View Full Version : Barry Bonds Hits 754
Radar Rider
07-28-2007, 19:10
Tonight, the home run watch gets one closer. The next one Bonds hits will of course tie, and the next will be the record setter.
Go, Barry!
The Reaper
07-28-2007, 19:36
Tonight, the home run watch gets one closer. The next one Bonds hits will of course tie, and the next will be the record setter.
Go, Barry!
Not in my book.:rolleyes:
Cheater.
TR
Not in my book.:rolleyes:
Cheater.
TR
Same here.
When the commissioner of Baseball was hemming and hawing about being in attendance and Hank Arron, WON'T even be there, that says something.
Sure, when Bonds hits 755 and then 756 he will make history, but a very Tarnished history. There won't be the pageantry and "specialness" of the event, say if Ken Griffy Jr. were to do it, and IMO one day he will.
When Bonds hits 756, there should be an astrix "*" next to the number, just like they did with Roger Maris "61*".
82ndtrooper
07-28-2007, 21:12
Not in my book.:rolleyes:
Cheater.
TR
Barry Bonds has shrouded himself in doubt and the fans, at least in part of the baseball AO, have no respect for him.
Roger Maris and "The BABE" are my favorites. I personaly witnessed Hank Aarons tie HR with Babe Ruth here in Cincinnati at the age of 10 years old. It was Aarons first at bat with Cincinnati's pitcher, Jack Billingham. My mother and another friend of mine attended that game. It was opening day in Cincinnati for the Reds. I was interviewed by the Cincinnati Post at the age of 10 because the HR hit was caught just one row behind me. I had my glove and was ready to retrieve it, but no luck for a 10 year old. I still have the news paper clipping from that event.
Micky Mantle sat in the hospital as Roger Maris broke the record. They were great friends, and Micky Mantle played with more pain than probably any player would be willing to play with in this day and age. He was a TEAM PLAYER.
Barry Bonds will not be significant in the history books.
Roguish Lawyer
07-28-2007, 21:15
I am inclined to delete this thread because I can't stand that cheating prick and I don't believe he deserves any publicity. But whatever.
Fact: Most everyone in baseball thinks Barry Bonds is a douchebag, to include his teammates. If he was here, his rucksack would quickly be thrown in the hall.
Why are they pitching to him? The only direction I'd throw towards Barry as he stood in the box is towards that HGH enhanced nugget of his. If I was an opposing manager, he'd have 0 official at-bats against my team.
Hank Aaron was and is a class act and a credit to the game. Barry Bonds is not.
Goggles Pizano
07-29-2007, 05:11
I am inclined to delete this thread because I can't stand that cheating prick and I don't believe he deserves any publicity. But whatever.
Right there beside you RL. He is POS and the commissioner does not have stone one to call him out on it. Baseball suffers and that is a shame.
NousDefionsDoc
07-29-2007, 07:07
LOL - you guys crack me up.
Team Sergeant
07-29-2007, 09:12
I am inclined to delete this thread because I can't stand that cheating prick and I don't believe he deserves any publicity. But whatever.
I would not say this is the sort of publicity he would enjoy.
Funny the double standard in sports. IMO any use of drugs should bring on a lifetime ban.
barry bonds will be breaking no records, ever.
TS
x-factor
07-29-2007, 09:20
There's no need to get worked up about Bonds because he won't hold the record for long. Either Griffey (longshot) or A-Rod (almost sure thing) or both will break Bonds' record without the steroid taint.
Bonds was a great ball player who didn't need to cheat to be remembered as one of the best of his generation and of all-time. It was pure hubris that got him into steroids. Its fitting payback for his childish nature and ego that he's going to find that he squadered his place in history.
Yeah, most guys put on 35 pounds of raw muscle in their late 30's and early 40's. Happens to all of us....:rolleyes: Check out the before and after pics...
He's a cheater in my book. Gets no pat on the back from me.
brandonm
07-29-2007, 19:44
I find Ken Griffey Jr. approaching 600 home runs much more exciting than whatever Barry Bonds does. Of course Griffey is one of my favorite players of all time... :D
I won't be watching. I can't stand Bonds, but I've come to despise MLB and that gutless hypocrite of a Commissioner just as much. Baseball made its bed when it turned a blind eye as Bonds, McGwire and Sosa chased the single-season HR record and pulled the game back from the abyss.
Thank goodness training camps have opened. Or is that "spring training"?
Hostile0311
07-30-2007, 02:41
Bonds is a disgrace to the game of baseball. His less than stellar attitude and getting ahead by impure means is a blemish on one of the greatest games ever played. He sets a bad example for the youth of today. Aaron, Maris, Ruth and even the Mick (although he was known for being a hellraiser off the field) were all honorable men and played for the the love of the game and not necessarily the $. Now professional sports IMHO (all of them) are just a revenue racket and these babies who put on the uniform today and make millions playing a kids game will never get any respect from me. But thats just my .02. As long as people pay for overpriced tickets, flat beer & soggy hot dogs to see these clowns play, professinal sports will continue to feed the egos & the wallets of those like Bonds.
82ndtrooper
07-30-2007, 05:04
I find Ken Griffey Jr. approaching 600 home runs much more exciting than whatever Barry Bonds does. Of course Griffey is one of my favorite players of all time... :D
Ken Griffey Jr is not exactly one of our favorites here in Cincinnati. Each year he seems to find an injury. Just prior to opening day, this season, it was still up in the air as to his playing status due to yet another injury with his wrist. :rolleyes: This has been a recuring theme with Ken almost every season.
While I agree he is great ball player, he's not performed nearly as well since he left the Mariners and came to his so called "Home Town"
He's already hinted that he'd like to finish his career back with Seattle. That's not something the fans here enjoy hearing.
It's been my observation that Ken Griffey Jr is a bit gun shy when it comes to making the type of outstanding plays in the outfield that we saw when he was with the Mariners. I believe he's gotten lazy and fears more injury's. I suppose anyone could argue that injury's are common for players willing to leap tall buildings in a single bound, but he's not leaped those buildings nearly as much as we'd like to see here in the Cincinnati area. Never the less, I hope he does break the HR record within the next five or six seasons, whether with us or the Mariners. He's also given us the impression that his career may not even last that long. I'd trade Ken Griffey any day of the week for "A Rod" but not Bonds.
On a postive note for MLB Cal Ripkin Jr was inducted to the hall of fame in Coopers town just this weekend. Great player, stand up guy and a class act.
Hostile0311
07-30-2007, 05:33
Off the 'Bonds' topic a bit but I have to agree with 82ntrooper that Cal Ripken Jr. was a helluva ball player who set a prime example of what a great player is made of. If I had to choose a player my son could emmulate it would be Ripken. He was a great all around player and his accomplishments speak for themselves. He never bragged or boasted but instead let his actions do the talking on the field. Even off the field he gives amply to the youth and various other organizations. I think his record will stand the test of time because there is simply no one out there this day in age of that type caliber IMHO. Maybe we will be fortunate enough one day to see a great player like that break a meaningful record instead of someone like Bonds taking the 'cheaters' way out.
The Reaper
07-30-2007, 07:34
Ripken was The Man, and is my favorite modern era player, though Pete Rose looked pretty dedicated too, till we found out about the gambling. Ripken reminds me of the player whose record he broke.
I love the fact that Ruth did what he did as a pitcher and as a hitter, despite horrible training practices, terrible conditioning, and a serious party lifestyle. He was an extraordinarily talented man who did things large and his way, but loved kids, didn't mind the media and the attention, and gave back to the community. I do not think he has a modern era counterpart, and would probably be the antithesis of Bonds.
As noted, MLB failed when the players started using juice, the league did little to stop it, and the players union opposed testing. Now there is taking care of your members.:rolleyes:
TR
Bonds is a disgrace to the game of baseball. His less than stellar attitude and getting ahead by impure means is a blemish on one of the greatest games ever played. He sets a bad example for the youth of today. Aaron, Maris, Ruth and even the Mick were all honorable men and played for the the love of the game and not necessarily the $.
Gents, if I may...
I stayed at a hospital recently with a family member, that overlooked a city park ball-field. Every night during that week I would watch out the room window at the baseball field...and every night it was packed. Not with Pro players, or even adults...but with little kids.
It reminded me of being young and growing up sitting on the metal bleachers, eating cracker-jack, and waiting for my brother's team to get a hit, or take the field. Win or lose, it was just great to see him and his teammates grin from ear-to-ear when something great happened...like a trip to first! ;)
It reminded me that no matter how distorted the "hero's" rap sheets, little boys will don the glove and bat, and face down the other team...if for no other reason than to be part of the Game.
Bascially, I think all those Pro's should remember what the Game was originally about...not money or fame, but of being part of a Team.
Just my small little .02.
Holly
brandonm
07-30-2007, 11:50
The early - mid 90's were a great time for baseball. Young Griffey Jr., Kirby Puckett, Wade Boggs, Cal Ripken Jr., Greg Maddux, Tom Glavine, Roger Clemens, so many... most recent golden era of baseball anyone?
Yeah, most guys put on 35 pounds of raw muscle in their late 30's and early 40's. Happens to all of us....:rolleyes: Check out the before and after pics...
He's a cheater in my book. Gets no pat on the back from me.
I did!!:D At least the 35 pounds.
Sorry to always be the guy on the other side of the fence but, IMO no amount of muscle, or other drugs improves the hand and eye coordination to put the wood on the ball. Perhaps he is also not so charismatic (hows that for avoiding a 5 letter p word?) but that still doesn't eleimnate the fact that he did it.
The way athletes are today, do they even bother naming an All-American Team anymore? IIRC Bob Hope used to take them on a tour. Athletes are not the role models the used to be. While teaching I used to use Pete Rose as a role model - not today!!
Spurier and the USC Gamecocks could have a great football team if he could keep them out of jail.
What a shame that Tommy Bowden of Clemson thought it worth saying that he had a good summer because none of his player made the news this year.:(
The Reaper
07-30-2007, 13:54
I did!!:D At least the 35 pounds.
Sorry to always be the guy on the other side of the fence but, IMO no amount of muscle, or other drugs improves the hand and eye coordination to put the wood on the ball.(
No, but the power of steroids is the difference between a .300 hitter with 60 HRs per season, and a .270 hitter with 10 HRs.
Any ball hit over the fence is safe from fielding or errors.
TR
I think the number is empirical. He either has X# HRs or not.
On the other side I have heard some very valid points for excluding him from the Hall of Fame. - based upon lack luster performance. He is really a lack luster ball player and his hitting during crucial events is actually sub-standard. He is no Mr. October:eek: .
brandonm
07-30-2007, 14:54
I disagree to the lack luster ball player comment.
Since 1990 Barry Bonds has only had one season with an OBP (On Base Percentage) of less than 400.
Before his 73 homer season he was consistent 35-45 homer threat.
Every season since 1990 he has had a slugging percentage of over .500 and many of those were .600 and .700 slugging percentage.
Sure Bonds had a 73 home run season, but if you look through most great players, they have one season that is by and far better than any other season they had in their career. After he hit the 73 home runs, his stats fell more in line with what he was normally producing in his career.
I don't know if he took steroids or not, but I think a lot of people automatically assume he did because of his lackluster PR performance and his 73 home run season without giving the guy a fair review.
Before he was hit with the steroid scandal, Bonds was well on his way to a hall of fame career and to be considered one of the greats of all time. Only player ever to have 500 stolen bases and 500 home runs - how's that for a stat? Guess what, he reached that before any accusations of steroids came about.
I'm not going to agree or disagree with any claims that he took steroids, but I think a deeper look into his past would make some nay sayers think twice.
That's what I get for listening to sports casters. I forgot they are also part of the MSM.:eek:
NousDefionsDoc
07-30-2007, 15:25
No love for Biggio? I agree about Ripken.
On Bonds - he's not a nice guy. But then he's not paid to be nice. Look at the expectations he came in under. Godfather Willie Mays. Father Bobby. McCovey in there too. Imagine the pressure.
A lot of them cheat. Sosa corked his bat. Cobb sharpened his spikes. You guys don't think The Babe would have juiced?
Mantle wasn't a saint either.
As for the asterisk - it was shit when they did it to Maris. He didn't decide how long the season would be. I don't care if they do it to Bonds or not. He has played within the system well enough that they haven't booted him.
IF they want to kick him out, they should do it. If they want to let him play, it should stand clean.
They are baseball players, not moral not role models.
Having said that, I would take Ripken or Biggio over any of the "cheaters". You gotta love any guy that will lead the league in HBP and games played.
75,000 people showed up to see Cal Ripken Jr get inducted into the Hall of Fame. I wonder how many would show up for Bonds, if he ever gets in. Im sure Arod will have broken his home run record by the time he is even eligible.
No, but the power of steroids is the difference between a .300 hitter with 60 HRs per season, and a .270 hitter with 10 HRs.
Any ball hit over the fence is safe from fielding or errors.
TR
Exactly. Having played from age 5 up through the collegiate level, I learned that baseball can be a game of inches.
Nobody is denying that Bonds was a great player, and that no amount of muscle can give you the ability to put the bat on the ball, but the steriods push that 315 foot fly out to left center over the fence....... they make the ground ball shoot through the infield before before a shortstop can get to it, and they muscle that check swing, off the hands, blooper over the shortstop instead of it being an infield pop out.
Like I said, Bonds was very good, great even, but I do not for one minute believe that you go from averaging 19 -25 home runs a year for the first 6 or 7 years of your career, with 34 being your "best" year, to averaging 50 a year once you hit 38 years old...... that isn't the way the game works..... your hand and eye coordination is worse in your late 30's, not better, your reaction times are slower, your stats go down...........
The dude somhow hit his "prime" at 40, and I'm not buying it.
He's a cheater. I won't watch him. I don't respect his record.
Just the opinion of an old broken down catcher who loves the game.
My brother-in-law, rest his soul, played against Barry in college. He said some picture on his team was a fire baller and had his dad in the stands. When Barry came up the old man was screaming at his son, "Throw it by him, throw it by him." He said the picture rared back and fired the ball. He said Bonds hit it so hard and far, it probably still going. lol.
I believe if you kicked out every player who ever tried any form of juice, steroids etc., you probably couldn't field a professional team in any sport. By the way, the crazy man Canseco said he's going to spill the beans on Arod in his next book.
Would you feel as strongly about a guy on your team taking steroids as you would a professional baseball player? If not, why not?
NousDefionsDoc
07-30-2007, 18:54
You guys do understand that steroids aren't magic right? You still have to do the work.
x-factor
07-30-2007, 21:14
For a long time I gave Bonds the benefit of the doubt. The guy has incredible genetics and a lifetime of developing a great swing...why couldn't he (given unlimited access to every modern physical training method) have put on the muscle and hit a ton of HRs? Since then though, the evidence that has surfaced has been pretty undeniable.
Most major league players don't find their power until their fourth or fifth year. From Bonds' fifth season (1990) to the year before he hit 73 (2000) he averaged 37 HRs a year and won 3 MVPs (to say nothing of all his other stats). The guy was a Hall of Famer without the steroids.
Really the 73 HR season was the only aberration. After that he went back to hitting in the 40s which (along with his other numbers) is more or less consistent with his career. The steroids will probably end up costing him longevity (he missed almost the entire 2005 season and he's been injury prone ever since) because they're notoriously hard on joints. Even if he hadn't had the 73HR season he probably would have broken Aaron's record anyway, either this season or the next.
Basically the guy sacrificed his reputation as the best slugger of his generation for one thing: the single season HR record.
Pure arrogance.
Achilles
07-30-2007, 22:03
No love for Biggio? I agree about Ripken.
On Bonds - he's not a nice guy. But then he's not paid to be nice. Look at the expectations he came in under. Godfather Willie Mays. Father Bobby. McCovey in there too. Imagine the pressure.
A lot of them cheat. Sosa corked his bat. Cobb sharpened his spikes. You guys don't think The Babe would have juiced?
Mantle wasn't a saint either.
As for the asterisk - it was shit when they did it to Maris. He didn't decide how long the season would be. I don't care if they do it to Bonds or not. He has played within the system well enough that they haven't booted him.
IF they want to kick him out, they should do it. If they want to let him play, it should stand clean.
They are baseball players, not moral not role models.
Having said that, I would take Ripken or Biggio over any of the "cheaters". You gotta love any guy that will lead the league in HBP and games played.
Agreed on all points. I'd like to see any big name hitters nowadays that HAVEN'T used performance enhancers some time in their career.
IMO it's the MLB's fault for not testing their players. Health risks associated with steroids are (and have been) known for a long time now, and it's not like they didn't know what was going on. Their blind eye to steroids has been very irresponsible IMO, if for no other reason that their attitude encouraged their use and put many players' health at risk.
All that said, Bonds has a terrible attitude towards the media and often towards the public in general, and has mostly that to blame for the situation he has found himself in. If there is to be an asterisk next to his career record, let it read that he played in an era in baseball where performance enhancers were the rule and not the exception.
The Reaper
07-30-2007, 23:02
If there is to be an asterisk next to his career record, let it read that he played in an era in baseball where performance enhancers were the rule and not the exception.
Look at Ripken.
Do you think he juiced?
Better a long term, consistent, reliable, quality player than a flash in the pan. Like McGuire. Or an asshole, like Bonds.
And who is to say that Bonds' success was due to steroids just that one season? Maybe his norm is well below 30 HRs?
QRQ30, steroids don't give you a better average, but if combined with the right training regimen, they will definitely make the balls you hit fly further.
TR
Achilles
07-30-2007, 23:29
Look at Ripken.
Do you think he juiced?
Better a long term, consistent, reliable, quality player than a flash in the pan. Like McGuire. Or an asshole, like Bonds.
And who is to say that Bonds' success was due to steroids just that one season? Maybe his norm is well below 30 HRs?
QRQ30, steroids don't give you a better average, but if combined with the right training regimen, they will definitely make the balls you hit fly further.
TR
I don't think Ripken juiced. History will remember him as a great baseball player and a great guy. Bonds will only be remembered as the former, not the latter.
As for whether Bonds would be hitting a lot of home runs without juice, it's all conjecture. He's still hitting them now and there's no way he's been able to get away with juicing for quite some time. IMO he would have broken the record (though not the single season) regardless of steroid abuse or not. The MSM blowing this issue out of proportion is (in my eyes) a direct reaction to how Bonds acts and conducts himself at press conferences. He has blown any chance of preserving a positive image in the MSM for the rest of his career.
Pleasure to be talking to y'all again.
brandonm
07-30-2007, 23:49
For a long time I gave Bonds the benefit of the doubt. The guy has incredible genetics and a lifetime of developing a great swing...why couldn't he (given unlimited access to every modern physical training method) have put on the muscle and hit a ton of HRs? Since then though, the evidence that has surfaced has been pretty undeniable.
Most major league players don't find their power until their fourth or fifth year. From Bonds' fifth season (1990) to the year before he hit 73 (2000) he averaged 37 HRs a year and won 3 MVPs (to say nothing of all his other stats). The guy was a Hall of Famer without the steroids.
Really the 73 HR season was the only aberration. After that he went back to hitting in the 40s which (along with his other numbers) is more or less consistent with his career. The steroids will probably end up costing him longevity (he missed almost the entire 2005 season and he's been injury prone ever since) because they're notoriously hard on joints. Even if he hadn't had the 73HR season he probably would have broken Aaron's record anyway, either this season or the next.
Basically the guy sacrificed his reputation as the best slugger of his generation for one thing: the single season HR record.
Pure arrogance.
So what's the undeniable proof?
I dont understand why the San Francisco fans are so excited with him breaking the record...I would be embarrassed he is still playing in the MLB and to be associated with him in my team..
Edit: I think there is a growing fustration inside of me that he probably has taken steroids but as some of you have correctly pointed out, he has neither been charged or found guilty of anything so far. But I think there have been someone people associated to him in the past who have been caught with performance enhancing drugs so that was why I was a wee bit fustrated and upset he broke the record....
Then again, I'm a mariners fan so.....
I dont understand why the SF fans are so excited with him breaking the record...I would be embarrassed he is still playing in the MLB and to be associated with him in my team..
Has he been tried and convicted?
I dont understand why the SF fans are so excited with him breaking the record...I would be embarrassed he is still playing in the MLB and to be associated with him in my team..
On a board like this you should really put "San Fran" fans not "SF":D
Pete
Has he been tried and convicted?
Negative. Then again, neither has OJ.:D
No love for Biggio? I agree about Ripken.
On Bonds - he's not a nice guy. But then he's not paid to be nice. Look at the expectations he came in under. Godfather Willie Mays. Father Bobby. McCovey in there too. Imagine the pressure.
A lot of them cheat. Sosa corked his bat. Cobb sharpened his spikes. You guys don't think The Babe would have juiced?
Mantle wasn't a saint either.
As for the asterisk - it was shit when they did it to Maris. He didn't decide how long the season would be. I don't care if they do it to Bonds or not. He has played within the system well enough that they haven't booted him.
IF they want to kick him out, they should do it. If they want to let him play, it should stand clean.
They are baseball players, not moral not role models.
Having said that, I would take Ripken or Biggio over any of the "cheaters". You gotta love any guy that will lead the league in HBP and games played.
I agree with most of your points, but his constant whining about the pressure is the main reason I don't like Bonds. I can only imagine the pressure, but I don't give him a pass for it. Did his father or godfather force him to pick up a bat and glove?
I vividly remember as a kid reading an article in Sports Illustrated touting the then high-schooler Bonds as the next great phenom. There was a photo of his grinning, rail-thin, smaller-hat-size ass standing in front of the brand-new BMW M3 his dad gave him for his 16th birthday. He knew exactly what he was getting into when he went into baseball. And it appears it wasn't always all bad.
Now he hates the media because he remembers how shabbily they treated his dad. And he constantly whines in public about how tough it is to be Barry. Is that why he has a cordoned-off area in the clubhouse all to himself, where his teammates aren't even allowed? As noted, he has legitimate skills and was well on his way towards a superstar career. So why did he start juicing? To hit the long ball farther? Or to help himself bear the crushing weight of lofty expectations? If it's all so unbearable, then take your glove, your bat, your hat and go home.
Negative. Then again, neither has OJ.:D
U are in slight error. Bonds has not even been charged, let alone tried . OJ was.
I love the term :cheater". I picked up on this more on the recent NASCAR events but applies here IMO. People crying "Foul" "Cheater, crook" etc may go outside, J-walk to their cars, pull out of a no-parking zone, then get on the highway with cell phone in one ear and MP3 in the other and push the speed limit as far as they think they can. They may even be text messaging at the same time. :eek: My point is that competitors push to what they see as the limit and sometimes get caught, as do we.
In the past people took things which weren't so illegal then such as pain killers and amphetamines. I remember medics carrying around bottles of Sarvon before it became a prescription drug. Maybe we can go back several decades and start disqualifying. Mantle took various drugs for his bone spurs. It was said he looked like a mummy under hos uniform.
Speaking of AARON, IIRC he had a security detail on account of Death Threats.
U are in slight error. Bonds has not even been charged, let alone tried . OJ was.
Ahhhh, but that was not the question. You asked if Bonds had been tried and convicted, to which I replied he has not. To be technically correct, neither has OJ (the "and" in there requires that both events had occurred).
Had the question been "has he been tried or convicted, then you would be correct, as OJ has been tried, but not convicted........
Semantics? Yes...... but that's all I have at this point.:D
I agree with the rest of your post Sir, though I would add that the fact that many people push the envelope by cheating on their taxes, wives, husbands, doing drugs, speeding, etc., does not mean that I have to like them or excuse their actions.
I don't like Bonds. Never will. Just a personal preference, as I see his obvious use of performance enhancing drugs as insulting to the game that I have a near religious devotion to. Perhaps that makes me -odd-, but it's an odd I can live with.
Anyway, I've added all that I have to offer. You gentlemen take care and be safe.:lifter
I think most of the frustration is how MLB handles the problem. Saying they are against juicing. Then not making an honest effort to stop it. Fans are insulted. What exactly is the MLB policy? Is it in the players contracts? There are a lot of reasons not to like drug testing. There is only one reason a person go's out of his way. Or makes an effort to block it.
I know they cant test a player when they want. As much as they want. For whatever drugs they want. I know the punishment for getting caught isnt enough to make them stop.
These pro players already in the show doing it is one thing. The younger kids forced to do it because the other guy is. Thats got to suck. It has nothing to do with winning or making the Majors. Their chances of being a success in life are on the line. The are juicing for that scholarship, money. Forced is the right word here.
NousDefionsDoc
07-31-2007, 18:20
I agree with most of your points, but his constant whining about the pressure is the main reason I don't like Bonds. I can only imagine the pressure, but I don't give him a pass for it. Did his father or godfather force him to pick up a bat and glove?
I vividly remember as a kid reading an article in Sports Illustrated touting the then high-schooler Bonds as the next great phenom. There was a photo of his grinning, rail-thin, smaller-hat-size ass standing in front of the brand-new BMW M3 his dad gave him for his 16th birthday. He knew exactly what he was getting into when he went into baseball. And it appears it wasn't always all bad.
Now he hates the media because he remembers how shabbily they treated his dad. And he constantly whines in public about how tough it is to be Barry. Is that why he has a cordoned-off area in the clubhouse all to himself, where his teammates aren't even allowed? As noted, he has legitimate skills and was well on his way towards a superstar career. So why did he start juicing? To hit the long ball farther? Or to help himself bear the crushing weight of lofty expectations? If it's all so unbearable, then take your glove, your bat, your hat and go home.
Yes they did make him pick up a bat. And his father made him move to the other side of the plate about age five.
I don't give a shit how he treats the press. I don't like the press and I know exactly how it feels to have someone that has never done and can never do what I do criticize my every move.
I don't particularly care for the guy, but he is what he is - which will very soon be the greatest home run hitter of all time.
As for Ripken, I am not accusing him of anything, but it wouldn't surprise me at all to learn that he had taken a little something on a really bad day. And I wouldn't blame him a bit.
Achilles
07-31-2007, 18:37
I think most of the frustration is how MLB handles the problem. Saying they are against juicing. Then not making an honest effort to stop it. Fans are insulted. What exactly is the MLB policy? Is it in the players contracts? There are a lot of reasons not to like drug testing. There is only one reason a person go's out of his way. Or makes an effort to block it.
I know they cant test a player when they want. As much as they want. For whatever drugs they want. I know the punishment for getting caught isnt enough to make them stop.
These pro players already in the show doing it is one thing. The younger kids forced to do it because the other guy is. Thats got to suck. It has nothing to do with winning or making the Majors. Their chances of being a success in life are on the line. The are juicing for that scholarship, money. Forced is the right word here.
Roger,
That's what I was saying. The MLB is encouraging steroid use through lax policy, and in doing so, effectively reduce the life expectancy and increase health risks of their own players. I can't blame the players, really. The "man in the arena" quote by Theodore Roosevelt comes to mind when I second guess an athlete's actions like the MSM does (not unlike how they treat the military).
If anyone is to blame it's the MLB's policy makers.
Pleasure to be talking to y'all again.
Good to see you back here!
On a board like this you should really put "San Fran" fans not "SF":D
Pete
Silly me..good point there Pete. Will edit it...
Roger,
That's what I was saying. The MLB is encouraging steroid use through lax policy, and in doing so, effectively reduce the life expectancy and increase health risks of their own players. I can't blame the players, really. The "man in the arena" quote by Theodore Roosevelt comes to mind when I second guess an athlete's actions like the MSM does (not unlike how they treat the military).
If anyone is to blame it's the MLB's policy makers.
I dont think MLB is ignoring the problem but I think they could do alot more than they have at the moment. I think they also stand to lose a lot if there was a witch-hunt (look at whats happening at the Tour D France) and are probably going around dealing with the problem in a subtle way.
Achilles
08-01-2007, 01:14
I dont think MLB is ignoring the problem but I think they could do alot more than they have at the moment. I think they also stand to lose a lot if there was a witch-hunt (look at whats happening at the Tour D France) and are probably going around dealing with the problem in a subtle way.
Would you consider randomly steroid testing players during the season a witch-hunt?
I agree that there's sensible limitations, but having two guys on a team piss in a cup every week doesn't sound so harsh to me.
I don't think MLB is ignoring the problem but I think they could do a lot more than they have at the moment. I think they also stand to lose a lot if there was a witch-hunt (look at whats happening at the Tour D France) and are probably going around dealing with the problem in a subtle way.
It needs to be a witch hunt. For people who use drugs they were told not to.
Only thing I noticed about the Tour D France is they bust people who use performance enhancing drugs. They also don't play around with fines equivalent to fining a buck SGT ten dollars. They hit them where it hurts. They take away the most important thing in the world to them. Winning and the ability to make money from that win. Don't remember seeing whats his name on to many TV shows after his win was taken away.
Didn't Coopers town send Maguire his Bat via UPS. I know they took it off display because Someone who went there said it was gone. This was right after his testimony. Is Coopers town under MLB control or independent?
The Reaper
08-01-2007, 12:17
For those out there who have not served, I would tell you that all members of the military are tested randomly in a periodic urinalysis program.
This program has been in effect for over 25 years. It was originally used solely for people in sensitive positions and was gradually expanded to included very soldier in the Army.
Those who test positive are punished under the UCMJ, and placed in a treatment program. Those who are repeat failures are processed for separation from the service. The best soldier in the Army will be treated the same as the worst under this policy, and the fact that he is talented or set some record will not matter.
Many civilian jobs have similar requirements.
Now, realizing that we do not have a union in the U.S. military, is there any other reason that people being paid millions of dollars every year to play a game could not be bothered to be regularly tested for illegal substances?
Is the concept of fairness lost today?
TR
Would you consider randomly steroid testing players during the season a witch-hunt?
I agree that there's sensible limitations, but having two guys on a team piss in a cup every week doesn't sound so harsh to me.
I think randomly testing players is half a solution but not A-SOLUTION to a problem that might or might not exist.
I however do believe it is happening and unless MLB takes positive steps, then you couldnt say it doesnt exist.
For those out there who have not served, I would tell you that all members of the military are tested randomly in a periodic urinalysis program.
This program has been in effect for over 25 years. It was originally used solely for people in sensitive positions and was gradually expanded to included very soldier in the Army.
Those who test positive are punished under the UCMJ, and placed in a treatment program. Those who are repeat failures are processed for separation from the service. The best soldier in the Army will be treated the same as the worst under this policy, and the fact that he is talented or set some record will not matter.
Many civilian jobs have similar requirements.
Now, realizing that we do not have a union in the U.S. military, is there any other reason that people being paid millions of dollars every year to play a game could not be bothered to be regularly tested for illegal substances?
Is the concept of fairness lost today?
TR
Well said Reaper...was thinking the same thing myself....surely MLB can afford to conduct tests on every player at least once a month at the very least during the baseball season...
x-factor
08-02-2007, 16:50
Didn't John McCain put forward the idea of legislation to put all American professional sports on the Olympic testing standard?
Team Sergeant
08-08-2007, 11:31
Go and check out the NYPost front page.:munchin LOLOLOL
The Reaper
08-08-2007, 12:05
Yay.:rolleyes:
TR
NousDefionsDoc
08-08-2007, 17:51
So he has never been proven to have taken them? He has never failed a test? All these accusations are because they found some in the house of his personal trainer?
So he has never been proven to have taken them? He has never failed a test? All these accusations are because they found some in the house of his personal trainer?
Barry Bonds has hit more home runs in major league games than anyone else. Period.
If we put an asterisk what will accompany ir? "Maybe", "Perhaps", "We think" or best of all "We presume."
If I based my opinions on the press I would have burned my Bobby Knight trading car5s long ago.:lifter
Maybe Bonds will kick it up over 800 before the end of the season.. I don't really give a sh!t either way.
One simple fact - if he hadn't been on the juice, he wouldn't have beaten the record.
Anyone who has seen the series of progressive photos of his physical stature, and still doesn't believe he's on juice is living in another world..