View Full Version : Inside The Green Berets on NGC
Spartan74
05-17-2007, 22:20
Inside The Green Berets on the National Geographic Channel premieres June 3
9p.m.
http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/channel/green-berets/index.html
In a remote outpost in south-central Afghanistan, a group of Americans stand in the breach between the rule of law and the rule of terror. They are Green Berets, part of an elite division of the U.S. Army Special Forces, charged with protecting local civilians from the wrath of the Taliban. For this film, the Pentagon waived their 48-hour limitation on embedded media and allowed NGC cameras to chronicle the lives of these war-hardened Americans for 10 days.
Spartan74
06-03-2007, 12:13
TTT as a reminder for those interested.
Scimitar
06-03-2007, 12:42
For those who might miss it
Pacific Time
Also airs:
Tuesday, June 5, 7P
Tuesday, June 5, 10P
Eastern Time
Also airs:
Monday, June 4, 12A
Tuesday, June 5, 10P
Edited for correct info
zuluzerosix
06-03-2007, 12:44
I just watched the preview videos, looks like a good show.
http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/channel/green-berets/videos.html
...and for those who don't get the NG channel the whole show is already on YouTube, search for Special Forces.
Spartan74
06-03-2007, 14:44
Its not on youtube yet. It premieres tonight. The videos that you are referring to are from 2003 called Inside Special Forces. Warrior Mentor posted those youtube links here:
http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12905&highlight=inside+special+forces
Its not on youtube yet. It premieres tonight. The videos that you are referring to are from 2003 called Inside Special Forces. Warrior Mentor posted those youtube links here:
http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12905&highlight=inside+special+forces
...oops.
Its on XBox360 as a download! I don't get the NG channel!:mad:
Scimitar
06-03-2007, 16:50
Also on 6:00pm Pacific Time for PT Views
Sorry about the short notice
Scimitar
06-03-2007, 22:32
Interested to see what people thought of it?
Especially from us SF wannabes, 18X etc
I'll hold fire for a bit
Given the restrictions imposed on the camera crew, and the unforunate events which took place, I believe they did the best they could. Obviously, if that attack hadn't happened, you would have had a more indepth and educational program. However it did drive home the point that there is no status quo, and how things can go bad at a moments notice.
Roguish Lawyer
06-04-2007, 07:34
Saw it last night. Two thumbs up. RIP.
http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/channel/green-berets/index.html
....Especially from us SF wannabes, 18X etc....I'll hold fire for a bit
Well, when you open fire remember what point of view you're shooting from.
Pete
The Reaper
06-04-2007, 11:23
I thought that it was okay, but they provided info that will be of value to the enemy (which we will not discuss here), and that it would have been nice if they had continued to follow the team further and report on their progress.
TR
Jack Moroney (RIP)
06-04-2007, 12:44
I thought that it was okay, but they provided info that will be of value to the enemy (which we will not discuss here), and that it would have been nice if they had continued to follow the team further and report on their progress.
TR
You are being very polite. To begin with I thought it was an OPSEC disaster. The rest of my comments I'll keep to myself.
The Reaper
06-04-2007, 12:51
Exactly, Sir.
After seeing it, I could put together a pretty good list of strengths and weaknesses of SF in OEF, as well as a list of Dos and Don'ts for fighting them. Too many TTPs revealed.
I think they would have beeen better off sticking with the human interest side of the story, and omitting all of the operational details till the war was over.
TR
Haven't seen it yet, but my dad called last night after he watched it and had the same feelings expressed above about OPSEC.
I'm confused about all of this... Would this have needed a clearance review by the Army prior to air? Or, is it that once the press is let in - they have free reign unless they are asked and comply with certain requests to not say or film certain things? I don't like the idea that someone else who doesn't understand OPSEC gets the final decision on what to show or not show or say/not say. Having been a part of the 10th MTN DIV family, there is no forgiveness for Geraldo Rivera after his stunt in Iraq a few years ago. The press isn't exactly objective when it comes to security. I get that the Army doesn't necessarily have a very tight leash on the embedded press because they pop off at a moment's notice, but in a case like this - don't they (shouldn't they) get some kind of review?
I have to say I was very surprised at several things I saw.
blue02hd
06-04-2007, 17:26
Shar,
To answer your question, "Isn't there a review?" Yes,, there is a review. Every frame of film is reviewed by the respective POA's , but it may be difficult for us Arm Chair Generals to second guess why certain things were aired and other things were not.
Having experienced Discovery Channel embeds (personally assigned to me while I was working in theater), I promise you there was much more film that was cut than was aired. Much like any other directive, once an order is given to that ODA, TM SGT, and or TM LDR, there is very little that can be done but move out and draw fire. The team had to balance the burden the mission along with the directive to please highers and "give a good showing". Don't forget the added problem of security on the additional "VIP's" that are taking up seats that more rifles could have filled. I for one feel the coverage was positive in light, and really did credit to the guys over there atm. They represented us well, even if the show invited criticism from arm chair quarter backs. On that note, all I can say is,"if you haven't worn those shoes, don't even pretend to point out how you would have done it better".
I remember feeling the same way after watching the SERE footage air a few years back. Great coverage, but I personally wish that it was never aired.
This is the same. Publicity versus Need to know?? But, if we HAVE to allow coverage, and this is an arguement only the few that are higher up the totem pole could explain, then atleast we can hope that it is positive coverage. When I compare this show to the show that covered the 19th Group in Afghanistan, ( I actually threw a beer at my TV) I am relieved. Much better presentation this time.
But hell, I served in 3rd Group, so I may be slightly partial,,,,
Jack Moroney (RIP)
06-04-2007, 18:11
[QUOTE=blue02hd]even if the show invited criticism from arm chair quarter backs. On that note, all I can say is,"if you haven't worn those shoes, don't even pretend to point out how you would have done it better". IQUOTE]
You have someone in mind for this quote, or is this just a general statement?
Scimitar
06-04-2007, 18:36
From an 18X point of view it was very enlightening to see a team at work, more importantly a lot of what I have been told made more sense.
Really enjoyed seeing the professionalism.
My Father spoke of how combat is actually a lot 'slower' than you'd think from watching the movies. He'd say its a thinking mans game that you actually have more time then you'd think upon contact.
This made sense to me as I saw the ODA, never flustered, never in a rush, almost relaxed it would seem (in reality their all ready to kill at a moments notice I'm guessing).
But I do agree from a OPSPEC point of view, not that I know anything much about OPSPEC, but it seemed everything I learned is something the enemy could learn. But the guys up stairs had a good reason I'm sure.
Does SF need to increase brand value some what to assist with force increase goals?
Otherwise over all it impressed the hell out of me and just made me want it more and gave me a desire to get in and get on a team ASAP so as to take as much weight as I could off the guys already in.
I was surprised how much the casualties racked me up. Obviously didn't know any of those brave brave guys, but it just made me pissed off at the cowardice and more resolved to send prayers up for all SF out there until I can join in to take a load.
[QUOTE=blue02hd]even if the show invited criticism from arm chair quarter backs. On that note, all I can say is,"if you haven't worn those shoes, don't even pretend to point out how you would have done it better". IQUOTE]
You have someone in mind for this quote, or is this just a general statement?
I would say it was aimed at some people in a general way. The same way my post was a little above it.
This is a well managed site but on some others the "straphangers" like to get the feel for how the wind is blowing on a subject and then pile on with their 20/20 Hind Sight about they could have/would have done it different.
I would say right now this thread is pretty subdued. I think those that "walked the walk" winced a bit during the show and the rest are waiting.
Jut my opinion of course.
Pete
Does SF need to increase brand value some what to assist with force increase goals?maybe i'm out of my lane, but my suspicion is that at this point in your career, the 25 meter target is your friend...we have folks that worry about such issues, or at least, so i am told...
Scimitar
06-04-2007, 20:39
Sorry lksteve,
That was more of a "Could this be a reason behind why the brass allowed it" statement.
Not an "I think they need to do it this way" statement
Sorry for any ambiguity
blue02hd
06-05-2007, 02:52
[QUOTE=blue02hd]even if the show invited criticism from arm chair quarter backs. On that note, all I can say is,"if you haven't worn those shoes, don't even pretend to point out how you would have done it better". IQUOTE]
You have someone in mind for this quote, or is this just a general statement?
Sir, this was intended as a completely general statement.
The discussion is wide open about why access was given and if the footage was reviewed. In either event, the ODA had no choice in the matter, just as I had no choice . The media is another 500 pound gorrilla that ODA's, and the deployed military are now having to face. Much like working with village elders, serving on a team, or losing a brother, embeds represent "shoes" that many have not worn.
This was on my mind.
Jack Moroney (RIP)
06-05-2007, 03:52
[QUOTE=Jack Moroney]
Sir, this was intended as a completely general statement.
The discussion is wide open about why access was given and if the footage was reviewed. In either event, the ODA had no choice in the matter, just as I had no choice . The media is another 500 pound gorilla that ODA's, and the deployed military are now having to face. Much like working with village elders, serving on a team, or losing a brother, embeds represent "shoes" that many have not worn.
This was on my mind.
I understand and concur, however I am sorry that things seemed to have changed a bit since I was little. Perhaps it is a sign of the times with the ability of MSM to influence actions and play both the inadvertant and deliberate psyop card. I refused embeds, I also sent the National Geographic folks packing. I learned my lesson the hard way with a reporter from the Cleveland Plain Dealer when he was deposited on us with a resupply bird. We had a long hard talk about what was printable and what was not, that he could not accompany us on combat operations, but he would be given "free" access to local actions with specific guidelines and one of us would always be with him. He was not happy, but accepted the ground rules and promised that we would see what he had before he left, minus the photographs because our dark room ability was not as good as his. When we got the final two weekend spreads from the states, while it was not bad it, was not what we had blessed. In short he put a lot of us at risk. The next time we had a "visitor" in bound I worked worked the AO from one of my outposts using white phosphorous 60mm mortar rounds and let them draw the conclusion that we were taking fire. The airforce deemed it too risky for to land their C-7A. Now I fully understand that this is a different time and place, and that there is pressure from the command with specifics as to what you will and will not do, however if that is indeed the position that is forced upon the troops today then I would never make it in today's setting as the day that a commander on the ground does not have a choice in this matter is the day that I would have to hang up my ruck. Come to think of it, as I reflect back a tad, I guess it is a miracle that I ever progressed beyond the grade of 03.
Come to think of it, as I reflect back a tad, I guess it is a miracle that I ever progressed beyond the grade of 03.Well, if don't mind taking a reduction in rank too come back in....I'll fill one of your E/D/F slots?:D :lifter :munchin
Stay safe.
x SF med
06-05-2007, 08:41
I'll join up in a B or D slot, if the COL needs guys on his team.
Can I be the Charlie....PLEASE?!?!
I know how to do hand receipts, pack the ISU-90 and everything!
This is a well managed site but on some others the "straphangers" like to get the feel for how the wind is blowing on a subject and then pile on with their 20/20 Hind Sight about they could have/would have done it different.
I would say right now this thread is pretty subdued. I think those that "walked the walk" winced a bit during the show and the rest are waiting.
Just my opinion of course.
Pete
(I would have done it different :p )
But only because we all have seen different things happen, IE Experience's
I like Oranges, you like Apples.
Dont matter as long as the job gets done.
frostfire
06-05-2007, 19:52
Too many TTPs revealed.
:( I learnt things I've never known or imagined/guessed before. Bet the enemy did, too.
I can't stop thinking about the AA truck illuminating the back of the humvee before the explosion. Chronological correlation resulting from the footage editing? Pure coincidence?
I guess I'll never know since the discussion surely violates OPSEC
RIP Sergeant Q
Grendelizer
06-05-2007, 21:09
Being a civvie, I don't know how much we assume the enemy already knows, so maybe my concern is overblown, but as I was watching them reveal the, shall we say, clever use of communications equipment, I grew a little pissed. :mad:
Did whoever approved this for public broadcast really know what he was doing?
John
Admins, QP's:
For the sake of OPSEC and the chance that an errant poster goes on a wild tangent, can we call this thread done?
Professionally, I would appreciate it.
This is not intended to offend any persons judgement on what to post, most have demonstrated a clear regard for OPSEC and have kept it clean due to their knowledge and experiences, others that "assume" are potentially (or unknowingly) risking future ops.
SSG B
The Reaper
06-06-2007, 07:05
Since we have the ability to remove any posts that step over the line, and those who actually know enough to comment intelligently also know better than to get into details, I think that we are safe leaving it open for now.
I seriously doubt that anyone will post anything that will do as much damage as the show did.
Let this be a warning for anyone who wishes to post on this thread to think about what you would say if it were your ass in the Box.
Good enough?
TR
Like Pete said, I winced at times with what they showed and was more than a little pissed at their lack of concern. Good show other than that. I'd like to see NGC donate any proceeds from sales of the video to the families of those killed.
I didn't watch the program. The thought crossed my mind but got d/x'd right quick. There was likely more being shown than I needed to see and if "anybody" wanted me to know he'd tell me.
Having said that, I appreciate this thread and the insights you guys have about what the show portrayed.
So, thanks TR for keeping it open and thanks to the men who share their opinions.
5POINT56
06-06-2007, 07:39
Like Pete said, I winced at times with what they showed and was more than a little pissed at their lack of concern. Good show other than that. I'd like to see NGC donate any proceeds from sales of the video to the families of those killed.
Now there's a great idea.
Letter on the way, email sent suggesting exactly that.
http://www.nationalgeographic.com/community/email.html
I had the pleasure of watching the program with a couple of QP's who happened to be deployed at the same time as the folks in program, but working out of a firebase in the nearby vicinity. Their comments echoed the sentiment expressed by blue02hd. They offered the opinion that there were very few secrets of which either side wasn't aware. "After fighting there for six years, we know how they operate and they know how we operate."
It gives me the impression that most of us back here really have no concept of how we are prosecuting the war in Afghanistan, and maybe this program was a good thing. Perhaps if some of the folks high up on the totem pole came down occasionally, it would give us a chance to do some significant damage to the Taliban.
Jack Moroney (RIP)
06-06-2007, 17:42
Ithey know how we operate.".
Then there are a whole bunch of folks not doing their jobs!
Since we have the ability to remove any posts that step over the line, and those who actually know enough to comment intelligently also know better than to get into details, I think that we are safe leaving it open for now.
I seriously doubt that anyone will post anything that will do as much damage as the show did.
Let this be a warning for anyone who wishes to post on this thread to think about what you would say if it were your ass in the Box.
Good enough?
TR
Agreed, Thanks TR
It gives me the impression that most of us back here really have no concept of how we are prosecuting the war in Afghanistan...
I don't know if I'd go quite that far.
Huff9337
06-06-2007, 23:53
I enjoyed the show, but did think way to much was shown that could benefit present and future enemys. Never had to work with any press so do not know how I wold have reacted.
I like the idea of procceds of the film be donated to the families.
Just my thoughts.
RIP
LitleBird
06-07-2007, 07:44
In a remote outpost in south-central Afghanistan known as Firebase Cobra, a group of Americans stand in the breach between the rule of law and the rule of terror. They are Green Berets, part of an elite division of the U.S. Army Special Forces, charged with protecting local civilians from the wrath of the Taliban. These elite soldiers navigate an unforgiving landscape, never certain from one minute to the next if they will make it back to the base alive.
Part 1 (www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymtEQypLEAQ)
Part 2 (www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5suABaAvXg)
Part 3 (www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiER8LIRxjw)
Part 4 (www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndZsSfgZElA)
Part 5 (www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nctp5g25CEg)
Part 6 (www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEMN4-WTuXo)
EDIT: Hope I've got the right SFG...
The Reaper
06-07-2007, 08:09
Part 1 (www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymtEQypLEAQ)
Part 2 (www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5suABaAvXg)
Part 3 (www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiER8LIRxjw)
Part 4 (www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndZsSfgZElA)
Part 5 (www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nctp5g25CEg)
Part 6 (www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEMN4-WTuXo)
EDIT: Hope I've got the right SFG...
Do not start new threads when the topic already has a dedicated thread.
You were wrong about the Group as well.
More reading, less posting.
TR