View Full Version : Leatherman Roll Call
Bill Harsey
02-13-2008, 16:36
How many of you carry a Leatherman Tool?
How long have you had it?
Any good stories can be posted here too.
I have 3 and carry one in my pack or belt when ever I am working. It is soooo handy and cuts down on the tool bag....
Keep one in my car and one in my truck...... Travel with one in my checked bag and pull it out when I arrive and put it back in my pack.
Beats our Gerber, but I do have a Gerber that the USG bought.... Prefer the Leatherman..:D
I carry a Leatherman Surge. I have had this model since deploying to Afghanistan in February 2006. Funny story- I left my first one one a hilltop in Afghanistan during a night overwatch. I knew the exact hill but, as my luck had it, did not return to said hilltop during the rest of deployment. Fast forward to our deployment being extended to 16 months. I buy a replacement while in Kuwait and then head home on R and R. When I catch back up with my company the guys in my platoon tell me they went to my hill and the tool was there. I let a buddy of mine keep it. Not real interesting but I find it funny.
Well... let's count:
- Wave usually somewhere around
- Mini Tool and Micra in my bag
- Kick in each car
I could tell some stories... and one is still amazing, even to me. We went fishing one day with my best friend (Maciek - and Bill, you should remembert that guy from Atlanta last year!) and our Ladies. In the middle of huuuuuge lake (European kind of huge ;) ) our outboard motor just stopped and... we were in quite less_than_cool situ. But we had our Waves with us! We stripped the motor down to the smallest screw (ok, almost :munchin ), cleaned some parts, pipes etc., assembled it back and after 1.5 hour of our work it started again and brought us back home. Bear in mind that our knowledge about motors was, well... simply there was almost no knowledge. But somehow we managed and in fact we had alot of fun with it. Than we even cached two nice pikes on the way back! That was a cooool day and even cooler adventure. Ane without our Leathermans we'd have to row all the f.....g long way back! Wave can save! :cool:
How many of you carry a Leatherman Tool?
How long have you had it? ..........
Got one in the early 80's, before 1983 anyway, and still have it. Carried A Swiss Army Knife on my belt - my everyday tool, K-Bar on the LBE - heavy duty whacker-hacker, and the Leatherman migrated around my kit based on what I was doing.
The Swiss Army Knife and Leatherman now live in my "go to the range" bag along with misc. stuff I've found handy for out there.
I have one of the first Gerber ones. The can opener sucked, if fact the blade of the can opener broke on a tin of Solomon Island "chili tuna". It became a mostly crappy pair of pliers after that.
Rumblyguts
02-13-2008, 17:56
Got my first one around '93. It got stolen around '95 after I got out, and have had 2 since then.
Story time:
I gave each of my groomsmen one as a gift, and even cut the wedding cake with it. My wife went with it, but was sure that the engraved cake knife was used for the official picture ;)
Also, when I ETS'd I changed the thermostat in my car at a truckstop out towards Asheville with one.
Handy little devils...
brownapple
02-13-2008, 18:29
I currently have two.
Originally got one in the early 80s when my ODA made a purchase for all team members. That was one of the first black Leathermans. Carried it until 1994 when it was confiscated by NYPD.
Bought a replacement, a regular Leatherman, which currently is in my desk drawer in the office.
A couple of years ago, picked up a Wave which I carry pretty much constantly (unless wearing a suit).
Peregrino
02-13-2008, 19:00
I've got 4-5 of them scattered around. Various models of Leatherman and Gerber. Usually find I don't need it until I haven't got it so I always carry one as an insurance policy. Haven't needed them very often so it must work. :D
Kyobanim
02-13-2008, 19:04
I've got a nice one that has a neat little picture on it :cool: I take it with me everywhere. I think it's a year or 2 old.
Roguish Lawyer
02-13-2008, 19:44
I have one, but I am not allowed to bring it into the courtroom. ;)
The Reaper
02-13-2008, 19:53
Charge XT
Charge XTi
Crunch
New Wave
Old Wave
Micra
Gerber
Kershaw
Victorinox
May be a couple more odds and ends around somewhere.
The Old Wave and the Micras are at least 8-10 years old.
I keep one on my belt (First Line), a different one in my vest (Second Line), and one in my ruck (Third Line) whenever it is not illegal.
Used for a lot of things, but the older ones had soft steel cutting jaws and a tendency to pinch the hand.
New ones are better, but the scissors still do not hold a candle to the Wengers.
TR
I have one around here somewhere...been in use for 25+ years..
How many of you carry a Leatherman Tool?
HERE SIR !!!!!
Carry it EVERY day.
How long have you had it?
23+ years.
Any good stories can be posted here too.
Done. :D
http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13394&highlight=leatherman
I have a couple original Leatherman multi-tools laying around, but the one on my belt on the weekend is a Victorinox SwissTool. Keeps me from using my Sebenza for tasks that it was not designed to do.
Wish I had a good story about it, but I have none. It just works well, effectively, and with no fanfare.
Ret10Echo
02-14-2008, 05:51
The last leatherman (wave) I had is now in the possession of some pilot from Southwest Airlines....
Barney in Clevland wouldn't let me take it on the plane because it had a "serrated" blade. I mean the guy with the high-and-tight travelling on official orders and a green id card is the obvious threat (all this was pre-9/11 before you get spun up). And I had the thing on my belt since Munich....
Agreement negotiated was that the crew would keep it until I reached my destination. (Phoenix).
Never saw it again.
I hope he caught his finger in the pliers....:mad:......
mumbleypeg
02-14-2008, 08:44
I have one of the TiCharge's from here that goes wherever legal.
Like duct tape, a Leatherman isn't a perfect solution but it sure can help keep you from falling out of a tree stand.
Used to carry a Gerber in the mid-90's, but later switched to Leatherman because of their bad tool design and bad company relations. Currently a Super Leatherman is the one that is near me at almost all times; carry is a T-2.
I was issued a Leatherman SuperTool a few years back and it was pretty good.
Only quirk was that when using the plier function the "handles" would cut into my palms.
It's now sitting atop a mountain near Jerusalem where i lost it whilst mountain biking. I know has a Victorinox SwissTool which seems to be superior in design to the SuperTool.
Excellent service from both Letherman and Victorinox suppliers whenever i needed.
H
x SF med
02-14-2008, 10:21
I've owned a few over the years - lost a few, gave a way a few, and currently only have one - a black anodized Wave, it's been used for lots of things - car repair, boat repair, leather repair... it's great, but I still carry a good lock blade folder with me for most cutting.
I currently have three plus one Gerber.
Great tools.
Carry one on me everywhere I go, and have one in the car.
One leatherman was with me for everytrip overseas, it has since been retired.
Fantastic little tools.
sfrecrutr
02-14-2008, 11:59
Driving a 60 Panhead, I carry and use one regularly. Used it as a jockey shift handle oneday on the bike. That was an interesting ride!
Ed
x-factor
02-14-2008, 12:01
I've got a Gerber, but no good stories to go with it I'm afraid.
I've used a Leatherman since the late '80s and switched to the Wave a few years ago. I carry and use it everyday for small projects. As for my story, there I was in Sniper School.... just kidding.
Schmalzy
02-14-2008, 21:12
Had one for five years, but about 6 months ago I switched over to the wave. Was given a gerber as a graduation gift, not bad, but I was partial to the leatherman, and now the gerber resides in my truck's glove compartment. The wave helped me get the keys out of my truck, and to start an outboard motor on a cold, early duck hunting trip.
sleepyhead4
02-15-2008, 01:42
I bought my first leatherman in 98 when I was in college. Now I own a wave, which I found at ranger school. Some poor soul must have lost it when he moved on to the next phase...and lucky me, I found it when I recycled.
My story: I cut my finger the first time I tried to close my first leatherman. Somehow it got stuck and I tried to force it close with my thumb in the way of the blade.
I had the original leatherman and brought that to ranger school. I still have a original leatherman but I don't use it. I got a Wave and a Gerber Multi tool. I carry the Gerber on my pants belt and the Wave on my gun belt. I love my Gerber and I use it to make my charges. :D
Goggles Pizano
02-15-2008, 08:13
I have carried one on my duty belt for 18 years. Got a second when I went to narcotics. Third is in my truck.
Constant
02-15-2008, 14:50
I have two leathermans
Both Waves, one the wife and one for me.
Had good use in Iraq, but most of its action has been here in Colorado.
Now let's see....
One Leatherman, Surge
One Gerber, sliding pliers type, large
One Gerber, sliding pliers type, small
One S.O.G. multi-tool, lost in the sands of Iraq, dammit!:mad:
Have used them all to good effect, right up until the SOG flew out of its case. Guess my IBA caught on the retention flap and somewhere along the way, poof!, the SOG grew legs or wings or something.
Carry the Surge and a Gerber RX-350 halogen flashlight attached to the case, on a daily basis.
Cheers!
Mick
My current favorite tool is the Leatherman Charge Ti, I bought it to replace the Wave I lost. I have been using multi tools since the original multi-plier came out (when it had screws holding the pliers to the handle). Leatherman builds a better tool than Gerber. Gerber's tools are too hard. While I was in Robin Sage I used my Gerber to tighten an M60 blank adapter during a raid but broke the screwdriver in the process.
Bill Harsey
02-18-2008, 09:25
Great posts all.
Sdiver,
Thank you for linking to the story. I remember reading that when it was first posted, forgot about the Leatherman.
Bill Harsey
02-18-2008, 09:31
Driving a 60 Panhead, I carry and use one regularly. Used it as a jockey shift handle oneday on the bike. That was an interesting ride!
Ed
MSG,
Please report for immediate duty in the "Redneck Engineering" thread here. ;)
Christophe
02-18-2008, 14:05
I have a Laetherman since around 95.
I now carry it on my duty belt. Needed to thorougly clean it recently, for the first time ever, since rust was starting to form on some of the blades.
I've got the original Gerber as issued to the 5th Group at Ft. Campbell in 1986. In the original black sheath, with a gutted 550 cord dummy cord, it is on my hip every day.
Rougish Lawyer, that means yes, even in court, where the officers can get me to cut open the evidence envelopes.
Had it on my hip last Thursday (Feb 14) during oral arguments before the Supreme Court of Tennessee (State of Tennessee vs. Stacey Carter).
I also own a few Leathermen, the needle point pliers tool is useful, and the mini screwdriver is good for my eyeglasses when the screws start backing out.
Bad news:
When you are cutting something with resistance and the blade folds up on your fingers.
Oh, by the way. No, I wasn't in 5th Group at the time. It just helps to have contacts.
The Reaper
02-18-2008, 21:21
Bad news:
When you are cutting something with resistance and the blade folds up on your fingers.
CSB:
The blades lock on the new ones.:D
TR
For many years. Currently a black SuperTool 200.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CSB
Bad news:
When you are cutting something with resistance and the blade folds up on your fingers.
CSB:
The blades lock on the new ones.
TR
Hmmm...
Maybe I need to renew my contacts with 5th Group.
:)
A PS.com Charge XTi :cool:
My son gave me a New Wave for Christmas. Before that it was a SAK.
Pat
JustinW20
02-19-2008, 11:13
Carry one Wave with me (when not in a suit) and another in the earthquake/bug-out bag in my car. Got my dad a black Wave for Christmas last year. He loves it, now he can be a “tactical” old guy… ;)
As far as stories, I find a use for it almost daily. Once used it to assemble an entire studio apartment’s worth of Ikea furniture…
Retired W4
02-19-2008, 11:33
Started carrying a Leatherman in my headset bag in the 90's. Bought several out of pawn shops in the DFW area back then. Kept a SuperTool in the company helicopter and one in the company jet. They both saw a lot of use. I currently have a SuperTool in my bass boat and a Wave in my truck.
SuperTool in the glove box at all times.. various other Gerbs, cheap knock offs and replicas floating around the house and shop.
Also, got a handy little miniature one that clips to a key ring... not sure who made it, but it seems to get the most use.
Aoresteen
02-19-2008, 17:47
I have a Wave and I keep it on my IBA (right side plate front edge). I use a MOLLE compatable sheath to hold it. It gets used all the time, Iraqis think it's great. Highly reccomended. Would not deploy with out it.
Surgicalcric
03-11-2008, 13:40
Have two, make that one now... Think one of the HN guys wanted one of mine more than I needed it, or so he thought.
I have had Gerbers, Leatherman, and a couple SOG's but like the Leathermans the best for their durability and handling.
Need to pick up another soon.
Crip
Need to pick up another soon.
Crip
Don't bother, Brother.
I already picked one up for your return CONUS, considering I wasn't around to give it to you when you graduated. Consider it my thank you for standing as a steadfast friend and a stellar example of what a QP should be.
Wishing you the best!
Mick
NoRoadtrippin
03-15-2008, 19:16
I run a Gerber on my hip and a Leatherman Wave on my modular gear....
Has anyone seen the new Leatherman? I work at an outdoor shop on the civilian side of things...we haven't gotten our hands on it yet, but it seems to cut a lot of the fat out. Overall it looks like a pretty wicked tool. The only question is whether or not it also cuts out a lot of the durability...
http://www.leatherman.com/products/tools/skeletool-CX/default.asp
I still own my original PST from 1984. She's been back twice for repairs and updates. I know own approximately four other Leatherman tool and a Gerber.
militarymoron
03-28-2008, 23:13
had an original leatherman PST since about '86, and a mini tool (which i carried on my keychain for years until it got lost). got an old wave when it first came out and that's what i usually have with me now (either on me or in my bag). got a charge TTi last year but i actually prefer the old wave with the non-detachable bits (don't like carrying the extra bits around).
no really good stories stand out, but i use the wave quite often (around the house and outside). having the wave with me has saved my butt from being stranded a couple of times when i had to fix things on my car and motorcycle (minor electrical or mechanical stuff). the pliers and screwdrivers are the most used items on my wave. I've chipped the smaller screwdriver blades and had to regrind them. i usually have a knife on me for cutting tasks.
Bill Harsey
03-29-2008, 08:59
Has anyone seen the new Leatherman? I work at an outdoor shop on the civilian side of things...we haven't gotten our hands on it yet, but it seems to cut a lot of the fat out. Overall it looks like a pretty wicked tool. The only question is whether or not it also cuts out a lot of the durability...
Got one right here on the desk... :D
Claemore
03-31-2008, 21:25
I have a Leatherman SuperTool I've had since 2001, and a Gerber, I don't remember when I picked up the Gerber. But back in 01 I saved a goat's life, or at least a pain in its neck.
I was the resident deputy in a small Wyoming town called Granger. I was on patrol near a large ranch with my window down, when I heard a plaintive bleating. I stopped my Bronco, got out and listened for it again. I was on a slight berm, it was a beautiful spring or summer day; of course the wind was blowing (it was Wyoming for the love of God). I heard it again, the goat could have been calling my name, for I went right to it. Its head was stuck in a wire fence in a position where it had to stand on its hind legs to keep from strangling. I tried to twist its head out of the fence, but due to its struggling and the crazy way the wire of the fence had been doubled over its neck- almost as if it had been done on purpose- like a human had had ulterior motives, if you know what I mean, and I think you do. I took out my trusty Leatherman Super Tool. But the wire was too thick, and the bleating was getting desperate. I had to work the wire cutters around the wire squeezing each time as hard as I could. Finally it snapped, the goat bleated its thanks, and trotted away. The wire cutters were damaged , receiving a notch in the blades, but hey I earned the admiration of goats everywhere. Hopefully.
HMass18Z
04-01-2008, 10:43
I have a Leatherman SuperTool that I got back in 94 or 95 . . . and I have carried it every day since then. I have a Gerber Multi-Tool or two, one of which I am sure I have given to my son, then I always carry a Leatherman Micro-Tool in my pocket.
Rob_0811
04-10-2008, 13:12
I just ordered a Leatherman Charge TTi to replace the Wave that I stupidly mis-placed somewhere.
Can't wait to get it.
Bill Harsey
04-16-2008, 10:57
Since Gerber Tools have been mentioned in this thread I would like to ask Mr. Jeff Freeman if he could help...
Any thoughts Jeff?
Jfreeman
04-16-2008, 11:56
Since you asked, I will add these 4 things:
1. The Gerber "Leatherman" is known as the Multi-tool and/or the Multi-purpose tool. Tim was the inventor and original manufacturer of these tools and so his name stays attached and is often used (incorrectly) interchangeably when referring to these tools in general. It's a fine point but one worth noting. Not all "Cresent" wrenches are made by Cresent.
2. All mass-manufactured items go through an evolution. What was state of the art 5 years ago is now "yesterday's news" in many cases. If you look at the older Leathermans or Gerber MP's and compare them with the newer models, you will certainly notice changes/upgrades in either the designs or materials. Every year we come out with new tools that hopefully address some or all of the shortcomings of the previous year's model. If we didn't, we wouldn't be in business.
3. It is human nature to "broadcast" deficiencies or shortcomings of products. But when you have a minor single questionable experience with an item and then make the leap to blanket statements like "Gerber's MP tools are bad designs" or "all Ford trucks are P.O.S.'s", then you are drawing illogical conclusions. If something is truly wrong, or if something does not live up to your expectations, most manufacturers want to know about it. It would be a great courtesy to provide the information to the maker/manufacturer. If they then fail to explain and/or act on that information in a timely manner with replacements or subsequent newer or upgraded products then fire away.
4. I am sure Leatherman and most other reputable knife/tool/gear manufacturers want to do right by their customers and consumers. As for Gerber, the lifetime warranty means just that: if you ever break anything or something isn't working correctly or you notice some deficiency, just return the item along with a written note of explanation to 14200 SW 72nd Ave. Portland, OR 97224. They will either repair or replace the item with "same or better". If you have any questions or comments you can also call our consumer service center at 503-403-1206. The nice lady's name there is Donda and she really goes out of her way to make things right.
JF
Firebeef
04-16-2008, 12:09
Leatherman Roll Call
How many of you carry a Leatherman Tool?
I just stumbled onto this thread.
My only question is: Does that mean there are people who DON'T have a Leatherman type tool??
:confused:
Used to carry a Gerber in the mid-90's, but later switched to Leatherman because of their bad tool design and bad company relations. Currently a Super Leatherman is the one that is near me at almost all times; carry is a T-2.
Since someone from Gerber is reading this thread; let me elaborate on my original post.
The Gerber Multi-tool I had was bought circa 1994, was about 2 months old, and broke in the first week of a long deployment in the mountains of a 3rd world country. I was cutting the wires on a standard ammo crate with the wire cutter of the Tool when the jaw hinge exploded apart, making the tool unusable as pliers or wire cutters. Upon return from my trip I let Gerber know what happened and the response was that I must have been mis-using the tool for it to break that way. I didn't reply to Gerber because of the tone of their reply and I wasn't interested in owning a Gerber that may break down range when it was needed most.
I soon after bought a Leatherman Tool and even though the Leatherman back then had a few issues (like pinching your hands at times) I never had it break from use and that Leatherman Tool I thought I actually abused at times. I do understand that Gerber Tools have evolved as have the Leatherman Tools and is why I own and still use the Super Leatherman Tool to this day.
Jfreeman
04-17-2008, 09:24
Good points all. I completely understand how a bad experience can "foul the water" when it comes to consumer products.
I do know for a fact that the guys on the tool side of the house have been working hard over the past years to correct the problem that you noticed regarding the strength of the jaws and other implements.
Sorry for the fact that you got "blown off" by someone in customer service. That is not SOP and I would doubt if that person is still with the company. If you still have the tool, return it to the address noted earlier for a repair or replacement.
JF
NoRoadtrippin
04-17-2008, 09:49
Got one right here on the desk... :D
Mr. Harsey,
I should have known you would have one already. We did manage to get some in stock at the shop, but of course now I've only played with it and not worked with it.
Have you given an attempt at breaking it yet? I definitely like the size and weight of it. It seems to have potential as a solid tool. Any thoughts thus far?
Thanks!
Bill Harsey
04-17-2008, 10:13
Mr. Harsey,
I should have known you would have one already. We did manage to get some in stock at the shop, but of course now I've only played with it and not worked with it.
Have you given an attempt at breaking it yet? I definitely like the size and weight of it. It seems to have potential as a solid tool. Any thoughts thus far?
Thanks!
Sir,
Luck not design is how I got one. It was a gift from the president of Leatherman.
I don't try to break other makers stuff for several reasons among which is it's really none of my business how strong their stuff is and it makes me look bad for trying to break it. My job is to try and just take care of my stuff.
Another reason is that being a good old Oregon country boy from a big timber logging outfit, I have seen, if not participated in, breaking almost everything we had. This is why I got to spend much time welding, anything can be broken but the core question is, will the tool hold up for the intended uses that may be required of it?
That said, Leatherman recognizes this and told me that this tool is intended for lighter duty than other tools they make. This is also why it weighs less which is a reason for this model. I think it will work fine.
For the record I have several Gerber Tools in my kit, glove box of the pickup and kitchen drawer for handy use. They all work well.
My only small complaint is the black one is hard to see when I set it down outside at night. Nothing daylight can't solve next morning. ;)
The Reaper
04-17-2008, 10:24
Good points all. I completely understand how a bad experience can "foul the water" when it comes to consumer products.
I do know for a fact that the guys on the tool side of the house have been working hard over the past years to correct the problem that you noticed regarding the strength of the jaws and other implements.
Sorry for the fact that you got "blown off" by someone in customer service. That is not SOP and I would doubt if that person is still with the company. If you still have the tool, return it to the address noted earlier for a repair or replacement.
JF
Jeff:
Thanks for manning up and listening. Donda seems like a great asset. I have a number of older Gerber knives, both fixed and folding, as well as the multi-tools.
Not to pile on here, but my experience parallels Dan's. I have the Gerber tool at the house, but I no longer take it anywhere because its predecessor let me down once. My Leatherman tools have not failed me yet, unless I abused them well beyond the uses they were designed for. "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."
Our profession sends us to remote and austere areas for extended periods of time. It could be as long as six months to a year before you get back to civilization and contact with the manufacturer. As my friend John Carver at Eagle said, what good is a warranty when you are 6,000 miles from home, and the item fails? No matter how good the customer service, or or the warranty, or the product improvements, it does not matter when you are in the middle of BFE and you have to borrow a tool from a team member three times per day because yours is broken. Not to be dwelling on a negative, but we are pretty unforgiving when it comes to our gear. Most of us are willing to pay more to get a quality item that we can bet our lives on. Your average consumer may not. That is the difference between a professional, and a casual user/consumer. There is a reason that the Snap-On trucks sell so many tools for what seem like outrageous prices.
Unfortunately, there appears to be a corporate culture to make the cheapest product possible, and to sell it for a few cents less. I understand that Wal-Mart demands the lowest prices. Most companies appear to be focused on the bottom line, and a penny saved is a penny earned. However, not all of us are willing to sacrifice quality for price in our gear. How much more does a CPM S-30V blade cost in steel and abrasives? Not enough to keep me from buying them when I can. Because it just might be my life, a family member's, or a teammate's ass hanging from the end of a piece of nylon that absolutely, positively, has to be cut right then, at night, in the dark, in the heat or cold, at 10,000', with the inevitable rain or snow coming down in buckets. Or a wire that has to be severed, an ammo can that has to be pried open, or a blasting cap that has to be crimped. Then we have to be able to count on our gear to last longer, cut better, be more durable, etc. I applaud those who continue to push the envelope with regards to new and improved materials, innovative technologies, revolutionary (as well as the safer evolutionary) design, etc., rather than seeking to make the same product for less money. I would have to say that Harsey and Reeve, along with many of the smaller designers and makers, have been on the edge of that new wave of innovation, combining it with old fashioned craftsmanship. I have no antipathy toward Gerber, I understand that the corporate leadership sets the tone, regardless of what the marketing hype says. Not directed specifically at your company, but at what price quality, and how many chances should a user give before looking to alternative products?
TR
NoRoadtrippin
04-17-2008, 14:30
I don't try to break other makers stuff for several reasons among which is it's really none of my business how strong their stuff is and it makes me look bad for trying to break it. My job is to try and just take care of my stuff.
Another reason is that being a good old Oregon country boy from a big timber logging outfit, I have seen, if not participated in, breaking almost everything we had. This is why I got to spend much time welding, anything can be broken but the core question is, will the tool hold up for the intended uses that may be required of it?
Roger that. I really meant that as a tongue in cheek way of saying "have you used it much yet," but then I suppose sarcasm can be difficult to detect via the internet. Ha.
Thanks for the response either way. I also like my Gerber, its been with me for a long number of years.
Jfreeman
04-17-2008, 15:35
TR:
I completely agree with your assessment of the warranty and what it is worth when you are in the field.
The product design parameters differ between Chris Reeve and Gerber by about 180 degrees. Chris is trying to make the best he can for his targeted consumer with the tools at his disposal. He then prices things to account for this with very good results.
Oftentimes, my design briefs will amount to this: it needs to do x,y and Z, it should make "X" gross margin and it should retail for $29.99. With this information, we try to make the best knife/tool/gear we can under the given constraints. In many cases, the end result (product) was not intended for serious users such as yourself but rather for a certain "casual" user who does not need to rely on the product in life/death situations. Our business was built on providing affordable price-point and consumer targeted items at a given quality level. And of course the quality level always comes down to the value proposition: what do you need and how much will you pay for it?
For our knife category, I try to focus more on the value proposition. For example, if marketing wants a $35 clip knife for the mass consumer I try to make the item the best you can get for $35.
IMO, many knife manufacturers let the marketing hype bury that information. What you end up with are unmet expectations and upset customers, ie:, a product is marketed as the best/toughest/strongest but in reality it was never designed to be that way in the first place.
As for your last question, I assume one chance is all most people will give when there are plenty of alternative options.
JF
As for your last question, I assume one chance is all most people will give when there are plenty of alternative options.
In many cases, the end result (product) was not intended for serious users such as yourself but rather for a certain "casual" user who does not need to rely on the product in life/death situations.
It seems the answer to you question is in your reply. Not everyone deals in life and death. It is not always a matter of getting value for one's dollar...that said, if a $39.99 tool works every time, I am not as likely to be tempted by one costing considerably more...if it is an essential part of my kit, I will spend the money based on reputation and the input of people who have the tool and use it the way I will have to...in my profession(s), when it comes to matters such as this, I listen to my peers, unless I have experience with a manufacturer or vendor. FWIW.
The Reaper
04-17-2008, 18:38
Jeff:
I agree completely.
One of the better "value" knife companies I like which has innovative products at a good price point is CRKT.
Outside of your purview, but too many companies seem to be chasing the last great moneymaker, like tactical flashlights, instead of innovating and coming up with newer, better ideas in their core business.
I agree, if the goal is to make a knife at a specific price point, then make the best one you can for that price. Just bear in mind that some of us prefer to get the quality tool we need and the price is secondary.
That is why you can buy a socket wrench set for $5, or $5,000. Your quality as well as value/pricing, defines your entire business and affects your branding.
TR
Team Sergeant
04-17-2008, 18:50
As for your last question, I assume one chance is all most people will give when there are plenty of alternative options.
JF
Jeff,
"Most people" are not betting their lives on their gear. One chance is all I would ever give a piece of equipment.;)
Team Sergeant
Jfreeman
04-18-2008, 09:32
Just bear in mind that some of us prefer to get the quality tool we need and the price is secondary.
That is why you can buy a socket wrench set for $5, or $5,000. Your quality as well as value/pricing, defines your entire business and affects your branding.
TR
I'm kind of getting off topic here, but my operational definition of "quality" is more manufacturing/design-centered. When we refer to quality in mfg, we are speaking strictly of conformance to standards. Not saying that the standard consumer use of the term is incorrect but rather pointing out the differences to aid in the discussion.
For example, if a blade material was specified to be 420HC heat treated to 56Rc (most likely to hit a cost target), and the process is in control, then we say that the item has a high quality level. Of course this is a much differerent use of the term but it all goes back to the design intent and the accompanying constraints. Using this definition, "quality" is a more concrete and useful term which is important for manufacturers that have a wide variety of product lines to manage. This makes it possble to characterize and compare $29 items with $200 items in a mfg setting.
For design quality, my working definition is also slightly different: If all the parts are made per specification and the processes that make those parts are in control and your finished product does not meet a certain performance criteria(s), then the design quality is bad/failing/below standard.
On the branding idea, I simplify it and use the analogy of a bank account. Most companies will try to build that brand bank account through innovation, value and other things that add to the brand. Over time and with a lot of work and successful products we have built our account up to a certain level. Bad or ill-concieved product or knock-offs make huge withdrawals to our account.
From my perspective, most designers in corporations are more interested in building the brand account while the sales force is more focused on making withdrawals. It's a never-ending battle, but to give in would mean the death of the brand and ultimately, the company.
FWIW,
JF
We were/are issued the Leatherman Wave. It performed great in Iraq. Used it quite a bit when we installed antenae and radios in our vehicle(s). I would have to say the Leatherman has a better feel and seems to have better craftsmanship. The Gerber I owned was not as smooth and it always seemed to pinch my hand when using the pliers....my .02 Regard, Swamp
I received an April Christmas package from Jeff (Jfreeman) / Gerber in today's mail.
I'll plan to check out the multi-tools a bit more and select one for my use; the rest of the many multi-tools, knives, and flashlights will plan to give to some of our brothers to use, as I don't need three of everything :)
I can say from first glance, the Gerber multi-tools have come a long way since the mid-90s and I was very pleased to see a much better designed jaw hinge. The knife designs are interesting and the Omnivore flashlight that is designed to handle three different types of batteries is a great concept and amazingly bright for one commonly found/used AA battery.
Thank you Jeff and thank you Gerber for going the extra mile with this very nice gesture. We will put them all to good use!
I have been inactive for 30 years,, but when I get an opportunity, some hog & deer hunting in the Florida management areas.
For the last 12 years we have lived on the rock,, let's talk saltwater fishing,, both offshore and back country fly.
I have had a SOG B60 (black) for over 10 years, I also carry a set of Donnmar CP850i Ti Pliers and my day carry is a CRKT m16-01T.
They have served well. I chose the Ti series and the black SOG because of saltwater corrosion,, even with daily maintenance,, it will destroy just about anything.
I also ware them tethered to a brake-a-way neckless and stuck in my shirt pocket. If they don't get hit with saltwater,, then they get drench in sweat.
I picked the SOG because of the compound leveraged pliers, black oxide, and at the time it was about 1/3 less weight than the Leatherman.
None has failed in any way..
Which brings me to a question,,
Why don't more of you carry any of the SOG models??
Thanks
I am not sure if this thread is open to everyone for participation, if not, I apologize.
I took Major Martin's advice from Get Selected for Special Forces and bought the Leatherman Super Tool 200.
I don't really use it much, I generally only take it out with me when I go out rucking, keeping it in the ruck because the view here towards multi-tools, etc. doesn't seem to be the same as in the States; or at least that's the case in my area of England due to the rising knife culture and stabbings.
However, I went out for a hike with my father-in-law a few weeks ago in Wales and one of his walking boot laces broke. I brought along my A.L.I.C.E. to get some practice with 45lbs and hills, and I had my Super Tool and some 550 Cord in there along with the weights.
We were able to get his boot laced up using the 550 Cord after cutting it with the Super Tool. So it really made me feel :lifter in front of the father-in-law after that.
The Reaper
05-01-2008, 10:19
I don't really use it much, I generally only take it out with me when I go out rucking, keeping it in the ruck because the view here towards multi-tools, etc. doesn't seem to be the same as in the States; or at least that's the case in my area of England due to the rising knife culture and stabbings.
How sad.
I am truly sorry that England has come to this sorry state of affairs.
Centuries of service at the vanguard of individual rights have come to an ignominious end.
TR
TOMAHAWK9521
05-20-2008, 13:33
I have several Leathermen. Mirco, Super 2000, Surge and the Crunch. My favorite is the Surge because it has the one-hand opening blades on the outside. Had it for a couple years. I loved it until the retention spring used for keeping the interchangeable screwdriver heads fell out and I lost it earlier on this latest deployment. It had a habit of coming loose and finally fell out. Not sure if anyone else had the same problem.
I also have one Gerber Tool. It's the Trail-"Something". The only reason I like it is because it comes with a hoof pick as one of the flip-out tools. That has come in handy while outfitting in the Rockies.
The Reaper
05-20-2008, 14:02
I have several Leathermen. Mirco, Super 2000, Surge and the Crunch. My favorite is the Surge because it has the one-hand opening blades on the outside. Had it for a couple years. I loved it until the retention spring used for keeping the interchangeable screwdriver heads fell out and I lost it earlier on this latest deployment. It had a habit of coming loose and finally fell out. Not sure if anyone else had the same problem.
I also have one Gerber Tool. It's the Trail-"Something". The only reason I like it is because it comes with a hoof pick as one of the flip-out tools. That has come in handy while outfitting in the Rockies.
The Charge has the one handed outside opening features as well.
I agree that a Marlinspike or a reamer, like the old SAKs had, would be a handy attachment to have. Maybe I should just find the biggest Leatherman snap in screwdriver blade they have and grind me one.:D
TR
Rest In Piece(s) to a trusted and well used friend.
Friends,
It is with a heavy and very sad heart that I announce the passing of a trusted and well used friend.
I've had this Leatherman Supertool for the past 20 plus years. It has served me faithfully and truly. Only wanting a little drop of oil and a nice sharping every so often.
My heart is heavy. :(
But I'll feel better after I get a new one. ;)
Bill Harsey
03-25-2009, 09:19
Anybody else break a jaw on their Leatherman?
I broke my super with crimper slot by being a poor user, and abuser!:D
TOMAHAWK9521
03-25-2009, 09:59
I one of those Mini-Leatherman back in the 80's. It had the double fold-out handles and obviously, half the tools as the original. That sucker snapped off at the hinge while doing some weapons maint. Also, a few years back, a friend broke off the top of my standard Leatherman but generously replaced it with the Surge.
Mr. Harsey, Sir
I have owned two Leatherman tools:
1) Supertool
Didn;t really like it much, it was uncomfortable to use. Sadly it is now somewhere on a mountain (hill) in the Judean Desert.
2) Skeletool
A gift from a dear friend and colleague. It is small, and only what i needed, nothing less, nothing more. I loved that Skeletool.
Currently, i use a Victorinox Swisstool that is OK. Broke the tip off awhile back and it (the tool) was replaced with no fuss at all.
My choice, the Skeletool.
H
Anybody else break a jaw on their Leatherman?
Broke the jaw on mine in A-stan 2002, never got another one (still kinda PO'd about it actually)
D9 (RIP)
03-25-2009, 13:01
I've still got the Charge XTi I bought from this website about 4 years ago. It's been through the course and a deployment, and is still going strong.
Best multi-tool I've ever owned.
The Reaper
03-25-2009, 13:05
I have never broken one while using it for its intended purpose, but I have bent a few of the tools.:D
TR
allester666
04-26-2009, 08:18
I have a Wave that served me well through most of the Q, and My newest toy is the Skeletool. The Wave is much older but has a great assortment of tools, and the steel is much stronger and holds an edge better than any gerber tool I have had. Its also very stiff even after alot of use, which is mainly a pro indicating god quality. Its only a pain when your tired and your hands are covered in field sores from Pineland brush. Great tool, still have it and use it mainly in my weapons kit.
The new Skeletool comes with an amazing 154cm knife that will cut through anything. As usual there is no play in the pliers like there is with Gerbers. Not many thrills and frills, just pliers, knife and screwdriver (philips and flat-head). O yea and a bottle opener. I used it in Sage and made many antenna's, it has held up really well but it did show a little rust on the pliers that wiped of with some gun oil.
Gerbers are great to have when you need to do something like pull concertina wire out of your Stryker's wheel hub's or tighten/loosen a stuck screw that tears up your tool quickly. I went through a couple of them in Iraq, thank god for unit supply!! The metal bends and breaks quickly, and the pliers seem to get twisted out of spec a bit easier than leatherman's.
Has Sog disappeared off the market? I haven't seen any lately. Everyone I know that had one liked them, and they will cut through a penny and not lose an edge (PX demo, I don't encourage defacing money).
SOG is still out there, I saw a few while walking through one of the local gun stores in Baton Rouge, la. I've still got a set of PowerPliers that have made it through chainlink, sheetrock screws, and miscellaneous other items that needed to be shorter or just cut.
Also, briefly owned a charge TTi until a neighbor borrowed it and made it dissappear.
x SF med
04-26-2009, 10:24
I just bought some Carhart's a a couple of weeks ago - and they came with a multi-tool - I haven't used it much, doesn't fit the hand really well, but it does come with a few standard nut drivers as well as the 'regular' inventory of tools. My old black anodized supertool 200 gets used most of the time - I just fixed the lights on my brother in law's trailer with it yesterday; oh and it's been used enough that if I hold one handle I can ' throw' it open to use it...
ZooKeeper
04-27-2009, 18:26
I don't know how I missed this thread.
I currently have a Victorinox SwissTool. Surprised it hasn't received more use here.
It spends most of it's time in the truck & goes in my pack whenever I'm outdoors.
No good stories.
The Swiss have taken multi-use tools to the next level! After my third leatherman finally wore out, I changed to the Swiss, (now 10 years old). Never a bad day with it. Tools are available from the outside, reducing the need to open to the pliar mode before other tools are exposed. The Swiss designed, reverse engineered a much superior product.
If the pliar mode is required, then the tools are secured, leaving the hands in a better position and much more comfortable.
I believe the steel in superior, better edge, stronger. Plan on spending a bit more, but worth it.
perdurabo
04-28-2009, 21:35
Live and swear by the Leatherman Wave. Order the $5 pocket clip for it off the Leatherman site and you don't have the belt wart to catch on things. I carry my Wave everywhere I go, even to the gym and jogging. Gotten pretty good at thumbing the blade out quickly.
Boomer-61
05-01-2009, 07:08
I was in Las Penitias Costat Rica three weeks ago on a medical mission. We had a Dental student with us about 2 months from graduation. The village people there had pretty poor dention. This student used a Leatherman for a tooth extraction. After local anesthetic was administered, she sterilized the flat blade screw driver and used it as an elevator to work the tooth loose, then snatched it out with the pliers. I tried to capture a picture from one of those picture share sites (snapfish) but could not get it to copy here. If I can get it I will post it. That was the most unique utilization of the Leatherman I have seen.
I have several (four or five) that I've collected over the years. I broke the pliers on one pair, but Wally-world replaced it no questions asked.
Carpe Noctem
05-08-2009, 17:40
Used and abused a Wave for several years, rocking a Surge now. I don't really like the Surge sheath though, if it had something more like the old formed nylon sheath my Wave came with I'd be happier.
HMass18Z
05-08-2009, 19:22
I have a leatherman that I bought in 94 or 95 and I have carried it almost every day . . . and I cannot remember the model name . . . but it is the BIG leatherman, maybe generation II, not the original one . . which is smaller.