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JPH
10-17-2006, 23:48
I just found this on another board, and thought you all would like to see it. I am really beyond words.
http://www.givethemback.com/

Texian
10-18-2006, 08:04
Since my activation during Katrina/Rita, I've disapproved of Mayor Nagin's very existence. The law abiding citizens of NO should take this all the way to the Supreme Court and get their guns back. They should demand their oxygen back while they're at it.

The Reaper
10-18-2006, 08:08
Hey, they reelected him.

We get the leadership the majority votes for.

TR

Texian
10-18-2006, 09:05
Most true, Sir.

In this case, as in many others, it's quite unfortunate. I was astounded when he was reelected.

82ndtrooper
10-19-2006, 19:02
Nawww, we dont live in a police state !! How about this one. California just passed a bill that require all handguns sold in 2008 to have a "Micro Stamp" ID on the firing pin. some 70 or so PD Chiefs have supported this bill saying it would aid greatly in solving crime with guns. Really ? How many law abiding gun owners in California routinely perform drive by's ?? leaving casings at the scene of the crime.

They never seemt to get it ! This is not about fighting crrime, it's about placing more production costs on the firearms manufacturers. I expect that many handgun manufacturers will discontinue their sales in California. This smells like "Back door" infringement of the 2nd Amendment, not fighting crime.

If only stolen guns are used by "Gang Bangers" and criminals, why would they expect the criminals to suddenly start purchasing new guns with the micro stamp ?? It's not going to happen, and it's foolish to think that this is at all about fighting crime. It's nothing more than the Dianne Feinstiens and Chuck Schumers of the world finding way's to obscure the purchase of handguns.

The Reaper
10-19-2006, 19:05
Curious how this Cali initiative will affect crime committed with revolvers, since they leave no cases behind.

Will shell catchers be on the banned items list, like suppressors?

Will bullets be required to have the user's SSN imprinted into them?

TR

NousDefionsDoc
10-19-2006, 19:24
kg and I were talking about this the other day. Has there been a dramatic increase in gun-related crime since the stupid ban passed away?

82ndtrooper
10-19-2006, 19:32
Curious how this Cali initiative will affect crime committed with revolvers, since they leave no cases behind.

Will shell catchers be on the banned items list, like suppressors?

Will bullets be required to have the user's SSN imprinted into them?

TR

Dont speak to soon, they may listen to you !!

Even if they were smart enough to figure out that shell catchers would be part of the problem, only the criminals that ignore gun legislation will have them. Again, another attempt to ban something that only the criminals will have. After all, the law abiding are the only ones that abide by the rediculous laws already in force in the state California.

SSN's on the bullets ?? They did actually talk about an ID system on the slugs of handguns, but it quickly went away when someone figured out that ammo could be purchased in another state. Just as guns can purchased in the back alley of any city during any given night.

Dont doubt the far left "Kool Aid" drinkers, their up to all kinds of way's to infringe the 2nd Amendment. Never mind that the oath of office mentions that they have to uphold the Constitution, it's merely a formality to them. Every thing after they have the office is subject to change.

Mav
10-20-2006, 06:40
Dont speak to soon, they may listen to you !!

Even if they were smart enough to figure out that shell catchers would be part of the problem, only the criminals that ignore gun legislation will have them. Again, another attempt to ban something that only the criminals will have. After all, the law abiding are the only ones that abide by the rediculous laws already in force in the state California.

That's the problem with gun control, period ;) The only people that will follow these laws are people that wouldn't have committed the crimes, to begin with.
:rolleyes:

I've long since refused to California as my home.. regardless of being born and raised there. It's like stupidity, ignorance, and self-absorption just.. permeate... maybe it's the water?

The Reaper
10-20-2006, 08:08
kg and I were talking about this the other day. Has there been a dramatic increase in gun-related crime since the stupid ban passed away?

I expect the AWB to be put up for permanent passage and gun shows to have new restrictive legislation introduced shortly after the Dems take over one of the houses of Congress. There may also be a move to make Federal law restricting mail order sales of ammo and requiring "ballistic fingerprinting" of weapons. Scary thing is, I am not sure that the Senate, if it remained Republican, would not sign off on it, and the POTUS as well, since he seems to have lost his veto pen.

Stupid legislation, since the weapons covered by the AWB were expensive and were rarely used by criminals. The only person who is going to sell you a gun at a gunshow without paperwork is the private owner who had it for sale in the paper or on the bulletin board at work, or a cop as part of a sting operation. Any dealer selling guns anywhere has to account for every gun bought and sold through a very thorough paper trail.

The idiotic cry for ballistic fingerprinting of all guns sold was passed by a couple of states and to date, has resulted in absolutely no guns being traced to crimes, but a lot of new people having to be hired to keep up with the papers and components. IIRC, at least one state has dropped this requirement due to its uselessness.

I predict significantly more anti-Second Amendment firearms legislation like this passing in the near future if the Dems win.

TR

mumbleypeg
10-20-2006, 09:20
Now that you guys have scared the crap out of me; I thought that somehow I missed this.

AB 352: Microstamping & Bullet Serialization Bill Is Defeated

The firearms industry has scored a major victory in the California Assembly. AB 352 would have mandated the use of unreliable, patented, sole-sourced technology, (as shown by independent research conducted by a leading forensic firearm examiner,) to microstamp firearms and would have permitted the Attorney General to require bullet serialization of all ammunition, including shot gunshells. Ammunition makers said it was impossible to put serial numbers on all ammunition without going bankrupt and they could have been forced to stop all sales of ammunition in California. The California Senate approved mandatory firearms microstamping (AB 352) by a 22 - 18 vote. The bill was defeated in the California Asssembly.

California gives me enough gun law stress, as is.

Maytime
10-20-2006, 09:42
The California Senate approved mandatory firearms microstamping (AB 352) by a 22 - 18 vote.

I wonder how many of those who voted for the bill have actually fired a weapon...

The Reaper
10-20-2006, 10:00
"The firearms industry has scored a major victory in the California Assembly."

Really?

How about the People and the Constitution have been upheld from a vicious and pointless attack intended to destroy interstate commerce? Freedom lived till the next vote.

Maybe Ronnie Barrett was right and all firearms and ammo makers should stop servicing Cali.

If we continue to destroy our domestic firearms and ammo companies, that will be the end result eventually. The only profitable firearms companies in the US today are foreign owned and government subsidized.

Watch for this madness at the national level when Nancy Pelosi is in charge.

TR

Guy
10-20-2006, 10:11
Since my activation during Katrina/Rita, I've disapproved of Mayor Nagin's very existence. The law abiding citizens of NO should take this all the way to the Supreme Court and get their guns back. They should demand their oxygen back while they're at it.Some times politicians need too be ignored.

Nagin ain't nothing but a Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Marion Berry, etc.

The mere mention of those SOBs name, makes my blood boil!:eek: :D

Stay safe.

Guy
10-20-2006, 10:14
Watch for this madness at the national level when Nancy Pelosi is in charge.

TRI hope not!

Stay safe.

incommin
10-20-2006, 10:53
I do not remember when I read it, but somewhere in the past I read a liberal quote that guns didn't need to be banned if no one could get bullets for them...

Jim

smp52
10-20-2006, 11:16
If we continue to destroy our domestic firearms and ammo companies, that will be the end result eventually. The only profitable firearms companies in the US today are foreign owned and government subsidized.

Sadly, this is true.

From a Government standpoint, we heap so many requirements (which are necessary) yet fail to enforce them (looking the other way because of limited industrial base), that at the end of the day healthy domestic competition is suffocated and you're left with an inefficient and subsidized base.

Stamping each ctg case with a 'serial' number using sole sourced technology is as dumb as it gets. Ammo manufacturers make millions of rounds in high speed high volume production. If anyone has been to Lake City, you've seen it, but the best analogy I can come up with is a slot machine paying out 24-7. The volume is fast and furious.

The book Freaknomics had some interesting analysis on firearms and swimming pools, and how the latter is far more dangerous than having firearms in homes for kids, yet guns evoke fear that a swimming pool doesn't. Are Californians going to get rid of their pools?

Most guns being used for crime aren't of the legal variety anyway. There are so many guns out in the market (high supply) that it's impractical to throw down heaping requirements on legal use, yet not even make a dent into the rings of gun smugglers that provide cheap weapons for gangs.

tk27
10-20-2006, 11:27
HR 5013 the “Disaster Recovery Personal Protection Act” which prohibits what happened in New Orleans was passed this summer by a margin of 322-99. It was tacked onto a DHS appropriations bill and POTUS signed it into law this month.


IMHO, I would consider a future Nancy Pelosi gun grab to be just another tentacle of big governments growth, which both parties are to blame for. It isn’t a vast conspiracy, it’s just the system. Oh, and Nagin should be in jail not in office. Off of soapbox now.

mumbleypeg
10-20-2006, 11:28
As if California doesn't have enough difficulty; Jery Brown is leading the polls against Chuck Poochigian in the race for AG. One of the prominent TV spots features a uniformed officer pointing out the public safety hazard that .50 cal weapons present.

There is some hope however:

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-jerry20oct20,0,3490660.story?coll=la-home-local

CALIFORNIA ELECTIONS
Suit Challenges Brown's Eligibility for Top Law Job
Foes of the attorney general candidate cite lapsed state bar dues. His side calls it 'frivolous.'
By Eric Bailey and Robert Salladay
Times Staff Writers

October 20, 2006

SACRAMENTO — Foes of Democratic attorney general candidate Jerry Brown filed a lawsuit Thursday challenging his eligibility to become California's top lawman because he did not pay state bar membership fees in recent years and was declared inactive.

The lawsuit, filed in Sacramento Superior Court by supporters of GOP candidate Chuck Poochigian, a state senator from Fresno, contends that Brown failed to meet a state election law requirement that the attorney general be admitted to practice law in California at least five years immediately preceding election.

Although the former California governor and current Oakland mayor first passed his bar exam and gained approval as a practicing attorney in 1965, Brown on several occasions over the past four decades failed to renew his membership and was rendered inactive. Brown renewed his membership in 2003, before he announced his attorney general candidacy.

Brown's foes contend in the lawsuit that the longtime politician's failure to consistently retain his membership means he was not eligible to practice before the state Supreme Court, as required by the California government code.

"Since he wants to be the keeper of the rules, we think it's rather obvious that he should follow the rules," said attorney Thomas G. Del Beccaro, chairman of the Contra Costa County Republican Party and a plaintiff in the case against Brown.

"I don't view this to be a political stunt," added Beccaro, who is seeking a court order blocking any count of votes for Brown in the attorney general race. No hearing date has been set.

Brown, a graduate of Yale Law School, was admitted to the state bar in June 1965 and became inactive in 1992 as he made a third run for president. He reaffirmed his active status in early 1996 and became inactive again from 1997 to May 2003.

Ace Smith, Brown's campaign strategist, called the lawsuit "frivolous" and a "desperate political ploy" by a Republican who was trailing in the most recent public opinion polls by 15 points among likely voters.

"Chuck Poochigian should either withdraw this lawsuit or withdraw from the race for attorney general," Smith said. "Either he doesn't know the law or he's intent on subverting the legal process. In either case he's unfit to serve as attorney general."

Zack Wasserman, an attorney for Brown, said the suit had "no basis in fact or law."

"Inactive members may transfer to active status at any time upon request," Wasserman said. "They do not need any new qualifications, tests or oaths. They only need to request active status and pay the current fees."

Poochigian, whose campaign team declared it played no part in the lawsuit, noted that Brown had been on inactive status as an attorney 10 of the past 14 years.

"Neither Jerry Brown's political pedigree nor his sense of entitlement can help him resolve this problem," Poochigian said in a prepared statement. "He is not above the law, and it is in the public interest to have this important issue resolved by the courts now."

One legal expert questioned whether the lawsuit could derail Brown's chances.

Stephen R. Barnett, an emeritus law professor at UC Berkeley's Boalt Hall, said, "This dog won't hunt."

Barnett framed the key issue as how to interpret the government code's requirement that an attorney general be "admitted to practice" as a lawyer at least five years prior to election.

"I think you interpret it to the effect that you're admitted to practice whether you're active or inactive," Barnett said, noting that Brown had been admitted to the California bar more than 40 years ago.

82ndtrooper
10-20-2006, 11:32
Really?

How about the People and the Constitution have been upheld from a vicious and pointless attack intended to destroy interstate commerce? Freedom lived till the next vote.

Maybe Ronnie Barrett was right and all firearms and ammo makers should stop servicing Cali.

If we continue to destroy our domestic firearms and ammo companies, that will be the end result eventually. The only profitable firearms companies in the US today are foreign owned and government subsidized.

Watch for this madness at the national level when Nancy Pelosi is in charge.

TR

IIRC Ronnie Barret held on to one his .50 Cal rifles that the LAPD had in his shop for service. After he relized that the LAPD had supported the .50 Cal ban, he would not ship the rifle back to them stating "If you want it back, you'll have to come and get it here in Tenn"

As for Nancy Pelosi, she rates up there with Dianne Feinstien in the "PUKE" factor when ever I see her running her "Enlightened" mouth.

The Reaper
10-20-2006, 11:50
IIRC Ronnie Barret held on to one his .50 Cal rifles that the LAPD had in his shop for service. After he relized that the LAPD had supported the .50 Cal ban, he would not ship the rifle back to them stating "If you want it back, you'll have to come and get it here in Tenn"

As for Nancy Pelosi, she rates up their with Dianne Feinstien in the "PUKE" factor when ever I see her running her "Enlightened" mouth.

Ronnie's letter to LAPD:

http://nramemberscouncils.com/caspecial/la50banbarrett.shtml

TR

82ndtrooper
10-20-2006, 12:06
Ronnie's letter to LAPD:

http://nramemberscouncils.com/caspecial/la50banbarrett.shtml

TR

Thanks TR ! This is a keeper.