View Full Version : Elcan SpecterDR
Anyone use this yet? I heard from another board that we're getting this sometime in the future. http://elcan.phpinternet.com/specter_DR/
x SF med
06-25-2006, 19:02
Like the demo - , wish we had stuff like that when I was in, back in the dark ages.
I tested it last year at blackwater its a real improvment over the ACOG x4 and the M68 10th group is trying to get 1 per man.
we wanted a few changes to the sight when we tested it.
the mini thermal that goes infront of that thing is real nice but dont expect 1 per man for that lol we will have to wait and see if we get it.
Basicload
06-27-2006, 18:35
762,
Did you witness any zero retention issues? kevin B used to be in the CF and is NOT a fan of Elcan products. He has stated that the mechanical elevation and mounting base do not hold zero. I have seen this first hand with the Elcan M-145 Machinegun Optic (MGO).
Kevin,
You wanna jump in here on this?
Gene Econ
06-27-2006, 18:49
762, Did you witness any zero retention issues? kevin B used to be in the CF and is NOT a fan of Elcan products. He has stated that the mechanical elevation and mounting base do not hold zero. I have seen this first hand with the Elcan M-145 Machinegun Optic (MGO). Kevin, You wanna jump in here on this?
Basicload:
Did you have the elevation dial locked while shooting? Have seen guys fail to lock it down after zeroing a few times. Have used the M-145 on carbines and have not noted zero changes providing the guy locked the thing down.
Gene
Basicload
06-27-2006, 19:31
:p Yeah I'll admit that I have done that once or twice.:rolleyes:
However comma I have had zero shift when I was not being a moron as well. I was trying to pick up on a pattern on this but I was unable because I did not shoot it enough.
I don't have a huge amount of experience with the 145 as we only had them for a year before I left my last unit and we use machinegun ACOGs or CQB short dots in my new unit.
What I don't have ANY experience with is the Spectre because again we use S&B's. I would not mind testing them out a bit, but if it has retention issues, I won't bother.
I'd LOVE to trust the fact that because it passed Crane's testing that it must be good kit, but they gave USSOCOM the VLI flashlight with the SOPMOD kit and that thing was a POS!
Gene Econ
06-27-2006, 20:38
[QUOTE=Basicload]:p However comma I have had zero shift when I was not being a moron as well. I was trying to pick up on a pattern on this but I was unable because I did not shoot it enough. I don't have a huge amount of experience with the 145 as we only had them for a year before I left my last unit and we use machinegun ACOGs or CQB short dots in my new unit.
QUOTE]
BL:
I cut your original post up some. No offense please.
I have found that magnified optics with no parallax adjustment aren't parallax free -- no matter how much a company may claim otherwise. Check out the parallax on ACOGs, MGO's, Leupolds that lack a parallax adjustment -- any optic lacking this feature -- and you will see significant parallax issues unless you keep your eye in the exact same spot when looking through such optics.
I have found this to be the majority of a zero shift problem with these low powered "parallax free" optics. See for yourself sometime. How much is the shift? Worse case about three minutes.
Also, the MGO has a feature I personally like but one that can cause problems with guys who haven't yet trained their eyes to see a very consistent sight picture. The MGO has stadia that are broken for the aiming area so a gunner can put his target into the middle of that open part of the stadia. Guys who haven't trained their eyes to see tend to put the target off center in that open area of the reticle -- causing zero shifts. I like it because there is no stadia covering the target but that is me.
Guys will tend to fudge on sight picture with an optic even though they can see the sight picture isn't perfect. The magnification makes them lazy to a degree. Takes about three days to train them out of this condition.
Gene
Basicload
06-27-2006, 21:54
makes sense, got it.
762,
Did you witness any zero retention issues? kevin B used to be in the CF and is NOT a fan of Elcan products. He has stated that the mechanical elevation and mounting base do not hold zero. I have seen this first hand with the Elcan M-145 Machinegun Optic (MGO).
Kevin,
You wanna jump in here on this?
The SpecterDR does have the same locking mech as the M145.
I dident have any problem with it at all holding Zero.
actualy I was putting every round in the same 1inch spot no problem
things to note about it that is not company web site.
the spectraDR is its about half the size of the M145 and you switch from 1x to x4 via a throw lever on the side not a button.
I understand about some of the other problems other sights that have Acog redicals in CQB conditions, mainly not having point of aim point of impact zero but this dident seem to be a problem eather.
Mainly Because of the option to adjust the redical for what ever your shooting condition is, Example if your in CQC Conditions you could turn the knob and fade out the stadia lines and just have a red dot in the center, turn the knob the other way the stadia lines would light up for distance shooting, half way nothing would be lit, the sight takes the same camara batt as the M68 hope that gave you the feedback you wanted.
Review and pictoral walk-around posted on ARFcom. NV and Day use shown, looks promising. Here (http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=18&t=291702)
Well I have always hated the Elcan in any version. We never found any based from GenI to the current GenV C79A2 version to hold a zero.
I jumped one and came off it with a base only (the opitc was AWOL) - this was the time I decided a BIS was a good idea;) -and no one would move forward of me and my buusted sight when the it went live (Go figure trust is so low :D )
Do to the external adjustment system all impacts are transfered immediately upon the elveation dial and the windage screw -- these two points are the features that hold it to the mount...
I'd love to saw the new ones are any better -- but I can't.
I veiw this optic as a 6 month life span -- maybe a lot longer if your in a leg unit that does not shoot.
I fail to understand why they cant adopt an internal adjustment system - like the ACOG. It would add a great deal of impact resistance.
IMHO have played with both -- I went out and spent my own $ on the S&B Short Dot - which I bought before I became a dirty contractor rolling in money.
A buddy of mine pointed out there is a reason why NONE of his six uppers he is issued has any ELCAN product on them... (EOTech's, Aimpoint, ACOG's,Nightforce and S&B)
most any user that has experience with them comes back and says -- great optic -- to bad its wrapped in a crap mount.
Bayonet14
08-18-2006, 08:47
You won't see it in the block II for SOPMOD - looks like we will get the ACOG 4/miniature w/red dot (MRD) PIP -
The TA01NSN-DOC combines the technology of the battle-tested Trijicon ACOG (4x32) gun sight with the Docter Optic 7.0 MOA Red Dot sight. This provides the shooter the option of quick acquisition close range sighting with the Docter Sight and the precision for longer range shooting with the Trijicon ACOG 4x32.
And we all know how industry gets there kickback $$$$ - above is their pitch from Trijicon. Input i have heard is its ok...
Anyone else w/comments or AAR review?
The Reaper
08-18-2006, 09:07
I have several ACOGs, and am pleased with all of them.
Not a fan of the Elcan for all of the reasons mentioned above.
If I knew that I was not going to have to engage a target beyond 150 meters or so, I would run the EO Tech and BUIS.
If the range was regularly going to be beyond that, I would go with the ACOG. It is the best 0-500 meter sight I have seen.
TR
T,
basicload got me into the Short Dot -- I had a S&B issued on a C7CT - but swapped it due to issues (I got it in theatre) with the elevation dial (muslce memory the wrong way) for a M3LR Leupold - I was impressed with the S&B glass and everything up North is now S&B it seems (NF seemed to die out)
I have two Short Dots (in Laure mounts) and have been very impressed with their performance. As long as you mortgage your house your gtg with them..
The Reaper
08-29-2006, 20:28
Not going to drop more than twice the cost of the NightForce on glass, no matter how good.
I did get a Leupold 1.5-5x MR/T to play around with on the carbine.
TR
Aoresteen
09-01-2006, 13:38
I noticed that the ELCAN unit doesn't have built in diopter adjustment. Do any of these sights have diopter adjustments?
never seen a diopter adjustment on any combat sight for the M-4 has anyone else
never seen a diopter adjustment on any combat sight for the M-4 has anyone else
Short Dot :munchin
TR,
I hear you - I had hoped for good things from the NF1-4 NSX - but it did not deliver the daylight illum I beleive is needed.
I had a C79A2 that sat in my barracks box during my 2004 tour in Afghan - however the EOTECH nor the ACOG was the solution for what I was doing with my C8SFW.
I wish USSOC had forced ELCAN into a Larue mount and an internal adjustment system
The Reaper
09-12-2006, 17:37
I wish USSOC had forced ELCAN into a Larue mount and an internal adjustment system
That would not be an ELCAN.
The mount would not be a problem, but moving the adjustments inside would necessitate a total redesign.
TR
That would not be an ELCAN.
TR
Exactly
:D