Extreme Weight Loss

[Kyobanim]

Here's the scenario...

I have a student that wants to join SF Guard unit here in Florida. He's 21, 5'6, 247 lbs. His goal is to be down to at least 180 by September, which is the date he wants to sign up. He was originally 258 lbs but he dropped 10 in one week with the following plan:

Daily
treadmill - 30 minutes (run/walk combo)
pushups - 50 (goal)
situps - 50 (goal)
pullups - 10 (goal)
regular streatching for a martial arts workout.

3Xs a week
60 minute martial arts workout, very cardio

Calorie intake - 1800 min 2000 max - Balanced mix of carbs, proteins, etc, with emphasis on vegitables. Lots and lots of water.

My question is, is this plan dangerous to his health? Is there something else I should be doing instead of the above plan?

I don't want to kill him but I do want to give him the best chance I can to succeed.

Thanks

[The Reaper]

Tha Army max tonnage for him without a Tape Test is going to be much lower than the goal you have set.

He is going to have a very hard row to hoe to get fit and into SF at that height and weight.

TR

[Eagle5US]

-He will need a food lifestyle change, not just a temporary dietary change.
-He should put aside the "I want to enlist by this date" and set small short term goals (6 week blocks) He doesn't make his Sept goal...he may shoot all his confidence away.
-Stay away from scales, he should do the body fat / body measurement thing at his 6 week checkpoint. (this will help him see progress where as daily (or even weekly) weigh ins show little and can be discouraging)
-Stay away from supplements, they are short term and short cuts. Few work, and even fewer work well.
-Anything is better than nothing. If he can sweat even a little activity each day, it will be better for him than plaing PS2
-Be a supportive person with his new found fitness aspiration. But understand that a healthy weight loss goal is going to be about 2-3 lbs a week. Initial weight loss is almost entirely fluid. Next the body will start to resturucture itself and how it uses the fuel being eaten vs. that being stored. He should get LEAN FIRST, then try to get strong. Getting lean first changes the chemistry of the body's metabolism to better and more efficiently use calories and carbs against his Basal Metabolic Rate.

Good luck to your buddy...he may now live longer...

Eagle

[Kyobanim]

Lifestyle change . . .That's been one of the hardest things to get through his head. Up until a couple of weeks ago his diet consisted of chicken and rice. His reasoning was "Hey Instructor, I'm Puerto Rican! It's what I eat." My response was 'It's how you're gonna die, too."

I think I've convinced him that he needs to rethink his dietary lifestyle. Time will tell.

TR - What is acceptable tonnage for a 21 year old at 5'6"? I advised him that he might not make it by the fall and he should be ready to go into overtime if that's the case. He wasn't happy but he did accept reality. --Nevermind, I saw the link on another thread, 170 lbs max.

My main concern was I was doing him harm by loosing that much weight in that short period of time. Getting lean sounds like a good idea, I need to research that.

Thanks

[The Reaper]

Originally posted by Kyobanim
Lifestyle change . . .That's been one of the hardest things to get through his head. Up until a couple of weeks ago his diet consisted of chicken and rice. His reasoning was "Hey Instructor, I'm Puerto Rican! It's what I eat." My response was 'It's how you're gonna die, too."

I think I've convinced him that he needs to rethink his dietary lifestyle. Time will tell.

TR - What is acceptable tonnage for a 21 year old at 5'6"? I advised him that he might not make it by the fall and he should be ready to go into overtime if that's the case. He wasn't happy but he did accept reality. --Nevermind, I saw the link on another thread, 170 lbs max.

My main concern was I was doing him harm by loosing that much weight in that short period of time. Getting lean sounds like a good idea, I need to research that.

Thanks

Army says that at 66", 21-27 years old, he can weight no more than 163 without taking a tape test for body fat computation.

I hope he has a tiny waist and a huge neck for a square guy, because I doubt that he would pass the tape at 180.

If you can get him into shape, great, I just don't see him being SF material with that little self-control.

I have been wrong before though.

TR

[Kyobanim]

Originally posted by The Reaper
Army says that at 66", 21-27 years old, he can weight no more than 163 without taking a tape test for body fat computation.

I hope he has a tiny waist and a huge neck for a square guy, because I doubt that he would pass the tape at 180.

If you can get him into shape, great, I just don't see him being SF material with that little self-control.

I have been wrong before though.

TR

I have to give him credit, I just spoke with him and he lost another 4 lbs and is sticking to the calorie plan. If he wants this bad enough he'll get the self control he needs.

Sir, I wouldn't let him try to enlist unless I thought he would be an asset. Balls in our court to make it happen.

[Sacamuelas]

Sir, are you saying he has lost 14 pounds in just under two weeks?

[Kyobanim]

As of today it's 2 weeks. First week was 10 second week was 4.

[Sacamuelas]

That leaves 17 weeks til September and 81 lbs(163) to make the standard weight limit per Reaper. That comes down to a 4.75lb/week average weight loss.

IMO, that is a little to ambitious a goal. He ought to give himself more time to lose the weight slower/healthier.

He is setting himself up for disappointment ... possible health trouble if he tries to maintain that kind of weight loss for a sustained period of time. :(

[The Reaper]

Originally posted by Sacamuelas
That leaves 17 weeks til September and 81 lbs(163) to make the standard weight limit per Reaper. That comes down to a 4.75lb/week average weight loss.

IMO, that is a little to ambitious a goal. He ought to give himself more time to lose the weight slower/healthier.

He is setting himself up for disappointment ... possible health trouble if he tries to maintain that kind of weight loss for a sustained period of time. :(

Actually, he has to lose the weight, AND get into shape by then.

I do not see this as realistic.

TR

[Para]

10 pounds the first week, I can see. Heavy intake of water will reduce the bodies dependancy on water retention. 4 pounds in week 2 calculates out about right. Basal metobolic rate (wieght in pounds / 2.2) in kg x 24 hours = seditantary calorie expendature or 2814 calories per day. Your recommended exercise programs calculates out to be about moderate activity adjusting his calorie expendature by about 1.5 or 4222 calories per day. Drop the 2000 for intake and you have a deficit of 2222 calories x 7 days or 15,554 calories. Divide this by 3,500 calories per pound of fat for 4.4 pounds.

Here is the problem. As his weight drops, so will his base line seditantary calorie expendature. At a weight of 180, weight loss would be less then 2 pounds per week. In order to maintain a 4 pound per week weight loss, he will need to intake less (not healthy) or increase the intensity of the exercise program.

[Roguish Lawyer]

http://www.subway.com/subwayroot/MenuNutrition/Jared/jaredStats.aspx

[Sacamuelas]

Originally posted by Roguish Lawyer
http://www.subway.com/subwayroot/MenuNutrition/Jared/jaredStats.aspx
RL, my comments about healthy weight loss relate to someone trying to train up for SF enlistment/candidacy in September while trying to lose weight in a rapid fashion by restricting their caloric intake. That is what Kyo's thread addresses.

I doubt Jarod finished his rapid weight loss period with the fitness/strength/endurance required to succeed in the SF pipeline. Kyo's thread is focused on that particular need as well.
That makes the process much more difficult to obtain, if at all..

[QuietShootr]

in my (self) experience, as a 5'8" fellow...I pass a tape test at 208. I'm just not a small guy...even when I am in great shape.

[Roguish Lawyer]

Originally posted by Sacamuelas
RL, my comments about healthy weight loss relate to someone trying to train up for SF enlistment/candidacy in September while trying to lose weight in a rapid fashion by restricting their caloric intake. That is what Kyo's thread addresses.

I doubt Jarod finished his rapid weight loss period with the fitness/strength/endurance required to succeed in the SF pipeline. Kyo's thread is focused on that particular need as well.
That makes the process much more difficult to obtain, if at all..

I'm kidding. TR's comments sound right on to me, although I'm obviously no expert.

[DoctorDoom]

x

[Kyobanim]

Yes, as the weight comes off I'll increase his cardio. When he gets to 50 pushup/situp I want to start throwing the timer on him. He understands that those are minimums and he'll have to up the count if he wants to score good. After he drops another 20lbs I want him to start running.

We talked last night and he agreed that 4 months is pushing it. We'll keep the 4 month goal but reevaluate his status when the time comes.

[DoctorDoom]

x

[Jack Moroney (RIP)]

Originally posted by The Reaper
Tha Army max tonnage for him without a Tape Test is going to be much lower than the goal you have set.

He is going to have a very hard row to hoe to get fit and into SF at that height and weight.

TR

I have been thru this my entire career and was one of the things I really disliked about the military, not because of the health aspect but because of the mindset that in order to be a good soldier you had to look like a good soldier. Now I will admit, with the characteristics of my structure, on a good day I looked like a camoflaged duffle bag in my BDUs and when I had to wear blues or class A's I should have been required to wear the "This side toward enemy" warning stamped on my forhead because if anyone had slapped me on the back those brass buttons would have flown off my jacked. When they started putting height and weight on the efficiency reports it always got dicey for me because what folks pictured in their mind on the various boards we all went thru for career progression was not who I was. It got to the point where my commanders would have to include comments and remarks that stated the amount of weight I could lift, etc. I even had one flag officer make it his project to get me to meet his view of what he thought I should look like. I am 5'7 and a half, and have always been between 207 - 215 pounds while in the service. I never really considered myself short-just wound up tight. I cannot remember the number and variations of the APFT I have been thru nor the multitude of regulations as to height and weight but each event was a semi-annual ritual for the Army. I remember the pinch tests, the variations to the tape tests, etc and each time I came well under the requirement and always maxed the APFT. So I can empathize with the individual who does not fit comfortably into some height/weight chart that may or may have anything to do with his ability to do whatever it is he wants to do. But, as I can attest to, the military is very serious about height/weight and the interaction of these aspects as it affects your health and ability to perform. So, I would recommend that if this individual needs to lose weight and can lose weight he does so but I would establish the goals not only to meet the height and weight but also the incorporate the tape tests. You really do not want to put him into the same boat that some of us where in when the wrestling coach had us "wrestle down" a weight class where we also lost strength and endurance.

Jack Moroney

[QuietShootr]

Sir, I feel a lot better - you and I share a common build. :D

[Kyobanim]

He's dropped 2 inches on the waist line as of today. Next weigh in is on wednesday.

[ajax]

I did not know exactly where to post this question. I have looked around for a few hours and have not found a place where it really fits. Four months ago I weighed 270 lbs and I could not run a mile. I was not undisciplined, I played offensive tackle and I needed to carry that weight. I decided I wanted to join SF as an 18X and now I am down to 225 lbs and I was 15% body fat at MEPS. I scored a 280 on the PT test today and can run 6 miles in roughly 54 minutes. I have not platued in any part of my PT routine yet and I am not having any problems at my current weight, but I met a couple SF guys who told me to trim down to 200 lbs as a max. I do not leave until Oct 19 and if my training keeps progressing the way it has I should be between 315-325 on the extended PT scale and I should be able to run 6 miles in under 48 minutes. My question is should I lose more weight or would it be beneficial to carry a little extra into selection as long as it is not giving me problems and I can keep up physically?

[Fiercely Loyal]

He's dropped 2 inches on the waist line as of today. Next weigh in is on wednesday.

Sir, how did this turn out for this person. In 2001 I dropped over 100 pounds in five and a half months to join the military. I went from a size 46 to a size 33 waist. I hope this turned out for this person. Even if it hasn't and you are still in contact with him? I would encourage him to look at being fit again. To be honest I lost sight of my goals and got fat again while in the military. Not a size 46 waist. However, I have lost 50 pounds in 6 months. The program I was using was pt everyday with 20-30 minutes of cardio, 3 sets sit-ups, 3 sets pushups, and a 1200 cal diet. Not as extreme but there are people in my battalion who hadn’t seen me in months that would walk right by me without a hello because of the weight loss.

[ccrn]

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