View Full Version : Pizza like momma used to make
brewmonkey
07-08-2004, 18:47
The old favorite! Nothing says pizza like a good pie straight from the oven. The only problem with most of them here in the midwest is that what now passes for a pie is a joke. The crap from Pizza Slut, Papa Johns or Domino's may work for those who have never had a real pie, but growing up on LI and eating at Carlucci's was the best! Ok, there was Pauls pizza in Uniondale as well.
I have tried and tried and have even come close a few times to making the perfect dough, but in the end it just isn't the same. I think I need to work that gluten just a little bit more to get that elasticity that is so needed.
Using a basic recipe I can get 2 12" crusts out of this.
3 cups bread flour
1 1/4 warm water (100-120F)
1 package dry yeast (I prefer Red Star)
1 or 2 tablespoons XVOO
2 teaspoons honey
Now I have a kitchen aide (a must for a kitchen!) so it is a little easier to make.
Using 1/4 of the water and the dry yeast mix them together and allow the yeast to bloom for about 5-10 minutes.
When the yeast is ready add the flour, the XVOO, the honey and the yeast mixture to the mixer. Using the dough hook on slow start to mix the ingredients and slowly add the last 1 cup of water. If needed pour a little of the water into the bowl you used for the yeast to get it all out. As the dough starts to come together it will pull into a nice ball on the hook and there should be little if any on the side of the bowl. Watch for using to much water as you add it. If the dough starts to look like a lump of wet clay you have added to much. To fix this simply add a teaspoon at a time of floor until it is firm again.
Allow the mixer to go for several minutes or once the ball is formed you can work it by hand on a lightly floured counter. This is my prefered method as it works the gluten a little better.
Place in a lightly oiled bowl and cover with a towel (this will prevent a skin). Proof until double in size and then punch down. Cut the dough into 2 equal pieces and roll out to desired size. Cover and allow 15-20 minutes to rise.
Add your toppings and bake in a 500 degree oven for about 10-12 minutes or until you see the cheese is browning.
This crust will bubble up like a good pizza should IMHO. If this bothers you, you can dock it with a fork by simply poking the tines across the dough a few times.
Best toppings for this are a good sauce, some torn Basil (NOT CUT) and fresh Mozzarella.
You can also add some herbs and spices to the dough mixture. Sometimes I add dried basil & oregano and a clove or 5 of minced garlic.
I know this rather lengthy but it really is simple.
brownapple
07-09-2004, 04:53
Cut the dough before you put it in to the bowl and proof. If you start with the ball the size required for a single pizza and then let it proof before throwing (don't roll a pizza out, learn to throw it, it makes a difference), you'll get a better crust (my opinion, based on my experience). Oh, I don't know about LI pizzerias, all my favorites are in Manhatten or Jersey City.
Originally posted by Greenhat
...(don't roll a pizza out, learn to throw it, it makes a difference)... I don't know how to throw it. Any tips?
brewmonkey
07-09-2004, 10:08
Originally posted by Greenhat
Cut the dough before you put it in to the bowl and proof. If you start with the ball the size required for a single pizza and then let it proof before throwing (don't roll a pizza out, learn to throw it, it makes a difference), you'll get a better crust (my opinion, based on my experience). Oh, I don't know about LI pizzerias, all my favorites are in Manhatten or Jersey City.
I agree, it should be hand tossed. I have been able to do it a few times but I am still working on the elasticity of the dough. I need to find flour with a higher protein content then what I have right now. I tried wheat flour as well as barley flour but they all end up having some bleaching in the process which is harmful to the protein. With the higher protein comes more gluten which will give me the dough I am looking for.
brewmonkey
07-09-2004, 10:10
Originally posted by lrd
I don't know how to throw it. Any tips?
Be gentle.
I do it by starting the dough on the board and pressing from the middle to the outer edge with my thumbs. Once I have the dough to about 8" in diameter I toss it back and forth on the heel of my palms and slightly turning it each time I pass it back and forth. Once you have it a bit bigger you use your knuckles to stretch it out and toss it, but be careful you do not stretch it to thin and tear it.
Bill Harsey
07-09-2004, 13:15
Any recipes for the sauce? I'm printing out the dough recipe now, sounds very good! One day our old electric oven finally quit and my wife had made pizza to be cooked in there for dinner. I went out in the shop, cleaned the ceramic floor of the heat treat oven , did a good pre-heat and cooked the pizza in there. It was perfect. For anyone who thinks it was dirty in there, the heat treat oven is not. It operates at 2000 degrees F and nothing but occasional fine steel oxides to sweep out. You can't get a kitchen oven that clean.
The Reaper
07-09-2004, 13:20
Originally posted by Bill Harsey
For anyone who thinks it was dirty in there, the heat treat oven is not. It operates at 2000 degrees F and nothing but occasional fine steel oxides to sweep out. You can't get a kitchen oven that clean.
Except an occasional pizza crumb in the knife steel now.
TR
Roguish Lawyer
07-09-2004, 13:32
Originally posted by Greenhat
all my favorites are in Manhatten or Jersey City.
What are some good ones in Manhattan?
brownapple
07-09-2004, 21:15
Originally posted by Roguish Lawyer
What are some good ones in Manhattan?
John's in the village is one if you like a thin pizza. If you like a Sicilian pizza, try the corner of 3d Avenue and St. Marks. If that little pizzeria is still there, they do a heck of a job.
brownapple
07-09-2004, 21:20
Originally posted by lrd
I don't know how to throw it. Any tips?
Press it out into a small circle with your fingertips, toss it on the backs of your hands. Don't toss high, just little tosses with a little spin. It isn't hard, but does take a little time to learn. One of those skills best learned in person.
brewmonkey
07-10-2004, 10:10
Originally posted by Bill Harsey
Any recipes for the sauce? I'm printing out the dough recipe now, sounds very good! One day our old electric oven finally quit and my wife had made pizza to be cooked in there for dinner. I went out in the shop, cleaned the ceramic floor of the heat treat oven , did a good pre-heat and cooked the pizza in there. It was perfect. For anyone who thinks it was dirty in there, the heat treat oven is not. It operates at 2000 degrees F and nothing but occasional fine steel oxides to sweep out. You can't get a kitchen oven that clean.
In Naples they use ovens that get close to 900F IIRC. If you go there and order a Pizza Margaretta they will only have it in the oven for a few minutes as that is all it needs.
For a sauce for the pizza I generally use something like Contadina tomato sauce made from Roma tomato's and then add my own herbs and spices to taste. A small 6 oz can is perfect size for several small pizza's. For spices I like a bit of fresh garlic, a pinch of salt and pepper. You can also go for some basil, marjarom & oregano. I have them fresh from the garden and put them directly on the pizza.
The key to it is simplicity. Not to many flavors that overpower, they sould all be there and subtle.
For the cheese fresh mozzarella is nice but whatever the store has works. I also have been known to throw some other cheeses on like asiago, pecorino romano or pepato romano & parmigiano reggiano.
Bill Harsey
07-10-2004, 22:47
Brewrilla! Thanks, that explains the some of how the crust gets on the pizza we had in several places in Italy a few months ago. We were close to Naples, just up the coast in Sorrento then Rome and Florence. Also did a fast assualt on the Island of Capri for pizza lunch one day. We found a place in Florence that must have cooked the pizza like you describe. The only thing I learned on the streets of Rome is where Grand Prix auto racing came from. That and some old boy did a good job painting the ceiling of a small church in the Vatican. (edited for my traditional spelling skills)
Bill Harsey
07-10-2004, 22:48
Just remembered, I can get 900F easy in the heat treat oven.
I don't belive this !!!!
There's only ONE Pizza boys and girls....and that's CHICAGO style Pizza. Deep Dish, with lots of gueey cheese and great sauce on top.
Ird.....don't worry about getting tips on throwing that N.Y. style pizza. If you ever want to make a NY style, just take some katchup and put it on some cardboard, then put some old, stale cheese on it. Put it in the sun for a few days and let what ever lands on it stay.....There's your Meats. Then go out and change the oil in your car, and put the old oil on the "pie", there's the oil that runs down your arm. That's NY style folks, plain and simple, so we don't need to discuss this any further. :D
No, for really GREAT Pizza, it's either Old Chicago or UNO's in Chi-town....Now that's Pizza:lifter
Roguish Lawyer
07-11-2004, 21:17
Originally posted by Sdiver
I don't belive this !!!!
There's only ONE Pizza boys and girls....and that's CHICAGO style Pizza. Deep Dish, with lots of gueey cheese and great sauce on top.
Ird.....don't worry about getting tips on throwing that N.Y. style pizza. If you ever want to make a NY style, just take some katchup and put it on some cardboard, then put some old, stale cheese on it. Put it in the sun for a few days and let what ever lands on it stay.....There's your Meats. Then go out and change the oil in your car, and put the old oil on the "pie", there's the oil that runs down your arm. That's NY style folks, plain and simple, so we don't need to discuss this any further. :D
No, for really GREAT Pizza, it's either Old Chicago or UNO's in Chi-town....Now that's Pizza:lifter
Repeating myself from another thread, but I like Giordano's for this type of pizza.
Originally posted by Sdiver
No, for really GREAT Pizza, it's either Old Chicago or UNO's in Chi-town....Now that's Pizza:lifter
NIce recap on NY pizza, better hide from brewmonkey. Uno's is ok...Gino's East is better and Salerno's is best! :p
Originally posted by Gypsy
NIce recap on NY pizza, better hide from brewmonkey. Uno's is ok...Gino's East is better and Salerno's is best! :p
Uggghhhhhh....You're making me home sick Darlin'.
BTW....why would I need to hide from Brew?
What ??? Is he going to go balistic because I told the TRUTH?!?:D
Originally posted by Sdiver
Uggghhhhhh....You're making me home sick Darlin'.
BTW....why would I need to hide from Brew?
What ??? Is he going to go balistic because I told the TRUTH?!?:D
Well hurry on back I remember something about a road trip soon? :D
LOL, maybe.
brownapple
07-12-2004, 03:51
Originally posted by Sdiver
I don't belive this !!!!
There's only ONE Pizza boys and girls....and that's CHICAGO style Pizza. Deep Dish, with lots of gueey cheese and great sauce on top.
Ird.....don't worry about getting tips on throwing that N.Y. style pizza. If you ever want to make a NY style, just take some katchup and put it on some cardboard, then put some old, stale cheese on it. Put it in the sun for a few days and let what ever lands on it stay.....There's your Meats. Then go out and change the oil in your car, and put the old oil on the "pie", there's the oil that runs down your arm. That's NY style folks, plain and simple, so we don't need to discuss this any further. :D
No, for really GREAT Pizza, it's either Old Chicago or UNO's in Chi-town....Now that's Pizza:lifter
:rolleyes:
brewmonkey
07-12-2004, 08:36
Originally posted by Sdiver
I don't belive this !!!!
There's only ONE Pizza boys and girls....and that's CHICAGO style Pizza. Deep Dish, with lots of gueey cheese and great sauce on top.
Ird.....don't worry about getting tips on throwing that N.Y. style pizza. If you ever want to make a NY style, just take some katchup and put it on some cardboard, then put some old, stale cheese on it. Put it in the sun for a few days and let what ever lands on it stay.....There's your Meats. Then go out and change the oil in your car, and put the old oil on the "pie", there's the oil that runs down your arm. That's NY style folks, plain and simple, so we don't need to discuss this any further. :D
No, for really GREAT Pizza, it's either Old Chicago or UNO's in Chi-town....Now that's Pizza:lifter
Old Chicago's suck IMHO, as they have NO CLUE what good pizza is. They are actually owned by a brewing company (www.rockbottom.com). UNO's? Isn't that a card game?
NEW YORK PIZZA IS DA BOMB! None of this deep dish crap they try to pass off in Chicago. Good old New York pie in a wood fired oven. Where you order A slice because it is as big as your head. Only one other place that I have been had great pie and it was this little Italian shop in Madison WI, right of the campus downtown and it was open till 4am, which was great because the bars closed at 3am.
Bill Harsey
07-12-2004, 09:06
FIGHT!
brownapple
07-13-2004, 02:23
The thing about Chicago pizza? It fills you with bread, cheese and whatever other toppings are on top. The pizza itself doesn't have much taste.
New York pizza? Is about the sauce. Just crust (and not so much as to be filling by itself), great sauce and cheese.
Those used to Chicago style? Don't appreciate a good sauce.
Those used to New York style? Wonder why someone would ruin a pizza dumping all that stuff on it.