iran will be willing to accept a compromise of some international monitoring on its nuclear program as long as it will be allowed continue developing it. The unknown here is how strong is the resolution of the Western powers to completely shut down the Iranian program. Such a compromise may appear attractive to the US, as it could be presented as an achievement of Obama's policy of 'engagement'. However, without practically experiencing stronger sanctions, Iran will not back down.

What are Israel's options?

Loyal to its tradition of preventing neighboring countries from obtaining nuclear weapons, Israel will closely follow the negotiations with Iran, while continuing to prepare its military option. For the past decade, Israel, along with other partners, has been operating covertly to delay the progress of Iran's nuclear program. Indeed, Iranian scientists have met with a long series of technical difficulties that prolonged their efforts to create an efficient uranium enrichment facility. However, Iran has overcome most of these difficulties and it appears that clandestine operations could no longer significantly delay the program. In the past, Israel was able to deny neighboring countries from developing nuclear capabilities by destroying their facilities in a single air strike. However, Iran has learned the lessons from Israel's attack on the Iraqi reactor in 1981 and on the Syrian reactor in 2007, and has dispersed its nuclear facilities in multiple locations, burying many of them under ground.

Looking at the size of the Israel air force, the range between Israel and Iran (1,500 km) combined with the dispersal of Iran’s nuclear program makes it clear that Israel’s capabilities to destroy the whole of the Iranian nuclear program are very limited. Any military operation would aim to merely delay the Iranian program in several years. Should such operation will be launched and generate a direct Iranian response, Israel is prepared to go into a campaign against Iran, which will try to demonstrate to Iran the high costs of continuing with the nuclear program. Such a campaign will aim not only at Iran's nuclear facilities, but also at infrastructure and regime targets. Israel is capable of inflicting considerable damage on Iran, but that would trigger a painful Iranian response, either directly against Israel or through its proxies: Hizbullah in Lebanon and Hamas in Gaza. A military operation will also have enormous costs in international legitimacy and could expose US forces in the region to an Iranian retaliation. That is why Israel will launch a military operation against Iran only as a genuine last resort.

Does Netanyahu have the legitimacy to act against Iran?

There is a wide consensus that crosses most political parties that Israel could not tolerate a nuclear Iran. There is also a common understanding that if Iran obtains nuclear weapons, it will trigger a swift nuclear arms race in the region, starting with Egypt and Saudi Arabia, which will make life unbearable for Israel. Prime Minister Netanyahu was one of the pioneers that pointed to the threat of an Iranian bomb back in the 1990s, when the idea was still considered science fiction. In private conversations, Netanyahu speaks on preventing Iran from getting the bomb as his historical mission. That perception of emissary will be moderated by a more hesitant Defense Minister and a military establishment which is far from being trigger-happy. The US has, so far, been strictly against any Israeli operation and refused to grant Israeli fighter aircraft the permission to cross US-controlled airspace in the Gulf on their way to Iran. Unlike the case of Syria in 2007, there is very low likelihood that the Obama Administration will endorse an Israeli strike on Iran. Despite all that, if faced with undisputable proof that Iran is about to have a nuclear weapon – Netanyahu will act, rising above any ordinary political considerations. He will be supported by Israeli public opinion and opposition leader, Tsipi Livni, who might even join his government. His dilemma will become much more complex if Iran will be allowed by the international community to continue its program under inspection. In any case, Israel will not interfere with the diplomatic efforts in the coming months and will not consider a military option before spring 2010, when weather conditions would again permit an air strike.


Bottom line: the Israeli motto of "keeping all options on the table" reflects an authentic willingness to act forcefully in order to prevent Iran from obtaining nuclear weapons. There are limitations to Israel's military capabilities vis-à-vis Iran, but it is still capable of causing considerable damage to Iran's nuclear program and delaying it in several years. However, recognizing its limited military capabilities and considering the almost certain Iranian response, Israel would prefer that other forces will act to stop Iran’s nuclear program and will consider a military strike against Iran only if all else fail.

incarcerated
10-03-2009, 02:28
A little more Israeli perspective:
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1254393086509&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull


'US won't make Israel disclose nukes'

By JPOST.COM STAFF
Oct 3, 2009 8:41 | Updated Oct 3, 2009 8:44
US President Barack Obama will not pressure Israel to publicly disclose its suspected nuclear weapons program, nor will he pressure the Jewish state to sign the nuclear Non-Proliferation treaty, the Washington Times reported on Friday.
According to unnamed officials quoted by the paper, the understanding between Obama and Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu was reached during the first meeting between the two leaders at the White House in May.

The Times reported that there had been concern in Israel that the US president would renege on a 1969 agreement between Jerusalem and Washington, because of his focus on the Iranian nuclear threat, and his push for nonproliferation

Speaking to Channel 2 last week, Netanyahu seemingly made reference to the nuclear understanding, stating that when Obama mentioned nuclear nonproliferation in his speech to the UN General Assembly, he was referring to North Korea and Iran, rather than Israel.

The Times also quoted an unnamed Senate staffer as saying that Obama had given Israel an "NPT treaty get out of jail free card."

kgoerz
10-03-2009, 06:58
For the first time, the masters of brinkmanship from Tehran are facing a powerful international coalition, resolved to reach a decisive outcome from the negotiations and willing to move to harsher sanctions, should the negotiations fail. Among the P5+1, the US, UK, France and Germany hold a tight unified position, while Russia is still reluctant and China is not a partner in this effort. Therefore, there is no credible threat of UN Security Council sanctions against Iran. Still, the threat of US and EU sanctions is quite deterring for Iran, and the powers will allow the negotiations to continue until December, before considering moving to sanctions. Weakened by the exposure of the Qom facility and the internal strife, Iran realizes it will have to make some concessions in order to avoid facing exacerbated sanctions. Yet, it has no intention of giving up its nuclear ambitions. The coming months will show an Iranian veil dance: entering the negotiations fully covered, while indicating it is willing to take off a veil or two, as long as it gets to keep some veils on by the end of the dance. In other words, Iran will be willing to accept a compromise of some international monitoring on its nuclear program as long as it will be allowed continue developing it. The unknown here is how strong is the resolution of the Western powers to completely shut down the Iranian program. Such a compromise may appear attractive to the US, as it could be presented as an achievement of Obama's policy of 'engagement'. However, without practically experiencing stronger sanctions, Iran will not back down.


All I had to see was the mention of the UN and sanctions to know it will be a total failure. They need to sell the UN Building to D. Trump and let him turn it into a Casino. Thats the only way anything good will ever come out of that Building.

Red Flag 1
10-03-2009, 08:18
All I had to see was the mention of the UN and sanctions to know it will be a total failure. They need to sell the UN Building to D. Trump and let him turn it into a Casino. Thats the only way anything good will ever come out of that Building.

Agreed!

Also the first time the building will see any kind of leadership.

My $.02.

RF 1

incarcerated
10-04-2009, 02:03
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article6860161.ece#

Israel names Russians helping Iran build nuclear bomb

From The Sunday Times
October 4, 2009
Uzi Mahanimi in Tel Aviv, Mark Franchetti and Jon Swain
Israel's prime minister, Binyamin Netanyahu, has handed the Kremlin a list of Russian scientists believed by the Israelis to be helping Iran to develop a nuclear warhead. He is said to have delivered the list during a mysterious visit to Moscow.

Netanyahu flew to the Russian capital with Uzi Arad, his national security adviser, last month in a private jet.

His office claimed he was in Israel, visiting a secret military establishment at the time. It later emerged that he was holding talks with Vladimir Putin, the Russian prime minister, and President Dmitry Medvedev.

“We have heard that Netanyahu came with a list and concrete evidence showing that Russians are helping the Iranians to develop a bomb,” said a source close to the Russian defence minister last week.

“That is why it was kept secret. The point is not to embarrass Moscow, rather to spur it into action.”

Israeli sources said it was a short, tense meeting at which Netanyahu named the Russian experts said to be assisting Iran in its nuclear programme.

In western capitals the latest claims were treated with caution. American and British officials argued that the involvement of freelance Russian scientists belonged to the past.

American officials said concern about Russian experts acting without official approval, had been raised by the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) in a report more than a year ago.

“There has been Russian help. It is not the government, it is individuals, at least one helping Iran on weaponisation activities and it is worrisome,” said David Albright, a former weapons inspector who is president of the Institute for Science and International Security.

However, Israeli officials insist that any Russian scientists working in Iran could do so only with official approval.

Robert Einhorn, the special adviser for non-proliferation and arms control to Hillary Clinton, the US secretary of state, is understood to believe that Russian companies have also supplied material that has been used by Iran in the production of ballistic missiles....

dadof18x'er
10-04-2009, 07:26
wouldn't Iran need to test a nuke weapon before they would

become a threat? growing up in the 60's it was common to

hear about weapons testing. I know theoretically you could

build one and go successfully deploy it but what are the chances

of that happening?

Utah Bob
10-04-2009, 12:03
wouldn't Iran need to test a nuke weapon before they would

become a threat?


Not anymore than Hitler wasn't a threat until he invaded Poland. You need to stay one jump ahead, not react after the fact.

Richard
10-04-2009, 12:24
Point Person: Our Q&A with Robert Baer
Dallas Morning News, 2 Oct 2009

Robert Baer spent 20 years as a CIA field officer in some of the Middle East's most dangerous places. He has written three books and was portrayed by actor George Clooney in the film Syriana. His most recent book, The Devil We Know, addresses weaknesses in U.S. policy toward Iran.

Your book attributes Iran's regional ascendancy through the careful use of asymmetric warfare using proxies like Hezbollah and Hamas, which gives Tehran the cloak of plausible deniability. What's plausibly deniable about a nuclear bomb?

The CIA has said, since going back to the Shah's time, every couple of years that they're going to have a nuke. "They're just two years away, three years away, four years away." The pattern they [the Iranians] have set up is just sort of playing around with nukes. They're certainly more advanced than the Pakistanis are and could've had a bomb by now.

I don't really see them in a race to get one, even with this facility in Qom. They do have a legitimate need for nuclear energy; there's no question about it. They've got 71 million people. That [a nuclear bomb] is not the way they project their power. I think the Iranians are smart enough to know that if they get a nuke, then the Turks are going to want one, and the Saudis are going to want one. And whatever advantage they got in exploding a nuclear bomb would quickly be overcome.

What about the idea of not exploding a nuclear bomb but just having it?

A lot of it is also the deterrence capability, like Saddam pretended to have a nuclear bomb or was getting weapons of mass destruction. I don't think they can afford to test one right now simply because – talk about bringing the Chinese and the Russians over the line. They would have to go along with an embargo and real sanctions. I think they are biding their time, and their real power is through proxies and asymmetrical warfare.

What's the best way to make Iran behave responsibly?

What we haven't tried so far is talking to them. ... Obama's aligning himself with 35 years of failed American foreign policy – which started with Carter – is a mistake. When he brought up the Qom facility, he should have done this in private. With the Iranians, it's very difficult – especially when they're facing internal problems – to attempt to humiliate the leadership in Tehran. Their back is to the wall now. They cannot give in on this nuclear issue, on Qom or the rest of it. That's the reason they fired the rockets [on Monday].

How should Jimmy Carter have handled it differently?

With a weak Iran in '79 – we should've done something about it then. The moment we found out that Khomeini joined the people who took our embassy, we should've struck back.

We've tried talking, threatening, cajoling, coercing. What forms of persuasion work with Iran?

The problem is that they look at us as a paper tiger. I'm someone who doesn't believe we should fight a war with them, but they did blow up the Marines [in Beirut in 1983], and we didn't respond. They did take the hostages [in Lebanon]. ... When you kidnap American diplomats, or a CIA agent or anybody else, you're in a state of war.

And what do you do when you're in a state of war? Do you mobilize? Do you go into military negotiations? It's this half-baked policy where we look at Iran through this emotional prism, rather than looking at the facts. The thing is, they've stood down from most of the egregious attacks on the United States. 1996 was the last time we can really prove they were involved in an attack on the United States, and that was in al-Khobar [Saudi Arabia]. That was clearly the time to do something, but the Clinton administration decided not to.

Now, 14 years down the line, do you hold them responsible? Probably not. There is a statute of limitations in international relations, sort of. This is where we need to explore the possibility of coming to a negotiated truce.

Has Iran reached superpower status?

When you're asking five countries in the Security Council to counter Iran, you're getting up there as a superpower. And that's because we've been kicking the can down the road for all these years, not recognizing that they're getting stronger and they're outsmarting us. They've beaten us for 35 years because nobody wanted to take them on. Carter should have carpet-bombed them in Abadan in '79 – and made them think that we were nuts.

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/opinion/points/stories/DN-pointperson_04edi.State.Edition1.2ec52d0.html

incarcerated
10-04-2009, 15:20
wouldn't Iran need to test a nuke weapon before they would become a threat?


Not necessarily. While we would build a prototype and test it, they might be inclined to build five weapons and test one. We don't want to wait for that.

It's the prospect of bio-weapons testing that concerns me.

incarcerated
10-04-2009, 23:09
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1254673319146&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

'Iran has enough info for atom bomb'

Oct 4, 2009 8:27 | Updated Oct 5, 2009 3:14
By JPOST.COM STAFF AND AP
A confidential report compiled by senior officials in the UN nuclear watchdog claims Iran already has enough knowledge to build a nuclear bomb, The New York Times reported on Sunday.

....A December 2007 US National Intelligence Estimate said Iran halted its nuclear weapons program in 2003. However, with the new report, the IAEA has apparently joined those countries, including Israel, disagreeing with the NIE findings.

The agency's analysis also reportedly says that Iran "most likely" obtained the needed information for designing and building an implosion bomb "from external sources" and then adapted the information to its own needs.

Meanwhile, US National Security advisor Gen. Jim Jones on Sunday denied a NY Times report that due to new intelligence regarding Iran's nuclear program, the US would be reassessing its 2007 National Intelligence Estimate.

"We stand by the reports that we put out. You're going to get a lot of speculation," Jones told CNN on Sunday....