Weapon sighting

[Monsoon65]

In my squadron, we're putting weapons (M16s for now, soon to be M4s) on the aircraft for use as perimeter defense in case we have to put down in an unsecure area.

These weapons won't be sighted for a specific individual. They'll be kept in a case and lashed to the ramp until needed. When needed, I doubt there will be time to dial in the correct sight alignment for that person.

Any suggestions?

[Peregrino]

In my squadron, we're putting weapons (M16s for now, soon to be M4s) on the aircraft for use as perimeter defense in case we have to put down in an unsecure area.

These weapons won't be sighted for a specific individual. They'll be kept in a case and lashed to the ramp until needed. When needed, I doubt there will be time to dial in the correct sight alignment for that person.

Any suggestions?


Believe it or not - as long as the weapon has been competently zeroed by SOMEBODY - ANYBODY can use it accurately (if they can shoot to start with). Despite what you've been told there is no such thing as an individual zero. Minor adjustments in windage and elevation at the typical 25m zero are due to poor shooting technique, e.g. bad head position, poor (but consistant) sight alignment, etc. And the weapon will only do POA/POI at the zero range - in this case 25m. If possible get somebody who can shoot to zero all the weapons at >100m up to 250m (the real distance - not a scaled target at 25m) and you'll be fine. FWIW - Peregrino

[Team Sergeant]

Any suggestions?


I take it you're headed to a combat zone?

My suggestion would include weapons training and each individual carry a personally issued weapon, zeroed weapon.

That is of course if it your desire to just "scare" the bad men away.

Team Sergeant
Master Sergeant
Special Forces
(ret)

[Peregrino]

I take it you're headed to a combat zone?

My suggestion would include weapons training and each individual carry a personally issued weapon, zeroed weapon.

That is of course if it your desire to just "scare" the bad men away.

Team Sergeant
Master Sergeant
Special Forces
(ret)


TS - There you go again;), this poor guy is in the ANG. The USAF will give a 2LT a 35 million dollar taxpayer funded jet with nuke delivery capability and make him/her a dealer of death and destruction but it takes an act of God for anybody (even the aforementioned 2LT) to get a .38 special out of an arms room for personal defense. I'm surprised they aren't just adding two SPs per plane so they don't have to trusting another "class" of service member with a PDW. M65 - TS is right. Ideally everybody should zero their own weapon. It inspires confidence and reinforces basic weapons handling skills. In your case (special circumstances) I doubt that is even remotely possible. The greater the distance (out to about 250m) that you can use to confirm the zero, the more accurate the weapon will be for a wider group of shooters. (Get some familiarization, outside channels if necessary, prior to deployment.) Peregrino

[Team Sergeant]

I disagree. Placing non-zeroed assault rifles on A/C without proper training is not going to do anyone any good. (Fighting from 15-50 thousand feet and then from 0-200 meters takes a completely different mind-set and training.)

To me it’s like having that loaded 12ga in the bedroom, it ain’t worth a hill of beans if you are not prepared to use it. And if you don’t know how to use it at least you can “look” mean.

There’s a reason ground combatants receive a lot individual weapons training……


Monsoon65,

Tell your unit Commander I'll come out and teach for free if you guys pay per diem & airfare.;)

Team Sergeant

[Five-O]

TS,
Might be cheaper for the AF to higher an infantry company for ground security.:D Although I am sure your rates are reasonable.

[Monsoon65]

The weapons being put on the AC was a new development they started last time we were deployed. My section was given this responsibility, and we are trying to be proactive about it all, but since we're aircrew, it's sort of an uphill battle. We had to fight to get the M16s on the plane to begin with, and the Security Forces are fighting to get us M4's.

We did go out and requal with the M16 before we left. I hadn't fired one in about 10 years, and the SMSgt that was with me hadn't since 1968!! The AF considers our pistols to be primary weapons for aircrew.

When the topic of non-zeroed weapons came up, someone had made the comment we'd be better off trying to hit something with a thrown rock! TS is right; at least we'd "look mean".

Peregrino: Yep, we're ANG. I won't get into the fight we had just to get issued body armor on the plane! I flew OIF when it kicked off and we had none!

TS: Thank you for the offer. I'll be sure to pass this on to my Chief the next time I see him, which will be Tuesday.

Five-O: We're lucky to have room for us on the plane, let alone a company of infantry! We're pretty much jammed to the gills with equipment.

Thanks for all the advice. I really appreciate it all!!

[Penn]

Yesterday, I shot an H & K USP/C. The target was placed @ 10 & 25’. The target was a 12” G-K2000, with a four inch diameter red circle, with an enclosed, one inch white X bull’s eye. When I placed the front sight post on the white x, my shots would hit at the 6 o’clock position at the bottom of the red circle, when I placed sight post dot at the 12 o’clock position at the top of the red circle, I would hit the white X circle.
Am I correct on that the sight picture was off by 1”? And two, can the sight post be corrected or adjusted to place the shot where sighted to impact point?
Of the 300 rounds fired, on five targets, about 30 where outside the center red ring. The others were either touching the red, in, or through previous large holes. I attributed this to the stiff trigger pull.

[Team Sergeant]

I'd have to see you shoot in order to know whats going on.;)

Like I said, I'll be in NYC in a few months, or you're more than welcome to come out to Phoenix for some free lessons....;)


Team Sergeant