View Full Version : Chew substitute
Roguish Lawyer
08-22-2007, 15:14
http://mintsnuff.com/mintsnuffstory.htm
Interesting concept. I wonder if it works . . .
bandycpa
08-22-2007, 15:55
I've never tried mint snuff, but it would have to be tough to switch from something nicotine-based to something that has no nicotine at all.
I chewed/dipped for 15 years (starting in Little League Football back before it was illegal to buy the stuff when you were under 18). Dad chewed Red Man, and so did I. Later on, a cousin introduced me to Skoal, which was what I used until I quit.
Sep 28 at 8:00am this year will be 15 years since I quit for good. As the saying goes, I had quit many times before that. It's just that I would start again either later that day (never more than 5 days later). I can't speak for anyone else; but, to me, it was addictive, and quitting for good was one of the toughest things I've done. Even now, I'll still get cravings for it from time-to-time (purely a mental thing). Saying that, I know that some people claim they are not addicted to snuff. That's why I say I can only speak for me. But, to me, if I used the mint snuff, it would only remind me of the "real thing", and would eventually lead to me buying the real thing and end up back where I started (even after 15 years). I imagine it would work the same way going from using the real thing to trying the "fake stuff" (alternative) when I was trying to quit. The real thing is always better.
It would be similar, in my line of thinking, to trying to get an alcoholic to quit drinking by offering them an O'Douls.
For me, the key to quitting was not the amount of time that I had not used Skoal, it was going through the situations I was in that I normally would dip. For example, the first time I had a meal and did not get a dip afterwards was very tough. Each time after that became easier. The first time I worked outside and didn't get a dip was tough. The next time was easier.
Sorry if this is a thread hijack, RL. Just what came to mind when I checked out the link.
Bandy
Roguish Lawyer
08-22-2007, 16:03
Sorry if this is a thread hijack, RL. Just what came to mind when I checked out the link.
Not at all. I've been there too. I know all about quitting and starting again.
I'd like to get my son to quit dippin'. I was a 2+ pack a day smoker until I decided to quit after getting married. If you want to know how to quit smoking, try doing what I did: smoke a pack of Marlboro's in 30 minutes!
My New Year's resolution for 1977 was to quit smoking, so at 23:30 hrs, I opened my last pack of Marlboro's and put out the last cigarette at midnight. Got so sick of nicotine, I couldn't stand being around other smokers. Haven't lit up another one in 30+ years!
Nicotine is pretty insidious and I'm somewhat skeptical about mint snuff being a good tool to get you off the stuff. Like most who successfully quit smoking and chewing, I had to do it several times. Some things help, such as having a non-smoking wife, but in the end, it is a solo event. Either you quit smoking or you don't. Very Yoda like. You make a decision to succeed and then go from there with failure not being an option. Cold turkey is the way to go.
I tried it, not to stop dippin just to try it when I was dippin. What I did to stop dippin was I started to chew sunflower seeds the BBQ ones are the best, but like bandycpa said every now and then I get a craving for a dip, but no big problem I just drink another jack and coke and it goes right away.
Black Knight
08-23-2007, 16:18
I tried all the fake crap, and that is what I thought they tasted like.
If anyone is really wanting to quit, there is a fairly new medication out on the market. It is called Chantix and it is different from other "quit smoking/ chewing" meds, in that it is not an anti-depressant. It works on the nicotine receptors in your brain, and blocks/ fools them.
I chewed Copenhagen for over 10 years, and this stuff knocked it out the first try. I didn't even really care when I quit. If any of you have tried to quit before; you know on day three how you are ready to choke the living crap out of someone? Not so with this. You don't even really notice.
Hope this helps. It did for me
BK
Quit dippin cold turkey 36 hours ago. I've been a can a day guy for the past 13 years. I've quit dippin many times before but this time's for good. My mother in law is dying of lung/liver cancer right now and I have to be here for my wife and my 3 kids. If it was easy to quit I would have done it years ago.
Only 36 hours left before the physical addiction goes away.
Why quit? If the snuff don't get you, something else will. "We all got it comin'."
Fake snuff's kinda like getting one of those blow-up dolls to sleep with.
ZonieDiver
01-04-2013, 14:50
Why quit? If the snuff don't get you, something else will. "We all got it comin'."
Fake snuff's kinda like getting one of those blow-up dolls to sleep with.
Nope... not going there.:D
LOL. I like your attitude. I've used that thinking to talk myself out of quitting many times before. Cancer is a motherfucker, and I've already been hospitalized twice for heart related issues (atrial fibrillation)
I also have some serious mental issues I attribute to my use of chew. If I can kick the habit for a few days and my anxiety goes away I will be much happier.
I've found that drinking or eating something sugary helps with the cravings. Blood sugars drop when you quit using nicotine.
I've found that drinking or eating something sugary helps with the cravings.
So does a big three-fingered dip. Drinking or eating something sugary will kill you, too.
Look, every time I drive down one of these hardball two-lanes out here, some idiot could easily swerve over, and kill himself up against the grill of my Ford Truck. Lightning could hit you. You could get I don't know how many diseases at any time from any place. You could get shot, stabbed, poisoned, blah.
The odds ain't worth trading a good Cope buzz for a mint sneeze.
ZonieDiver
01-04-2013, 15:11
I've found that drinking or eating something sugary helps with the cravings.
Kind of like watching people at AA mainline coffee and cigarettes!
So does a big three-fingered dip. Drinking or eating something sugary will kill you, too.
Look, every time I drive down one of these hardball two-lanes out here, some idiot could easily swerve over, and kill himself up against the grill of my Ford Truck. Lightning could hit you. You could get I don't know how many diseases at any time from any place. You could get shot, stabbed, poisoned, blah.
The odds ain't worth trading a good Cope buzz for a mint sneeze.
Dusty,
You renew my faith in humanity.
Love ya man. :D :D
I too am on the "Quiting smoking" band wagon. ..... AGAIN. This will be my 5th time since I started smoking back in 1991. So far I'm at day 11, and the cravings are still there.
Everything Dusty said is correct, you can go at any moment, so why not enjoy yourself, but it is nice not smelling like a smoke stack and it also helps out on the wallet .... $5.50 a pack here in Denver, so it's nice putting that money I'm saving from buying smokes into more ammo.
Quitting dipping was fairly easy for me. All it took was a nice slap in the face from my mother. She worked as a Dental Hygienist for many years and told me MANY stories of horrific gums and mouths she saw of dippers. One time I went in for an appointment and handed me a small mirror after she got done checking my gums and inside lips.
She pulled my bottom lip back, where I used to pack my snuff, and said, "See those white spots? That's the start of lip cancer right there." I quit right then and there. So seeing that I couldn't see my lungs, I started smoking.
It's a bitch quitting. I wish ya the best.
How often do you chew?
I dip all day. If I could use a pinch here and there without dippin all the time I'd do it and I'd be fine with it. My problem has always been self control. There is no "I'm only gonna dip when I think I gotta take a shit" or "After I get done fuckin" (which would never allow me to dip by the way) with me.
I admire those who can control it and I think almost anything in moderation is okay but I know that I am not the kind of person who can use a substance in moderation. I've tried it before and it doesn't work.
'I used to do a little but the little didn't do it so the little got more and more' -GNR
Edit: To be fair ZonieDiver, the sugary drink or food is only necessary to curb the 'physical' symptoms someone who quits has the first 72 hours after quitting. I don't have any intentions of using sugar as a nicotine replacement after hour 72.
I wish you the best too Sdiver, or anyone else who decides to quit or not to quit. If I could share Dusty's attitude without feeling bad about shortening my life at the expense of my kids I would probably live a long ass time and I would dip for the rest of my life.
I quite smoking 166 days ago!
It aint easy but its doable!
theis223
01-04-2013, 15:46
Lan, what kind of mental issues did you attribute to chewing? If this is too probing or personal to ask i understand and ill delete this post or if you prefer i can PM you if that is more appropriate.
Copenhagen wintergreen has been my poison of choice for 5 years now and its time to be done. I have found on occasion that i become slightly irritable if i dont have a dip in while i work. Is this along the lines of what you mentioned as mental issues? Im a college kid/ forklift jockey up in northern MN and having a dip in whilst i study or am working helps pass the time. I have tried the smokey mountain alternative stuff but, like bandycpa said, the real thing is better.
My resolution this year is to kick the habit and when you resurrected this thread today, i got a feeling of serendipity. Thanks for that ;)
I have gone cold turkey for 4 days now, you were spot on with the 36 hour time table for the physical addiction to disipate.
Good luck with your quitting endeavors too. :lifter
I quite smoking 166 days ago!
It aint easy but its doable!
Smoking's in a different class, with the monoxide and tar. I quit smoking because it affected my running.
Quitting dipping was fairly easy for me. All it took was a nice slap in the face from my mother. She worked as a Dental Hygienist for many years and told me MANY stories of horrific gums and mouths she saw of dippers. One time I went in for an appointment and handed me a small mirror after she got done checking my gums and inside lips.
She pulled my bottom lip back, where I used to pack my snuff, and said, "See those white spots? That's the start of lip cancer right there." I quit right then and there. So seeing that I couldn't see my lungs, I started smoking.
It's a bitch quitting. I wish ya the best.
I've heard that since I started dipping, and that was when Cope was 17 cents a can.
Everthing is "pre-cancerous". If those white spots were cancer, why don't you still have it? Did it go away when you quit? Nah.
I don't put smoking and dipping in the same boat.
I have had severe anxiety, panic attacks and depression since about 2005. I attribute them more to my personal life choices than anything else. I've done everything I could to fight this disease from working out, to becoming a full blown drug addict. The happiest time in my adult life was when I was smoking 1/8 of weed a day, drinking redbull all day, chewing a can of grizzly wintergreen a day, and taking 150mg of Zoloft a day. I did that for a year after the doctor stopped prescribing Ativan to me for the panic attacks because it's addictive (though it's effective).
I had the ultimate 'DON'T GIVE A FUCK' attitude and it worked for me. Life was all about me and no one else and I didn't mind until my wife threatened to divorce me and take our daughter away. I was a big piece of shit. We also had twins on the way. 3 kids in less than 2 years if you can believe it.
The hardest thing I ever had to do was quit the Zoloft believe it or not. One day, after seeing a psychiatrist I decided to quit everything. I stopped smoking weed cold turkey, no more redbull, no more Zoloft and I went through serious withdrawals for about a month. The only thing I couldn't stop doing was the chew. It's been a staple of mine since I was 16-18 (I'm 31 now). So here I am, still suffering with anxiety, one thing left to kick before I can rule out any physical ailment attributing to my anxiety and trying to do it.
Life's a bitch, and easy things are rarely worth doing. Sorry if I went too OT, but that's me in a nutshell. Good luck to you too theis223 and SF18C.
I have had severe anxiety, panic attacks and depression since about 2005. I attribute them more to my personal life choices than anything else. I've done everything I could to fight this disease from working out, to becoming a full blown drug addict. The happiest time in my adult life was when I was smoking 1/8 of weed a day, drinking redbull all day, chewing a can of grizzly wintergreen a day, and taking 150mg of Zoloft a day. I did that for a year after the doctor stopped prescribing Ativan to me for the panic attacks because it's addictive (though it's effective).
I had the ultimate 'DON'T GIVE A FUCK' attitude and it worked for me. Life was all about me and no one else and I didn't mind until my wife threatened to divorce me and take our daughter away. I was a big piece of shit. We also had twins on the way. 3 kids in less than 2 years if you can believe it.
The hardest thing I ever had to do was quit the Zoloft believe it or not. One day, after seeing a psychiatrist I decided to quit everything. I stopped smoking weed cold turkey, no more redbull, no more Zoloft and I went through serious withdrawals for about a month. The only thing I couldn't stop doing was the chew. It's been a staple of mine since I was 16-18 (I'm 31 now). So here I am, still suffering with anxiety, one thing left to kick before I can rule out any physical ailment attributing to my anxiety and trying to do it.
Life's a bitch, and easy things are rarely worth doing. Sorry if I went too OT, but that's me in a nutshell. Good luck to you too theis223 and SF18C.
No Bushmaster for you!. :D
Roguish Lawyer
01-04-2013, 16:38
I don't miss dipping one bit.
I don't miss dipping one bit.
lol You sure it's not:
I don't miss dipping one bit.
I don't miss dipping one bit.
I don't miss dipping one bit.
I don't miss(ad infinitum) ... ? :D
Roguish Lawyer
01-04-2013, 16:44
lol You sure it's not:
I don't miss dipping one bit.
I don't miss dipping one bit.
I don't miss dipping one bit.
I don't miss(ad infinitum) ... ? :D
I really don't. It was hard to quit, and I'll chew a piece of nicotine gum once in a while, but I truly have no desire to start again.
If anyone wants to quit, I'll introduce you to the oral surgeon who did my mouth biopsies.
The Reaper
01-04-2013, 19:31
Smoking's in a different class, with the monoxide and tar. I quit smoking because it affected my running.
Well, Hell, man, quit running and start smoking again!
I have buddies who rotted out their lower gums in front, so they started packing their upper lip instead.
I figure, just fill an empty can with worm dirt, and put a little of that in your mouth every time you want to take a dip. That should either break the habit, or make a real man out of you.
My Dad used to put his used chewing tobacco back in the pouch. I asked him if he planned to use it again, he said nope, but it sure cuts back on people hitting you up for a chew.
Hey, Dustmeister, if you can't actually see the cancer, is it really there?
TR
TXGringo
01-04-2013, 21:33
Well, Hell, man, quit running and start smoking again!
I have buddies who rotted out their lower gums in front, so they started packing their upper lip instead.
I figure, just fill an empty can with worm dirt, and put a little of that in your mouth every time you want to take a dip. That should either break the habit, or make a real man out of you.
My Dad used to put his used chewing tobacco back in the pouch. I asked him if he planned to use it again, he said nope, but it sure cuts back on people hitting you up for a chew.
Hey, Dustmeister, if you can't actually see the cancer, is it really there?
TR
I got the white patch on the inside of my lip once. Stopped for a few days and it went away. I don't buy the "precancerous" stuff either.
For the record, I decided to stop 4 months ago while I train. I did notice a pretty quick improvement in my stamina, but nothing drastic. Regardless, looking forward to my next pinch down the road. :D
theis223
01-05-2013, 01:38
Thanks Lan for the response. The lifestyle you described parallels that of most of my peers in college today. Sounds like you were burning the candle at both ends for a time.
Reaper, what you described oddly enough, is what my grandpa used on all of his kids. (Dirt in the lip) Unfortunatly he passed before he could do the same to me. However i do have to commend my dad and uncles (grandpas's kids) for getting all of the younger generations to never smoke. They did that by taking all of us kids when we were about 3-4 years old and lit a cigarett for us and told us to take the biggest puff we could.... after many tears and a few trips to the toilet to puke, not one of Grandpa Bob's grand kids are smokers today.
Just for laughs, what are some other novel ways that could be used to teach youngins about avoiding nicotine?
:munchin
Hey, Dustmeister, if you can't actually see the cancer, is it really there?
TR
I have no idea. I may have had 9 types of cancer in 6 decades that came and went. I got chunks cut and/or frozen out of my mug a couple times, but it was evidently not too serious.
I quit one time for over a year, and couldn't focus. I have no idea how anybody could read a map without a dip in his jaw. (Back when I was on a Team, they still used maps to navigate.)
My Dad died of colon cancer about a year after the Doc told him to quit smoking his pipe because he didn't like the way his palate looked. My Dad's sister just died, and she had colon cancer, but the COPD got her first. Apparently the Doc didn't notice the cancer. My cousin Cynthia and her husband Johnny just had a mess of cancer cut out of their bodies. My brother died of carcinogenic melanoma when he was 54.
Cancer's everywhere; you may have it, right now, TR. I don't see any reason to sweat it.
Just for laughs, what are some other novel ways that could be used to teach youngins about avoiding nicotine?
:munchin
I know one that didn't work for me. My Dad gave me a plug of Bull Durham when I was eight, and I swallowed the juice. May have been the sickest I've ever been.
To anybody who's quitting; why did you start in the first place? Were you aware of the dangers going in, and if you were, what made you go ahead and get yourself addicted?
If quitting helps you train better, then I don't blame you. Smoking, to me, is pretty stupid if you rely on your wind and want to stay off an oxygen tank when you're 70.
I don't want to discourage anybody who has determined to quit from doing so; IMO it's just another thing to fret about, like cholesterol, saturated fats, processed foods, white sugar, starving Ethiopians, walking under a ladder, black cats, et al.
I grew up surrounded by mean horses, water mocassins, rattlers, mesquite thorns, poison ivy, scorpions, yellowjackets, copperheads, red ants, asps-just about everthing in Mesquite, Texas at that time could stick, bite, kick or poison you. What's a little dip? :D
If dipping scares you, by all means, quit. That's not a taunt, either.
I've heard that since I started dipping, and that was when Cope was 17 cents a can.
Everything is "pre-cancerous". If those white spots were cancer, why don't you still have it? Did it go away when you quit? Nah.
I don't put smoking and dipping in the same boat.
$0.17 a can !!!! :eek: .... Dayum, Dozer is right, you ARE old. I seem to remember the 1st can I bought back in '83 (regular Skoal) was about $0.65, or about there. It wasn't until I got on AD that I was paying $1.10 a can, or $11.00 a log/roll.
I agree that everything is "pre-cancerous" now-a-days. In fact, I have a theory that everyone already has cancer cells in their bodies. It just takes something to activate them to grow.
Yes, those white spots that my mother showed me on my lip did disappear after I stopped dipping. Whether it was "pre-cancerous" or not, I don't know, but it did "freak me" enough to stop. But I do come from a family that does have some sort of addiction.
My dad's side of the family are the smokers. My grandmother (dad's mom) smoked for years and years. She stopped smoking when she turned 88 y/o and only passed away 4 years ago at the age of 95 from "natural causes". She was as sharp as a tack and didn't have any ailments. She did require a walker towards the end (due to a busted hip from a fall she took after slipping on some ice) but aside from that, no other ailments.
I also agree that smoking and dipping are two different "animals". Both are addictive in their own right(s) and I don't look down on anyone who smokes or dips. It's your choice to do so. I know, because I've done both, hell I was even doing Plug and chewing tobacco (Redman and Levi Garrett), so I do know it does help in map reading, or driving, or model making or studying. I some ways I do miss it. You do grow to love it just a little bit.
CA_TacMedic
01-05-2013, 05:24
I am 39 now, started chewing Copenhagen in 8th grade..was convinced I could spit or puke a couple of pounds off on a windy bus trip wherever we were going. Stopped one time for a bout a year when I was in the Navy, had the flu and could not take a dip without getting even more sick. Started up a year later while duck hunting with a buddy. My doctor convinced me to try that Chantix crap last year....just as advertised I quit on day 3 and had every side effect advertised and thought I was going crazy....flushed the crap down the toilet, took a big fat chew and went back to normal almost instantly...Well as normal as I always was :rolleyes:.
My old man smoked 2 packs a day for over 40 years and got pissed when California upped the price, so he quit cold turkey. He looks younger than he did when he was 50...he is 62 and been quit for nearly ten years now.
I agree that the hardest part is I associate chewing with so many things: after a good meal, reloading, ting flies, shooting, and how anyone can fish or hunt without a chew in defies me....I know I should quit, mainly because it is a bad example to my kids. But, I have 3 girls and if they take up chewing I would probably just buy em' a new gun and go quail hunting....:p
Wallace
1stindoor
01-07-2013, 07:51
1 Dec 2007 marked my last day after 25 years of Copenhagen. I too was a can a day dipper. I quit because I got into a big argument with my wife (who swore I "promised" to quit after we got married...obviously I didn't as this argument took place 5 years later...although technically I did quit "after."...but I digress).
My point in all this is that more than 5 years later...there hasn't been one single day that's gone by that I haven't wanted another dip. I suspect I'll spend the rest of my life wanting one. I quit cold turkey and threw my half roll of unopened cans in the trash. My quitting had nothing to do with health concerns. I was just showing the wife that I was meaner than she was.
I would go back except the cost deeply cuts into the gas funds for my boat. When I started a can went for around .65 cents...when I quit it was around $3.65. I have no idea what it cost now.
1 Dec 2007 marked my last day after 25 years of Copenhagen. I too was a can a day dipper. I quit because I got into a big argument with my wife (who swore I "promised" to quit after we got married...obviously I didn't as this argument took place 5 years later...although technically I did quit "after."...but I digress).
My point in all this is that more than 5 years later...there hasn't been one single day that's gone by that I haven't wanted another dip. I suspect I'll spend the rest of my life wanting one. I quit cold turkey and threw my half roll of unopened cans in the trash. My quitting had nothing to do with health concerns. I was just showing the wife that I was meaner than she was.
I would go back except the cost deeply cuts into the gas funds for my boat. When I started a can went for around .65 cents...when I quit it was around $3.65. I have no idea what it cost now.
Now, see, to me, money is a good reason to quit. At 4 bucks a can, you've got nearly 1500 a year toward your boat.
1stindoor
01-07-2013, 12:24
Now, see, to me, money is a good reason to quit. At 4 bucks a can, you've got nearly 1500 a year toward your boat.
Honestly, it's probably the only thing that's kept me from going back. I have Merc. 225 on the back of my boat and she drinks premium grade.:eek:
No Bushmaster for you!. :D
Ha. I went through some dark times. I never had thoughts of doing harm to innocent people. I am over it now. Life can be a motherfucker sometimes- which is how I feel right now, on day 5 of the quit.
Ha. I went through some dark times. I never had thoughts of doing harm to innocent people. I am over it now. Life can be a motherfucker sometimes- which is how I feel right now, on day 5 of the quit.
Good Job. Keep it up. It can be a bitch, I know. Just hit 2 weeks (Day 14) myself.
One way to get rid of some of that "tension" (without having to worry about going to jail) is do some exercises. I like to go into my back yard and dig some holes. ... really gets the neighbors guessing. ;) ... and if I really want to bake their noodles, I'll dig those holes late at night. :D
Good Job. Keep it up. It can be a bitch, I know. Just hit 2 weeks (Day 14) myself.
One way to get rid of some of that "tension" (without having to worry about going to jail) is do some exercises. I like to go into my back yard and dig some holes. ... really gets the neighbors guessing. ;) ... and if I really want to bake their noodles, I'll dig those holes late at night. :D
Now, there's one for your memoirs.
Ha. I went through some dark times. I never had thoughts of doing harm to innocent people. I am over it now. Life can be a motherfucker sometimes- which is how I feel right now, on day 5 of the quit.
If you can say, "I'm over it now." on day 5, you've got it licked.
Good Job. Keep it up. It can be a bitch, I know. Just hit 2 weeks (Day 14) myself.
One way to get rid of some of that "tension" (without having to worry about going to jail) is do some exercises. I like to go into my back yard and dig some holes. ... really gets the neighbors guessing. ;) ... and if I really want to bake their noodles, I'll dig those holes late at night. :D
LMAO. I have some property to dig holes on and I've been wanting to bury an old treasure chest for my kids so they can try and find it when they get older. I cut a bunch of oak yesterday with a buddy and I'm going metal detecting this afternoon. Staying busy helps. The fact that my mother in law will be dead in a few days due to her smoking has been motivating too.
Taking control of my fate by quitting has eased the anxiety I've had since I decided to quit. Being a part of a community like this helps too.
Good job on going 14 days. I'm not going to say 'good-luck' because that's not what it takes so I'll say what you said- "Keep it up."
My mother in law passed away 1/15/2013 from a combination of lung and liver cancer due to a lifetime of smoking so I thought that would be motivating enough to stay away from chew but I am having a hell of a time. I haven't caved but the past couple days have been really tough.
I have learned that doing things I used to do with a dip; without one, is part of the process to recovery. I keep telling myself that I'm just going to start dipping again because I can't be as happy in life without it. I feel bad for my wife and kids, they deserve better.
I'm becoming very aware of the struggle my Dad has gone through raising us. He'd quit smoking at the beginning of almost every year, just to start again 6 months later after being so intolerable my Mom would tell him to start smoking or kick rocks. It's funny how much we learn as we grow older. I used to hate my Dad sometimes and now that I can relate with his struggle I sympathize with him.
Hope you're still fighting the good fight sdiver and others.
Lan,
My condolences on your loss. I smoked cigarettes from HS through my early married life, quit cold turkey a little under 6 years ago shortly after my first child was born. Aside from the occasional(ok, sometime not so occasional :rolleyes: ) cigar, I've been "clean" ever since. Good luck, it is hard, I know, ya just gotta keep at it.
All in moderation, right? Now where did I put that scotch!? :D
I don't chew, dipp or smoke. I've tried all three and didn't enjoy the experience.
Thank you BOfH. I wish you the best as well!