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M4Guru
04-12-2006, 14:02
Found on another forum...

http://iran.theatlantic.com/interactive_article_page_1.html

This is a preview of Mark Bowden's (Blackhawk Down) new book, Guests of the Ayatollah. It is the story of the operation to save the US hostages in Tehran and the disaster at Desert One.

It is due to be released on April 24, I believe. The videos of the operators sharing their memories of the operation are really interesting, I hope you guys enjoy this.

The Reaper
04-12-2006, 14:08
Read the posted version already.

Some mistakes and inaccuracies, but overall, a decent tribute.

Makes you wonder, if we had made it in, taken our people back by force, and punished those responsible, would the current radical Islamofascist movement be where it is?

Anyone remember where the Ayatollah Khomeni (IMO, the father of this movement) was being given refuge before he went back to Iran?

TR

ghuinness
04-12-2006, 14:23
Anyone remember where the Ayatollah Khomeni (IMO, the father of this movement) was being given refuge before he went back to Iran?

TR

Not sure ..... wasn't he in France?

Pat
04-12-2006, 15:31
Correct. He first went to Turkey, then Iraq, then found a temporary home in France before returning to Iran.

Solid
04-13-2006, 10:45
The most recent Atlantic Monthly has a Bowden article on Eagle Claw, either a chapter from or synopsis of this book.

It was an interesting read, but I cannot vouch for its accuracy. There was also an interesting (if short piece) on the Ghurkas by Kaplan. I personally feel that Kaplan has a deep and unhealthy obsession with the idea of old-style Imperial COIN doctrine, but it is still fascinating material.

Solid

PS: In defense of the French, Wikipedia states: "According to Alexandre de Marenches (then head of the French secret services), France suggested to the Shah that they could "arrange for Khomeini to have a fatal accident"; the Shah declined the assassination offer, arguing that this would make him a martyr."

Pat
04-13-2006, 14:04
I saw that on Wikipedia also. It took a few minutes then I started to ask myself, "Why would the French let someone, who they offered to assassinate, stay in country?"

Razor
04-13-2006, 15:42
Consider the source of information available on Wikipedia.

eva05
04-26-2006, 09:13
And it's gripping.

Right off the bat Bowden sets the stage, talking about the players from the Iranian side, then dives right into the take over of the embassy.

Bowden's writing is sharp and puts you in the moment. By the time I finished the first 70 pages, I realized that the train I was on had not only got to my station in NY but turned around and headed back towards NJ!

Best non-fiction book of 06 to date.

j

Monsoon65
04-27-2006, 17:41
I just read some reviews of this book and it looks pretty good. I've been in several Introduction to Special Operations Courses and they usually do a briefing of Eagle Claw by someone who was actually there. They always pack the house on that day!

Warrior-Mentor
05-06-2006, 17:44
Am reading now....ADD kicked in, so I read the first 100 pages, then skipped to the execution phase of Eagle Claw.

The question I have is, has Jimmy Carter or Kissinger or Rockefeller ever admitted that they might have made a mistake by letting the Shah into the US for medical treatment? What would have happened if Pres Carter had not let him into the US (the 'tipping point' for the students cause to assault the embassy)?

Alchemist
05-06-2006, 19:39
Warrior-Mentor:

has Jimmy Carter or Kissinger or Rockefeller ever admitted that they might have made a mistake by letting the Shah into the US for medical treatment? What would have happened if Pres Carter had not let him into the US (the 'tipping point' for the students cause to assault the embassy)?

Interesting question, sir, but I submit that if they hadn't had that grievance they'd have found another. Our embassy was an island of the Great Satan, at a time when revolutionary fervor was running very high. Don't you think--given that they dared to do it for any reason--that they'd have attacked it sooner or later anyway?

Team Sergeant
05-06-2006, 19:43
Warrior-Mentor:

Don't you think--given that they dared to do it for any reason--that they'd have attacked it sooner or later anyway?

I agree, it was not the tipping point, they would have stormed the embassy for any reason..... They just wanted a reason, any reason, to capture or kill Americans.

JMI
05-19-2006, 15:56
Making a toast with the shah wasn't the smartest thing Carter could have done either.

About 100 pages in, and being a history buff I dig the book.

I remember being in the 4th grade in St. Stephens elementary school. I punched a hole in our classroom globe right where Iran was located. Got suspended for it, but I'll never forgot how mad I was when I was little. Must have been all those evenings hearing my Father bitch at the evening news.

C46thVA
05-19-2006, 17:56
I remember being in the 4th grade in St. Stephens elementary school. I punched a hole in our classroom globe right where Iran was located. Got suspended for it, but I'll never forgot how mad I was when I was little. Must have been all those evenings hearing my Father bitch at the evening news.

I will never forget that awful morning as we rode the bus to school. The radio was on and they broke in with news of the tragedy at Desert One. Becuase of my Dad I was pretty tuned in to world events even as a young lad. What a sh**ty day.
JW

JMI
05-24-2006, 21:58
225+ pages in and I love how the Marine contingent is what you'd expect - besides that Subic character - a bunch of hard ass mother's who don't take crap off the "students." Best part of the book so far, IMO..

What I never knew as a kid was the danger to Iran (and the US) that the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan actually had during the hostage takeover, both to our interests in the Middle East, and to Iran's western oil fields. Seems the USSR had an opportunity they were afraid to follow through on, for fear of the US and its might!

I hark back to those days when people feared us, and I gather they will if they push enough.

Roguish Lawyer
01-13-2007, 03:18
I am more than half-way through. If you liked Killing Pablo and Black Hawk Down, you'll like this one too. Same narrative style. Lots of focus on the hostages and their treatment -- Eagle Claw is not the focus at all.

The book reminds me how much I hate those fucking people. We still owe them a big one.

Roguish Lawyer
01-16-2007, 23:28
I finished it. I need to find Michael Metrinko and buy him a drink. Easily my favorite hostage.

Sionnach
01-17-2007, 15:28
I finished it. I need to find Michael Metrinko and buy him a drink. Easily my favorite hostage.

Because of you RL, I did a search on Mr. Metrinko, and found an excerpt which I believe is from a WSJ review of the book and found the following quote about Jim Limbert--another hostage.

Mr. Limbert has no idea regarding the whereabouts of his compatriots until an Iranian guard, whom he is tutoring in English, asks him the meaning of the words "raghead," "bozo," "mother-" and "c-sucker." "Limbert laughed," Mr. Bowden writes. "It warmed his heart. Someplace nearby, his captors were still coping with the United States Marine Corps."

I laughed out loud and managed to spit water on my keyboard. Hoo-rah, Marines!

I'm going to try to find this book tonight.

Irish_Army01
01-17-2007, 17:14
Was gonna get it this week,after i finish reading the books Im on right now,Highway to hell by John Geddes and Bloody Hero's by Damien Lewis..I'm looking forward to reading this book now.

Sionnach
01-27-2007, 08:22
This book is an excellent read. I'm not a Carter fan, but Bowden gave a fair account of events, and, although I still disagree with Carter's handling, the book helped me understand a little of Carter's thought process. That being said, he was still wronger than two boys caught naked in the woods with the chaplain's assistant.

Metrinko, the Marines, and SFC Hohman deserve a round.

VA Pete
02-25-2010, 11:43
Finally got around to reading this. It's a great book; I appreciate Mr. Bowden's writing style, he's incredibly thorough and attempts to talk to as many of the participants on both sides as he can, but he lets the background information unfold over time to keep the pace of the book moving. The book is not as compelling as Black Hawk Down, which I literally did not put down from the time I opened the cover until the time I finished it, but I'm sure it's due to the nature of the scenario, which unfolds over a much longer period of time.

I was born in the early seventies, so I only have the vaguest personal memories of the events; having said that, some comments:

Good, if brief, historical perspective on our interests in the region at the time with respect to the Soviets and missile testing.
Very surprised that the CIA station chief gave up some agents, who were then executed.
As mentioned above, the Marines tormenting the guards...there is a whole chapter dedicated to that and while reading it my wife had to kick me out of the room while the Olympics were on because I was laughing so loudly.
Call me naive, but I was a little surprised at just how uninformed the students were. Through my other readings on the region, belief in grand conspiracies seems to be part of the culture, by the end of the book, a former prime minister (I think?) is accusing the CIA of being behind the embassy takeover.
I also wonder if Iran would have been fighting a proxy war against us for the last 30 years had our response been different. I've read some other books that go into some detail on Eagle Claw and it breaks my heart every time.

The most poignant quote from the book, IMO, comes as the hostages are being released and interviewed on film by the female translator. One of the State Department officials says to her, in response to asking what he had learned from his experience: "One of the things I didn't learn was what you were trying to accomplish. You were the first social revolution in history that didn't have to compromise from the very first moment for lack of money...Anything was possible because you had the money, and you threw that away...All I've got to say is that nothing we could have done to you in our wildest dreams is half as bad as what you've done to yourselves. Your children and grandchildren are going to curse your name."